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NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

How to do this, that and the other. Share, learn, teach. How did X do that? How can I sound like Y?

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Mickey21
KVRist
 
66 posts since 13 Mar, 2013, from Denmark

Postby Mickey21; Wed Jan 22, 2014 4:00 am NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

Hey people...

I have this track that ive made.. IT sounds great at my KRK.. and in my headphones..

BUT.. When i take the track down into my car.. And turn it UP.. It kinda sounds messy.. like the bass ruins the sounds and so on.. BUT.. keep in mind i have to turn it to MAX.. to have the same volume as mastered tracks..

MY question is... IS it.. actually cuz my track will sound messy when its mastered?.. Or is my stereo that doesnt like me when i turn it to the MAX volume.. Even tho its not "louder" than a mastered track.. like half up the volume?..


Mickey
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DJ Warmonger
KVRist
 
446 posts since 7 Jun, 2012, from Warsaw

Postby DJ Warmonger; Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:19 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

Car speakers are usually poor quality and mono, so they can ruin every mix that's not perfect in first place.

I think you got the volume and mastering wrong. An important part of mastering is maximizing the volume, which means the track reaches good loudness on regular volume settings.
Or to put things another way, the point of mastering is to make track sound as loud and clear as other comercial tracks. This way you don't need to overdrive the speakers, as the trac will be loud on its own.
http://djwarmonger.wordpress.com/
Tricky-Loops wrote: (...)someone like Armin van Buuren who claims to make a track in half an hour and all his songs sound somewhat boring(...)
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thecontrolcentre
KVRAF
 
16479 posts since 27 Jul, 2005, from the wilds of wanny

Postby thecontrolcentre; Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:23 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

You need to mix better if your track is half the volume of a mastered one. If the bass is too loud, then it will need to be reduced in volume to allow space for other frequencies. Hard to say for sure without hearing the track ...
Mickey21
KVRist
 
66 posts since 13 Mar, 2013, from Denmark

Postby Mickey21; Wed Jan 22, 2014 5:39 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

DJ warmonger.. As i said.. I HAVNT mastered the track :).. Its unmastered :)..

Basicly.. i got the entire track to "peak" at 0 db.. isnt that what it should?..

Thecontrolcentre.. u got a skype or anything.. id like to send it to you?.. maybe you can help me whats wrong..
manducator
KVRAF
 
1648 posts since 10 Feb, 2007

Postby manducator; Wed Jan 22, 2014 7:11 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

Can we have a downloadable wav of the track?
PurpleSunray
KVRist
 
101 posts since 13 Mar, 2012

Postby PurpleSunray; Thu Jan 23, 2014 7:47 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

Yeah, wav would be nice or at least some details what you mean with "messy".
The problem you describe usually comes from a freq-band having too much presence on the mix - the lower end in your case.
Car or HiFi systems in general usually have all kinds of little (and big) boosting, post processing, quality 'improvement' , ... features to sound fatter than the competitor.
It has some kind of bass-boost for sure, so if you feed it with a track where the lower end has too much presence and you add this boosting-magic on top you end up with messy sound as you run it into overdrive.
You don't hear this on your KRK because they are the opposite of your Car HiFi system, they try to not influence the sound at all, but to play your signals in a neutral fashion.

Try solving it like a mastering engineer would do: reduce gain on the lower end (via EQ or in the bassline lane directly). If you feel like the bass is getting too quiet, compress (keep gain at same level, but make it louder by reducing dynamics, will avoid your Car HiFi to overdrive).
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Cintronic
KVRist
 
388 posts since 24 Aug, 2004, from under the big oak tree

Postby Cintronic; Fri Jan 24, 2014 4:23 pm Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

I find my car to be a bit of a test. The car's system seems to boost frequencies from 400 -700hz which can make the bass sound boxy. As this doesn't happen in most commercial stuff i have a tweak to the mix after a listen in car to smooth out the bass until I am happy with it.
Mickey21
KVRist
 
66 posts since 13 Mar, 2013, from Denmark

Postby Mickey21; Sat Jan 25, 2014 4:48 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

And examply where i rly notice the problem in the car..

In my headphones and so on.. The "white noise" goes smooth in the drop..

But in my car.. The with noise is like.. "lagging" ?.. like a VERY quick sidechain.. Only at the drop where the bass goes.. :S
Mickey21
KVRist
 
66 posts since 13 Mar, 2013, from Denmark

Postby Mickey21; Sat Jan 25, 2014 4:56 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

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DJ Warmonger
KVRist
 
446 posts since 7 Jun, 2012, from Warsaw

Postby DJ Warmonger; Sat Jan 25, 2014 5:03 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

Okay... TT DR meter shows 14 dB, which would be nice for rock ballad, but certainly not for EDM. Compress the hell out of it. There is a lot of headroom left before you even encounter any problems.

That is, unless you want to send it to someone else to do the mastering for you. Then you can leave it like that.
I still prefer to work with hardlimited material to have an idea of how loud (or distorted) can it be when mastered. This helps you to diagnose problems which might be nonrepairable on mastering stage.
http://djwarmonger.wordpress.com/
Tricky-Loops wrote: (...)someone like Armin van Buuren who claims to make a track in half an hour and all his songs sound somewhat boring(...)
Mickey21
KVRist
 
66 posts since 13 Mar, 2013, from Denmark

Postby Mickey21; Sat Jan 25, 2014 5:59 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

Its going to a "pro" mastering service when its done.. so should i just leave it ? :)
Mickey21
KVRist
 
66 posts since 13 Mar, 2013, from Denmark

Postby Mickey21; Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:01 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

DJ Warmonger wrote:Okay... TT DR meter shows 14 dB, which would be nice for rock ballad, but certainly not for EDM. Compress the hell out of it. There is a lot of headroom left before you even encounter any problems.

That is, unless you want to send it to someone else to do the mastering for you. Then you can leave it like that.
I still prefer to work with hardlimited material to have an idea of how loud (or distorted) can it be when mastered. This helps you to diagnose problems which might be nonrepairable on mastering stage.



" And examply where i rly notice the problem in the car..

In my headphones and so on.. The "white noise" goes smooth in the drop..

But in my car.. The with noise is like.. "lagging" ?.. like a VERY quick sidechain.. Only at the drop where the bass goes.. :S "

Would this go away when its mastered?.. :)..
jancivil
KVRAF
 
9503 posts since 20 Oct, 2007

Postby jancivil; Sun Jan 26, 2014 8:47 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

DJ Warmonger wrote: the point of mastering is to make track sound as loud and clear as other comercial tracks.
The *point of* mastering can lie elsewhere, including taming an overly 'pre-mastered' track. There is no real reason the track can't be 'as loud and clear as _' through mixing.

Before ITB type of, digital, recording/production, 'mastering' meant preparing a thing for a certain medium. This notion that 'non-mastered' tracks need to be made loud through mastering is kind of new.
So, now a lot of people have 'maximized' bound up with 'mastered' going in. It's a misconception, that reduces the latter and confounds the two. And this, apparently, provides an excuse for a lot of people to abdicate responsibility for their mixing. Since 'clear and loud' is put off to be made to happen by a separate process, this belief is formed that this is where it must happen. No, that doesn't need to be true.
Keith99
KVRian
 
1063 posts since 15 Mar, 2007, from Yorkshire, England

Postby Keith99; Sun Jan 26, 2014 9:08 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

Listening in the car can really bring you down after thinking you have a great mix, happens to me all the time! Still it is really the art of mixing to get something to translate well on to other systems. Your audience is likely to listen to it on all sorts of rubbish systems.
PurpleSunray
KVRist
 
101 posts since 13 Mar, 2012

Postby PurpleSunray; Mon Jan 27, 2014 3:36 am Re: NOOB Question.. (Non mastered music in my car)

Keith99 wrote:Listening in the car can really bring you down after thinking you have a great mix, happens to me all the time! Still it is really the art of mixing to get something to translate well on to other systems. Your audience is likely to listen to it on all sorts of rubbish systems.

IMHO that's the job of the mastering engineer. I mean.. how can you optimize your mix for HiFi without having a studio and proper gear to 'simulate' all kinds of different playback systems? If you have all the gear there is no real point on buying professional mastering.. ask somewhere with experience to visit you for a day for the 4-ear check and that's it.
Mixing shall be as neutral as possible in my opinion, having a flat frequency distribution.
It shall sound good on a monitoring reference system; making it sound good on the 0.99$ wallmarkt headphones needs someone that 1) knows how 0.99$ wallmakrt headphones sound like and/or 2) has the headphones or gear to simulate it.
Doing those little boosts/reductions on certain bands to sound good on HiFi or even low-end system needs someone with experience IMHO. If you optimize your track to sound good on your discounter car-Hifi, it most likely sounds crap on the festival line-array (or could sound better)... that's why I give to a mastering studio, to make sure someone checks it to make it sound good on HiFi while sounding great on PA (or vice versa if you only release it for home usage, but don't play it live).
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