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Is most of K9 Ultimate just bloat for the producer who doesn't do any scoring?

VST, AU, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion

Moderator: Moderators (Main)

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KVRian
 
644 posts since 27 Dec, 2011, from Seattle,WA, USA
    

Postby KevWestBeats; Tue Dec 03, 2013 12:01 pm

tdm71 wrote:
KevWestBeats wrote:
tdm71 wrote:Ok... thanks guys. As an owner of K2, the ultimate is only a difference of 250 from the regular. BTW: how are the drum packs in the ultimate compared to the sound quality of say Slate or AD? I never hear them mentioned.
If you are in the US Guitar Center is giving up K9U updates for $200. Its a bitch to find one but there you have it


Aren't those upgrades for 9 to 9u or 8u to 9u? I'm just a k2 owner... I'd love it if that was the case.

Btw: Thanks guys for all the feedback. Really doesn't make sense to not get ultimate
not sure
http://www.KevWestBeats.com
http://www.YouTube.com/KevWest
https://soundcloud.com/kevwestbeats/end-of-july-final
Maschine MK 2, Komplete 9, IK T-Racks, Addictive Drums, Addictive Keys, Omnisphere.
KVRist
 
202 posts since 22 Dec, 2009

Postby frankz00; Tue Dec 03, 2013 12:57 pm

KevWestBeats wrote:
tdm71 wrote:Ok... thanks guys. As an owner of K2, the ultimate is only a difference of 250 from the regular. BTW: how are the drum packs in the ultimate compared to the sound quality of say Slate or AD? I never hear them mentioned.
If you are in the US Guitar Center is giving up K9U updates for $200. Its a bitch to find one but there you have it


I saw it in my local GC after being backordered on the site. I wish I looked there first... Hopefully it'll ship soon...
KVRist
 
209 posts since 8 Apr, 2012, from Vienna

Postby Arrested Developer; Tue Dec 03, 2013 1:03 pm

tdm71 wrote: I see K9U as a scoring movies/video game composers dream


Tools like NI Action Strings are rather for people who dream of being score composers...
triggering worn out generic phrases is not "composing". :wink:
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KVRian
 
644 posts since 27 Dec, 2011, from Seattle,WA, USA
    

Postby KevWestBeats; Tue Dec 03, 2013 2:14 pm

frankz00 wrote:
KevWestBeats wrote:
tdm71 wrote:Ok... thanks guys. As an owner of K2, the ultimate is only a difference of 250 from the regular. BTW: how are the drum packs in the ultimate compared to the sound quality of say Slate or AD? I never hear them mentioned.
If you are in the US Guitar Center is giving up K9U updates for $200. Its a bitch to find one but there you have it


I saw it in my local GC after being backordered on the site. I wish I looked there first... Hopefully it'll ship soon...
If they are out can't you buy it for the sale price and then ship it to you from a warehouse or something? I wish they would just honor it with the retail versions that they have in abundance. Bastards!
http://www.KevWestBeats.com
http://www.YouTube.com/KevWest
https://soundcloud.com/kevwestbeats/end-of-july-final
Maschine MK 2, Komplete 9, IK T-Racks, Addictive Drums, Addictive Keys, Omnisphere.
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KVRAF
 
9025 posts since 6 Jan, 2009, from Croatia

Postby EvilDragon; Tue Dec 03, 2013 2:50 pm

Arrested Developer wrote:
tdm71 wrote: I see K9U as a scoring movies/video game composers dream


Tools like NI Action Strings are rather for people who dream of being score composers...
triggering worn out generic phrases is not "composing". :wink:


Except you can use Action Strings in more ways than just "triggering worn out generic phrases", since you can change patterns on the fly and even create different rhythms based on some very basic rhytmical patterns. Which is basically what composing really is - shifting rhytms and melodies about.

AS is a great product, very underestimated.
KVRAF
 
2288 posts since 28 Apr, 2013

Postby BBFG#; Tue Dec 03, 2013 7:25 pm

EvilDragon wrote:
Except you can use Action Strings in more ways than just "triggering worn out generic phrases", since you can change patterns on the fly and even create different rhythms based on some very basic rhytmical patterns. Which is basically what composing really is - shifting rhytms and melodies about.
AS is a great product, very underestimated.


Tricks in triggering is a good way to put it. What it does specifically is suppose to recreate the meticulous playing required in certain classical idioms (and therefore, lending also to cinematic passages). Since it is idiomatic of all the great classical composers, its effect cannot be underestimated. However, it is somewhat specialized and as you say, you have to trick the keying to get more out of it. I've found if I slow the repetitions down to their slowest, I can play within those parameters and get a more natural playing style (including purposely imprecise timings) but where it gets tricky is in how the attacks of the strings are also changed by that trick and it's also very unforgiving in doing certain articulations. I don't think I underestimate it and I equally don't overestimate it either. What it does, it does okay, but it can be less effective in doing certain things. The shame is that the samples themselves are often better than what I find in Session Strings.

On another note: I haven't found anything I can use in the George Duke loops.
KVRAF
 
2911 posts since 18 Oct, 2004
 

Postby Arglebargle; Tue Dec 03, 2013 8:36 pm

Komplete is mostly bloat for the vast majority of users.
KVRist
 
328 posts since 30 Jul, 2013
 

Postby bigcat1969; Tue Dec 03, 2013 8:46 pm

Its like a kid (or me) on Christmas refusing the gigantic box of toys as containing too many toys he's not sure he can use and choosing to stick with just one or two. I want all the toys, gimme, gimme, gimme. Even Soul Treasures so if I have to give one of my toys away to a needy musician I can give them that one.
KVRAF
 
3429 posts since 12 May, 2008

Postby Echoes in the Attic; Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:31 pm

I don't think most of it is aimed at scoring. Sure there is session strings pro and action strings. And then some stuff that could be equally useful in cinematic uses as electronic music like the heavyocity stuff. But most of the "bloat" is band type instruments - lots of drums of the 60s, 70s, 80s, and modern and even earlier periods. Then lots of different basses, keyboards, pianos etc. Then a ton of mixing effects and the usual whack of synths and electronic oriented stuff. So no I don't think it's mainly for scoring people.
This is a block of text that can be added to posts you make. There is a 255 character limit. Once I have something clever, I will certainly fill it in.
KVRist
 
69 posts since 13 Dec, 2000, from San Francisco, CA, USA
 

Postby bioroid; Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:17 pm

tdm71 wrote:
KevWestBeats wrote:
tdm71 wrote:Ok... thanks guys. As an owner of K2, the ultimate is only a difference of 250 from the regular. BTW: how are the drum packs in the ultimate compared to the sound quality of say Slate or AD? I never hear them mentioned.
If you are in the US Guitar Center is giving up K9U updates for $200. Its a bitch to find one but there you have it


Aren't those upgrades for 9 to 9u or 8u to 9u? I'm just a k2 owner... I'd love it if that was the case.

Btw: Thanks guys for all the feedback. Really doesn't make sense to not get ultimate


http://www.guitarcenter.com/Search/Defa ... komplete+9

Search the Guitar Center site for "Komplete 9" and you can see all the diff upgrade versions. Read the descriptions to see what you can upgrade from.
User avatar
KVRian
 
644 posts since 27 Dec, 2011, from Seattle,WA, USA
    

Postby KevWestBeats; Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:38 pm

bioroid wrote:
tdm71 wrote:
KevWestBeats wrote:
tdm71 wrote:Ok... thanks guys. As an owner of K2, the ultimate is only a difference of 250 from the regular. BTW: how are the drum packs in the ultimate compared to the sound quality of say Slate or AD? I never hear them mentioned.
If you are in the US Guitar Center is giving up K9U updates for $200. Its a bitch to find one but there you have it


Aren't those upgrades for 9 to 9u or 8u to 9u? I'm just a k2 owner... I'd love it if that was the case.

Btw: Thanks guys for all the feedback. Really doesn't make sense to not get ultimate


http://www.guitarcenter.com/Search/Defa ... komplete+9

Search the Guitar Center site for "Komplete 9" and you can see all the diff upgrade versions. Read the descriptions to see what you can upgrade from.
That's good and fine but I just passed on a potential lead its on him to research it to make sure its perfect for him.
http://www.KevWestBeats.com
http://www.YouTube.com/KevWest
https://soundcloud.com/kevwestbeats/end-of-july-final
Maschine MK 2, Komplete 9, IK T-Racks, Addictive Drums, Addictive Keys, Omnisphere.
KVRAF
 
7190 posts since 3 Feb, 2003, from Finland, Espoo

Postby bmanic; Tue Dec 03, 2013 11:59 pm

Am I the only one who basically got K9U instead of K9 mainly because I HATE INSTALLING FROM FRIGGIN DVD DISCS!!?. :D

Seriously, the K5 + K6 install already takes way over 3 hours to do so I figured that K9 would take ridiculously long to install from discs. Well yeah, being an USB 2 HD in K9U and shifting 240GB of material will still take a lot of time but I wager it's still faster than K9 from the discs.

Wish they'd have upgraded the K9U HD to USB3 specs by now. Sigh..

Cheers!
bManic
"Remember the iLokalypse June 10 - June 22 2013 - Dominus"
KVRist
 
209 posts since 8 Apr, 2012, from Vienna

Postby Arrested Developer; Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:11 am

EvilDragon wrote: Which is basically what composing really is - shifting rhytms and melodies about.


In the traditional sense composing is: having an idea (a creative vision) and realizing it.
I absolutely doubt that you can "put together" e.g. the string part of a Bruckner symphony or Strawinsky's Sacre with the Action Strings.
Anyhow, i don't disagree with you as far as in practise composing often is rather a "shifting rhythms and melodies", specially when there is no time for having a real idea...
Then again: If the variability of prearranged building blocks suits your needs, is depending of your workflow & style.
KVRAF
 
2288 posts since 28 Apr, 2013

Postby BBFG#; Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:16 am

bmanic wrote:Am I the only one who basically got K9U instead of K9 mainly because I HATE INSTALLING FROM FRIGGIN DVD DISCS!!?. :D

Seriously, the K5 + K6 install already takes way over 3 hours to do so I figured that K9 would take ridiculously long to install from discs. Well yeah, being an USB 2 HD in K9U and shifting 240GB of material will still take a lot of time but I wager it's still faster than K9 from the discs.

Wish they'd have upgraded the K9U HD to USB3 specs by now. Sigh..

Cheers!
bManic


I do think that should be considered, but how is a newbie to Native suppose to know?

K9 was only a couple of hours though, but since you're sitting right there ready to load the new disk, it seems a lot longer. The other thing is, most of us doing it for the first time tend to load everything, which isn't mandatory.

I do agree, knowing what I know now, I would've just bought K9U to begin with and saved the babysit the dvd drive time. The hard drive basically takes a half hour or less to go through and set what you want to load and where, push install and come back a couple of hours later to finish off the Service Center authorizations and updates.

But because you don't have to watch and wait for it, it seems like a shorter time.
KVRian
 
1355 posts since 15 Oct, 2008, from Germany

Postby paterpeter; Wed Dec 04, 2013 12:16 am

The USB drive is fine. Just start the installation and wait for it to finish. Much easier than swapping discs. Tbh, installing all the 30+ updates one by one from the service center afterwards is much more work.
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