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Reason fanboy's thread

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion

Moderator: Moderators (Main)

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KVRAF
 
1790 posts since 25 Jan, 2009

Postby IncarnateX; Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:43 am

headquest wrote:+ A superior sampler. So far as I know Kontakt, HaLion and Mach Five haven't been ported to RE yet (will they ever I wonder, given the rumoured poor sales of RE?) so Reason users are left with the 12-year-old NN-XT ... STILL. And no decent orchestral samples, etc. For a lot of musicians that is a deal breaker.

+ Video support is a must for most semi-serious musicians these days, and is regarded as a pretty basic feature that even freebie and inexpensive starter DAW packages usually include (Cakewalk, Reaper, Magix, Mixcraft, etc) although I accept YMMV.

+ Input/output File formats, uploading to the internet/SoundCloud, etc

+ Professional audio editing

+ PDC, Freeze, etc etc.



At least you have omitted the midi out thing from your list. :D

Nice to hear from you again Headquest and I see you are still working on your Reason trauma. I am glad if my posts can be of any help for you to achieve catharsis in this regard some day.
KVRAF
 
7475 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
 

Postby headquest; Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:51 am

IncarnateX wrote:
headquest wrote:+ A superior sampler. So far as I know Kontakt, HaLion and Mach Five haven't been ported to RE yet (will they ever I wonder, given the rumoured poor sales of RE?) so Reason users are left with the 12-year-old NN-XT ... STILL. And no decent orchestral samples, etc. For a lot of musicians that is a deal breaker.

+ Video support is a must for most semi-serious musicians these days, and is regarded as a pretty basic feature that even freebie and inexpensive starter DAW packages usually include (Cakewalk, Reaper, Magix, Mixcraft, etc) although I accept YMMV.

+ Input/output File formats, uploading to the internet/SoundCloud, etc

+ Professional audio editing

+ PDC, Freeze, etc etc.



At least you have ommitted the midi out thing from your list. :D

Nice to hear from you again Headquest and I see you are still working on your Reason trauma. I am glad if my posts can be of any help for you to achieve catharsis in this regard some day.


:lol: Nah... I am well over it mate ;-)

But this thread from way back popped up in an email notification, and there's no harm in helping out with an answer to your interesting question.

To be honest though doesn't this thread really belong on the Propellerhead forum? Assuming you're not just here for an argument? The PUF is definitely the place for a "Reason fanboy" thread as you've called it ;-)
User avatar
KVRAF
 
1790 posts since 25 Jan, 2009

Postby IncarnateX; Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:55 am

headquest wrote:To be honest though doesn't this thread really belong on the Propellerhead forum? I think you will find people there who think your way Assuming you're not just here for an argument? The PUF is definitely the place for a "Reason fanboy" thread as you've called it mate;-)


:-o Where have you been lately? Didn't you know that the PUF has been down for some time now and the Reason fans are all over KVR?

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... highlight=

You have some cathing up to do, my friend. Good luck :wink:
KVRian
 
1437 posts since 28 Jul, 2003

Postby Ben H; Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:55 am

IncarnateX wrote:
Ben H wrote:Poor misguided Reason fanboy's, holding to their "stability" argument. :(


"fanboy's" (what?) or just fanboys?


"fanboy's" since it is a plural? I'm not sure? I just went by the spelling in the thread title.


IncarnateX wrote:since I have not put any stability argument forward, maybe you should quote a post in this thread where it is if you will like to make sense.


You haven't... but several others have.

I'm not going to bother going through the whole thread to prove my point... but here are a few examples:

elwoodblues1969 wrote:What I like most about Reason, is the stability of an all inclusive, closed systems that provides rock solid stability and the effortless installation of the RE's and the quality of modules


re8 wrote:That is one of the things I love & respect about Reason; rock-solid stability, unlike another DAW & VST builder I've been using.


headquest wrote:Sure I could replace the Reason instruments with VSTs, which would probably be easier in some respects than rewiring Reason, but more expensive for sure, and potentially less stable...


saturdaysaint wrote:3. Stability. Not sexy, but it still matters and Reason is still unparalleled here.


This was also posted in a recent Alchemy thread:

ambientium wrote:We do spam Props constantly with the request for VSTs for years, but everybody knows very well that Props will never ever implement VST even if every single user of Reason knocks their door and says "VST, please". They protect their (imho excellent) business model and keep Reason's stability...


But all Reason users I talk to, chant the same mantra... It's like they've all been brainwashed into accepting whatever props says is gospel.

NEWSFLASH: Reason IS NOT inherently more stable than other DAWs or VST hosts. And VSTs are not inherently unstable.

Sorry, I just feel sorry for you all that you just blindly accept it as fact. :(
Last edited by Ben H on Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:05 am, edited 3 times in total.
My main tools: Alchemy, Iris, Kontakt, Omnisphere, Padshop Pro, SWAM and WIVI.
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KVRian
 
1459 posts since 14 Mar, 2002, from Seattle, WA - USA
 

Postby Tronam; Thu Dec 12, 2013 1:56 am

IncarnateX wrote:
Tronam wrote:
IncarnateX wrote:
headquest wrote:Well if this was true a lot of people would have switched. The fact they haven't tells its own story, surely?

Yup. Ignorance.

Err. What?


Either that of the people of haven't switched or mine. Choose the interpretation that fits you.

I have no knowledge of people's individual software ignorance, so that's wasted speculation for me, but I have found them to be creatures of habit. This is probably the biggest reason of all why people don't casually switch to new DAWs after having invested considerable amounts of time learning these complex pieces of software. Once a program like these become unconsciously intuitive, switching can be a massive disruption in productivity. It might seem ludicrous to KVR software junkies like ourselves, but why in the heck is Daniel Kandi *still* using Reason 3... even now? The only explanation I can think of is familiarity and a totally instinctive workflow. I'd never want to foist my daw of choice upon someone else who's already found a workflow that makes sense to them. Thankfully there's more diversity in this industry now than ever before, so there's a comfortable home for almost anyone. :)
User avatar
KVRAF
 
1790 posts since 25 Jan, 2009

Postby IncarnateX; Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:09 am

Ben H wrote:Sorry, I just feel sorry for you all that you just blindly accept it as fact. :(


Well thanks for your concern, but even if your right about the stability thing (to which I fortunately still would be the exception to the rule because I haven't experienced a crash ever), why would you feel sorry for people deluding themselves if this makes them happy and has no negative consequences for anybody else?

The real paradox here is actually forwarded by people who do not like or use Reason but nevertheless come to fan threads like this to argue about it. If this makes YOU happy, I do not pity you but I do think it is kind of awkward, masochistic and self-contradictory. Well: to each, his own. :shrug:
User avatar
KVRAF
 
1790 posts since 25 Jan, 2009

Postby IncarnateX; Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:12 am

Tronam wrote:I'd never want to foist my daw of choice upon someone else who's already found a workflow that makes sense to them.


Well in a thread like this, I think you would be better of to consider such statements as metaphors that express a deep love and devotion for the software in question. Love ain't necessarily rational. Must of us should know, shouldn't we?
User avatar
KVRian
 
1459 posts since 14 Mar, 2002, from Seattle, WA - USA
 

Postby Tronam; Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:17 am

Ben H wrote:NEWSFLASH: Reason IS NOT inherently more stable than other DAWs or VST hosts.

Sorry, I just feel sorry for you all that you just blindly accept it as fact. :(

Really? I can only speak from personal experience, but I've produced song projects in Reason, Ableton Live 6-9, Logic 7-X, Renoise and Cubase over the years on both Windows and OSX(PPC and Intel). Reason is the only program that has never crashed on any platform. And I mean never. The others have gone through cycles of higher and lower stability from version to version. :shrug:
KVRAF
 
7475 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
 

Postby headquest; Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:18 am

IncarnateX wrote:
headquest wrote:To be honest though doesn't this thread really belong on the Propellerhead forum? I think you will find people there who think your way Assuming you're not just here for an argument? The PUF is definitely the place for a "Reason fanboy" thread as you've called it mate;-)


:-o Where have you been lately? Didn't you know that the PUF has been down for some time now and the Reason fans are all over KVR?

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... highlight=

You have some cathing up to do, my friend. Good luck :wink:


Oh my! Has their forum become unstable?? ;-)

You're right - I'm hardly ever on kvr or other forums these days because my professional music work is taking up seven days a week, not forgetting the need to spend time with family, friends, etc. So I wasn't aware. It was only the email notification that brought me here at all.

Also though, I have a stable effective gear setup that I haven't needed or wanted to change in a while, so talking about gear stuff isn't really of such interest at the moment. In that sense, no need or interest in catching up TBH, but none-the-less it's actually a shame to hear that the PUF is no more... used to be a useful forum once upon a time :-)

Peace, and happy music making ;-)
KVRAF
 
7475 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
 

Postby headquest; Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:20 am

Tronam wrote:
Ben H wrote:NEWSFLASH: Reason IS NOT inherently more stable than other DAWs or VST hosts.

Sorry, I just feel sorry for you all that you just blindly accept it as fact. :(

Really? I can only speak from personal experience, but I've produced song projects in Reason, Ableton Live 6-9, Logic 7-X, Renoise and Cubase over the years on both Windows and OSX(PPC and Intel). Reason is the only program that has never crashed on any platform. And I mean never. The others have gone through cycles of higher and lower stability from version to version. :shrug:


I've used a variety too, and the Reason crashes were by far the worst, because they have no recovery system built in. Cubase was also disappointing... Ableton has occasionally crashed, but always saves and recovers at least. I've found it by far the most stable of those three (and Reason the least stable... but that's on my system).
User avatar
KVRian
 
1459 posts since 14 Mar, 2002, from Seattle, WA - USA
 

Postby Tronam; Thu Dec 12, 2013 2:25 am

I've found Ableton Live (pre-L9) to be solid as a rock if I only use its internal instruments and effects. Fortunately they're quite good and this is easily doable.
User avatar
KVRAF
 
1790 posts since 25 Jan, 2009

Postby IncarnateX; Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:19 am

headquest wrote:Oh my! Has their forum become unstable?? ;-);-)


"Clever" :) But taken at face value:

1. Do you "really" think anyone has ever bought Reason due to rumors about the stability of their forum?

2. Do you really think anyone has ever bought Reason due to rumors about it's stability only?


headquest wrote:Peace, and happy music making ;-)


Same to you :D


PS: You do know that you can disable the automatic mails appearing when someone posts in this thread, don't you?
KVRAF
 
7475 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
 

Postby headquest; Thu Dec 12, 2013 3:42 am

IncarnateX wrote:1. Do you "really" think anyone has ever bought Reason due to rumors about the stability of their forum?

2. Do you really think anyone has ever bought Reason due to rumors about it's stability only?


1. Of course not, but having an active and constructive user forum is definitely a good bonus :-)

2. Certainly - when I bought it a decade ago it was a strong incentive to go down the Reason route. But much has changed since then, and I don't think Reason has the same edge in terms of stability, however much PH continue to rely on their former success in that area.

PS: You do know that you can disable the automatic mails appearing when someone posts in this thread, don't you?


Sure - but having been summoned back I'm having such fun! I've not consciously stopped visiting kvr, just been very busy with other more important stuff.
User avatar
KVRAF
 
1790 posts since 25 Jan, 2009

Postby IncarnateX; Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:08 am

headquest wrote: 2. Certainly - when I bought it a decade ago it was a strong incentive to go down the Reason route.


Really? Have the crashes of other DAWS really been so bad a decade ago that some actually would buy Reason solely for that?

A decade ago I wouldn't even have considered it a DAW in the first place but a self-contained softsynth studio so I must say I am baffled.

The low cpu use would have been a better one-reason-only for me a decade ago.

However, you are the experienced and injured ex-lover, not me, so I guess I have to take your word for it :D
KVRAF
 
7475 posts since 6 Jul, 2004
 

Postby headquest; Thu Dec 12, 2013 4:17 am

IncarnateX wrote: Really? Have the crashes of other DAWS really been so bad a decade ago that some actually would buy Reason solely for that?


Not "solely" in my case, no. I used it via rewire, which in those days made perfect sense (these days I really don't think it does!). But the stability of Reason, its low CPU, and the quality of its devices next to VST alternatives made it compelling for me ... at that time.

A decade ago I wouldn't even have considered it a DAW in the first place but a self-contained softsynth studio so I must say I am baffled.


That's exactly how I considered it too. No need to be confused - I am saying that a DAW + Reason was a decade ago a better option for me than a DAW + various VSTs. It was more stable and efficient. Those were indeed its top selling points for me.

I never wanted PH to try turning into a DAW, and I personally don't think they have made a good job of it (there are several DAWs I would rather use). I wish they had instead built on the strengths Reason used to have a s soft-synth workstation. I reckon it would still be at the top of the pile in that respect if they had focussed on adding better synths, samplers, etc and stuck to their original vision.
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