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Guitar Libraries/VSTs

Sampler and Sampling discussion (techniques, tips and tricks, etc.)

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KVRist
 
60 posts since 24 Oct, 2006

Postby echosystm; Sun Feb 02, 2014 4:39 pm Guitar Libraries/VSTs

Hi all

I'm looking to invest in a good guitar library for Kontakt. I've narrowed it down to the Vir2 and Orange Tree libraries, but I don't know which one to go with as I cannot demo them.

I am making pop and indie music, not heavy metal and so on. I don't need my guitar sounds to be 100% indistinguishable from the real thing, I just need it to be better than what the Kontakt default bank supplies. For example, I expect every patch to allow strumming, mutes, etc.

I've heard Electri6ity is very complicated and would be totally overwhelming for someone who has not played guitar before. I had guitar lessons for 6 months in high school, but I didn't really enjoy it, so I'm probably not much better than the average joe. Would this preclude me from being able to use Electri6ity?

Thanks
Last edited by echosystm on Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.
KVRAF
 
2643 posts since 28 Apr, 2013

Postby BBFG#; Sun Feb 02, 2014 5:50 pm Re: Vir2 Electri6ity vs. Orange Tree Evolution Electric

Wouldn't venture to guess your degree of ability, you may pick it up quicker than some or not as quick as others. I personally didn't care for the sound of OTS but each of us have our own tastes, so again, everyone can offer you an opinion here, but it means very little over all when it comes down what you like. The best at this point is to listen as much as you can to both.
I finally got to try Electri6ity at the show. Didn't seem as difficult as so many make it to me. Actually seemed fairly quick. However, I was slightly disappointed in the 'clean' samples of the Rickenbacker 6 string (which is my number one reason for wanting it - considering no one else does). It was good in the first three lower octaves of samples but started to have an abrupt change between the third to third and a half. I have the same problem with the Orange Tree samples plus the mic'ing is a little too hard on the OTS too for me. As much as I like amped guitar samples, I like a clean sample run through an amp-sim even better and when used this way, most clean guitar samples can be made to sound great as an amped guitar. I've been testing out different amp sims for the last week and found most of the Kontakt guitars to have too harsh of beginning attack to use this way. After much trial and error, what seemed good for this were both from the SampleTank Electric Guitar2 library. Simply turned off their effects and ran it through the different sims. Not all results were great, but I got more through them than I did the others. (What I used was a clean strat and a jazz gretsch). YMMV and what these threads bring are always a handful of people that will try to zero you in on a particular product to sell you. But this is something that it's best to only get some links or suggestions to guitar sites and then take it from there. It's too subjective to listen to personal tastes trying to make your tastes follow suit.

Btw, I often see Orange Tree guitars in the market place and have only seen Electri6ity a couple of times there. Not sure what that says about either one of them except getting Orange Tree cheaper might be just a matter of waiting a bit if you decide that's what you want to try.
KVRist
 
56 posts since 19 Oct, 2012

Postby SirKen; Mon Feb 03, 2014 12:15 pm Re: Vir2 Electri6ity vs. Orange Tree Evolution Electric

echosystm wrote:Hi all

I'm looking to invest in a good guitar library for Kontakt. I've narrowed it down to the Vir2 and Orange Tree libraries, but I don't know which one to go with as I cannot demo them.

I am making pop and indie music, not heavy metal and so on. I don't need my guitar sounds to be 100% indistinguishable from the real thing, I just need it to be better than what the Kontakt default bank supplies. For example, I expect every patch to allow strumming, mutes, etc.

I've heard Electri6ity is very complicated and would be totally overwhelming for someone who has not played guitar before. I had guitar lessons for 6 months in high school, but I didn't really enjoy it, so I'm probably not much better than the average joe. Would this preclude me from being able to use Electri6ity?

Thanks


I recently got OTS and I have to say that it is very bright. I also hate the squeal sounds. Luckily, I own Shreddage series if I want to do any "heavy" work.

Talking about ISW, have you checked Archtop? It has a fantastic tone.

http://impactsoundworks.com/products/gu ... ic-guitar/

Also, Do you have an amp sim software? The build effects in OTS are ok for certain applications. However, I would certainly look into getting some amp sim package like Guitar Rig or Amplitube.
KVRian
 
1274 posts since 14 Jun, 2006

Postby bill45; Mon Feb 03, 2014 12:54 pm Re: Vir2 Electri6ity vs. Orange Tree Evolution Electric

BBFG# is right Tone going into the amp sims is extremely important.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LtV6V62mk_Q
KVRist
 
60 posts since 24 Oct, 2006

Postby echosystm; Mon Feb 03, 2014 3:03 pm Re: Vir2 Electri6ity vs. Orange Tree Evolution Electric

Thanks for your replies everyone!

I have Guitar Rig already, so I'm ok on that side of things.

My number 1 priority is that it is easy to do articulations. I make cheesy pop music, often using 80s ROMplers, so having a super realistic guitar tone isn't essential. In fact, it could be a bad thing.

I managed to test out OTS last night and I couldn't work out how you go from chords to normal playing. It seems like once you're in chord mode, you're stuck there. It didn't seem very intuitive in general.

I'm actually wondering if something like Sugar Bytes Guitarist is better for me. Having a dedicated step sequencer like that makes a lot of sense, but perhaps the benefits are short lived once you get used to using key switches and so on.

http://www.sugar-bytes.de/content/products/Guitarist

What is Shreddage like for general non-metal use? The price is appealing and it seems to have a good following.
KVRist
 
202 posts since 29 May, 2006
 

Postby tcollins; Mon Feb 03, 2014 6:17 pm Re: Guitar Libraries/VSTs

You might check out our Torch Electric Guitar and StrumMaker IV Acoustic Guitar, both for Kontakt full version. They both have manual playing with articulations and automated strumming.
Thanks- TC

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pyy8l3U7PB4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyN6hrZ98XM
KVRAF
 
2643 posts since 28 Apr, 2013

Postby BBFG#; Mon Feb 03, 2014 7:14 pm Re: Guitar Libraries/VSTs

Except for the strum capabilities, you can get certain synths to create a nice 'guitar' patch that once you process through the amp sim can be very good. After much searching and trials, I decided to go as cheap as I can and wait for the one that doesn't yet seem to exist.
For strum, I'm using the AAS guitars, which have the same range limit I find in most, some of their clean guitars run nicely through the sims while others are not so good. Sampletank was cheap enough in a sale, so I've found a couple more there. And the one I'll probably buy next is the Indiginus as it has a clean positive attack and the price is reasonable. For me... OTS, Vir2, Pettinghouse, will have to introduce their next version at this point to warrant their full MRSP.

Btw, I think I saw someone selling their OTS evolution guitar in the market.
KVRist
 
183 posts since 9 Nov, 2012, from Colorado, USA

Postby MachineClaw; Mon Feb 03, 2014 7:32 pm Re: Guitar Libraries/VSTs

I have Vir2 Electrii6ity, OrangeTree libraries, 8Dio libraries

I have a Oxygen 49 key controller and what I found when I started with these libraries is that the keyswitches are layed out for 61 or 88 keyboards. So it's difficult to use them on small controller keyboards.

I got an 88 key controller and that makes all the libraries much easier to use and play with.

Electri6ity I didn't use much and found that I needed to use Guitar Rig 5 or IKM Amplitube a lot to get realistic sounding guitar parts.

I don't have Electric6ity installed at the moment - large HD space library and didn't use it much.

For the cost of Electric6ity you can get 2-3 other libraries out there.

I use 8Dio.com Songwriting Guitar and POST-apocalyptic guitar libraries the most.

Torch and Shreaddage are also good enough to get by libraries you might check out.
KVRist
 
60 posts since 24 Oct, 2006

Postby echosystm; Tue Feb 04, 2014 2:45 pm Re: Guitar Libraries/VSTs

Can any of these libraries do chord hits where say only 3 strings are strummed? This seems to be the biggest limitation with these libraries; they only have key switches for up and down on all 6 strings.
KVRAF
 
2643 posts since 28 Apr, 2013

Postby BBFG#; Tue Feb 04, 2014 2:55 pm Re: Guitar Libraries/VSTs

The ones I use and have tried play the same amount you play. Although, if it is not the same as a guitarist would play it, it does 'rearrange' what you play to make it like guitarists tend to play it. Maybe that makes a difference. I try to keep in the range to begin with, so not too many anomalies happen for me and when they do, I see what is happening on the fretboard and then change my keys so the anomalies disappear.
(Talking mainly about the AAS Strum guitars).
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KVRist
 
184 posts since 5 Jan, 2007

Postby b15fliptop; Tue Feb 04, 2014 3:08 pm Re: Guitar Libraries/VSTs

echosystm wrote:Can any of these libraries do chord hits where say only 3 strings are strummed? This seems to be the biggest limitation with these libraries; they only have key switches for up and down on all 6 strings.

Yes, they all have different ways of doing so, but they all do it. OTS has knobs (automatable) for the lowest and highest strings you want to strum, as does RealLPC. Electr6ity has a setting (also automatable) called Strum Range that does the same thing.
KVRist
 
60 posts since 24 Oct, 2006

Postby echosystm; Tue Feb 04, 2014 3:38 pm Re: Guitar Libraries/VSTs

Since you need to twiddle a knob every time the string range changes, I gather it's not really feasible to try and play a pattern of 16th notes like "6 3 3 3 6 3 3 3". Is that correct? So this is something you need to sequence by hand in MIDI?
User avatar
KVRist
 
184 posts since 5 Jan, 2007

Postby b15fliptop; Tue Feb 04, 2014 4:02 pm Re: Guitar Libraries/VSTs

Well, if you're doing it live there are a couple of things you can do. They all have keys that trigger each individual string, so you could play the chord, which would trigger all 6 strings, and then play the three strings that you want on the next three occurrences manually withy the keys for individual strings. Easier than it sounds. Also, most of them have a setting whereby velocity controls how many strings are played. E.g., playing the lowest velocity on downstrokes only triggers the lowest string, and full velocity triggers all of them, like playing a real guitar. On upstrokes, only the highest strings would trigger on low velocities. Hope that makes sense.
KVRist
 
60 posts since 24 Oct, 2006

Postby echosystm; Tue Feb 04, 2014 4:19 pm Re: Guitar Libraries/VSTs

Awesome! Finally got this figured out! Thank you so much for your help.

At $399, Electri6ity seems like pretty good value, considering how many different guitars you get. For $179, OTS only gives you one. Am I missing something?

How do Shreddage 2 and Archtop compare to OTS in terms of features? Can you do all the same strumming stuff, or are there limitations?
User avatar
KVRist
 
184 posts since 5 Jan, 2007

Postby b15fliptop; Tue Feb 04, 2014 4:52 pm Re: Guitar Libraries/VSTs

No problem! Shreddage and Archtop, to the best of my knowledge, considering that I haven't used them, don't do any chord recognition. In other words, on all of the other ones you can just play a regular keyboard triad, and the VI will translate that into a proper guitar chord voicing. If Shreddage and Archtop do that, it isn't mentioned anywhere on the website or YouTube videos, which would lead me to believe that they don't. OTS, Electri6ity, and RealLPC also have strum keys, so you would just hold a chord with one hand, and trigger up and downstrokes of the last chord played with the strum keys. OTS and RealLPC also have strum sequencers, so you can record a strum pattern or select a prerecorded one, and just hold the chords you want with one hand. Electri6ity doesn't do this, but it's easy enough to do with your DAW and the strum and single string keys.
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