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[Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

VST, AU, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion

Moderator: Moderators (Main)

KVRian
 
553 posts since 25 Jun, 2013

Postby HaganeSteel; Sat Oct 12, 2013 8:15 am

Jedinhopy wrote:What sample libraries was used in MediEvil 1 & 2?


Roland.

I have that harp and those strings in my XP-30.

Miroslav is what you use to get this sound these days.
KVRer
 
5 posts since 11 Feb, 2014

Postby Nisto; Tue Feb 11, 2014 3:42 pm Re: [Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

Bump!

First of all, thanks for all the info, HaganeSteel. You're.. very resourceful! I've found out about some of the gear these people used through various archived sites (profiles, interviews, etc.) but some were still unknown to me. Masami Ueda used a JV-2080 for sure - he had it specified in his profile on weapon.org back in 1998: http://web.archive.org/web/199802040631 ... index.html
In 2000 or late 1999 maybe, he changed the tone box to a Yamaha EX5R though, so maybe he (mostly) used that for RE3. I wouldn't really know if he kept using the JV-2080.

Secondly, I wanted to mention that I "run" a thread for documenting VGM samples over at VGMdb. It has grown quite a bit at this point, and it seems like more people are joining in on the hunt lately. Hopefully, if you guys know anything I/We don't, you can post what you've found? Or maybe just post corrections ('cause I know a lot may be wrong :D) Here's the link: http://vgmdb.net/forums/showthread.php?t=11231
There's another post in that thread which is kinda.. hardware-exclusive. I haven't included those in the index (first post) yet, but I intend to do so soon, in a revamp of it. Here's the link to that guy's post (I wonder if he's hiding in this thread, lol): http://vgmdb.net/forums/showpost.php?p= ... stcount=50

And thirdly, I just want to take the opportunity to ask if anyone here knows the source of any of the samples from the demos on this page: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/484 ... tml#list_1

It seems like the interest in VGM samples is greatly increasing these past couple of years. :D

Cheers.
User avatar
KVRian
 
779 posts since 16 Feb, 2010

Postby gamecat666; Wed Feb 12, 2014 1:13 am Re: [Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

cool thread :)

I didnt realise you could extract sounds from PSX discs (i thought they were generally all cd-audio), so im currently going through my collection and ripping them.
(i know its a legal grey area but its like extracting MODs on my amiga to have a listen to the instruments.)
:tu:

if anyone is doing the same i'd recommend a free utility called 'Doublekiller' to remove duplicate sounds of exactly the same filesize/CRC
[ MASCHINE MK1 & v2.0 | KOMPLETE8 | FLSTUDIO ]
R E T R O V I D E O G A M E M U S I C
KVRian
 
553 posts since 25 Jun, 2013

Postby HaganeSteel; Wed Feb 12, 2014 8:44 am Re: [Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

Nisto wrote:Bump!

First of all, thanks for all the info, HaganeSteel. You're.. very resourceful! I've found out about some of the gear these people used through various archived sites (profiles, interviews, etc.) but some were still unknown to me. Masami Ueda used a JV-2080 for sure - he had it specified in his profile on weapon.org back in 1998: http://web.archive.org/web/199802040631 ... index.html
In 2000 or late 1999 maybe, he changed the tone box to a Yamaha EX5R though, so maybe he (mostly) used that for RE3. I wouldn't really know if he kept using the JV-2080.

Secondly, I wanted to mention that I "run" a thread for documenting VGM samples over at VGMdb. It has grown quite a bit at this point, and it seems like more people are joining in on the hunt lately. Hopefully, if you guys know anything I/We don't, you can post what you've found? Or maybe just post corrections ('cause I know a lot may be wrong :D) Here's the link: http://vgmdb.net/forums/showthread.php?t=11231
There's another post in that thread which is kinda.. hardware-exclusive. I haven't included those in the index (first post) yet, but I intend to do so soon, in a revamp of it. Here's the link to that guy's post (I wonder if he's hiding in this thread, lol): http://vgmdb.net/forums/showpost.php?p= ... stcount=50

And thirdly, I just want to take the opportunity to ask if anyone here knows the source of any of the samples from the demos on this page: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/484 ... tml#list_1

It seems like the interest in VGM samples is greatly increasing these past couple of years. :D

Cheers.


Yo.

Thanks for the compliment. It's about time someone acknowledged me for my useless information. :hihi:

Okay, here's the thing. Your list has a lot of "drone" and "ambient" sounds listed. For the most part, it is almost impossible to tell where these originally came from just by ear. In a lot of cases, ambience and sound effects and stuff like that can come from anywhere, and you will never get the same exact sound. The exceptions to this are the Roland anvil hits, Korg's "lore" and the rest of their ilk.

You can tell who uses what synth by what presets or waveforms they use (for example, the Proteus 1 had a very distinct string sound), and if they're not using those characteristic waveforms - or worse, they're also using external effects hardware - then it becomes much more of a guessing game.

I'll go through your list, but your samples don't actually work for me, so I'll do what I can.

Resident Evil 0 Melting: Fairly sure that's a Roland piano, so I would assume the drone is Roland as well. It's a very nondescript sound in general, though. The piano sound was a common stock piano sound in the XP/XV/JVs. Here, it's drowned in reverb and the cutoff is turned down, but it's still the same crappy older Roland piano. Also, listen to the track "Centipede" and you will hear those marcato string sounds, as well as the horns, that are very characteristic Roland sounds. I can't find "Flash", but most, if not all, of this soundtrack is Roland. In the song "Encounter" when the drone begins to swell, that is a Roland bass string section.

It was Setsuo Yamamoto who used the Korg Wavestation a lot. He worked on Megaman X, X-Men Mutant Apocalypse, and Strider 2. He did not work on any Resident Evil titles at the time according to his discography.

Silent Hill (both of them) were never really known for using a specific synth. I'm not sure what squeaky noise you're referring to here, but Akira Yamaoka, if I remember correctly, recorded a lot of sound effects himself, and so you may be hearing that. Later on, in an interview, he stated that he used software like ImpOscar and that one popular Mellotron emulation I forget the name of.

Silent Hill 2's drumloop was likely sequenced by Akira Yamaoka himself using miscellaneous drum samples, and/or it was recorded by him. In either case, it was almost certainly just made to sound old by using any number of techniques.

Resident Evil 2's bell is a Roland church bell. I'm not exactly sure which chime you're referring to here (if only those samples worked!), but it's safe to assume this is all Roland.

The Marshalling Yard's industrial hit is a drum sample pitched down and occasionally layered with a piano. Almost certain it's Roland.

FFX uses the Roland SC88 Pro/SC8850 a lot (they're virtually identical), and this song uses a lot of taiko drums. If you're referring to the drum sound at about 2:00, those are taiko drums sequenced in quick succession to sound unnatural. Crisis and Growlanser III's "Doubt" are probably using the same set of loops/samples. I can't identify them.

I don't know where any of those guitar riffs come from. Maybe they used some kind of sample CDs, but that Conker riff is also the same one used in Tekken 3 - interesting.
KVRer
 
5 posts since 11 Feb, 2014

Postby Nisto; Wed Feb 12, 2014 11:26 am Re: [Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

HaganeSteel, how do you mean the samples don't work? Does the player show at all? Does it not play when you click on the play button? If it doesn't even show, you should see a red notice about it at the bottom (in which case you probably have JavaScript disabled, try to enable it in your browser)... If you don't even see that, you should probably upgrade your browser (or at least use a separate one if you hate today's cancerous web browsers and refuse to upgrade :P). It definitely works in the latest Mozilla Firefox version as well as the latest Google Chrome version. It should even work in IE6 (although terribly slow there, but it's a 10(!)+ year-old browser). Please let me know if you (can't) work it out.

When you've listened to the samples, maybe you can get a more clear idea about which sounds I'm referring to. Some of the descriptions can probably be a little misleading.

As for Silent Hill samples, I actually don't think he made many sounds himself. We have found a great deal of sample CDs he has used in the sample thread on Silent Hill Heaven (aka Silent Hill Forums). You should check it out. That drum/ambience sample; I think it's from a sample CD as well (from circa 1995 I'm guessing) - see this post on SHH: http://www.silenthillforum.com/viewtopi ... 19#p676519

I would love to know what Mellotron emulation software it is that you're talking about, because we did find out he used some Mellotron stuff in Silent Hill 1 - specifically we believe it is Michael Pinder's Mellotron library - but some of the samples sound a little off/lower in quality in comparison. And while - yes, AY could have easily tweaked it with a DAW - he often, as a matter of fact, just used samples in their close-to-raw sounding form (it doesn't make him any less of an artist to me though). Go through the thread on SHH and see for yourself if you don't believe it.

Anyway, when it comes to Silent Hill I don't think much credit goes to standard synthesizer sounds. There is only one sound I have found so far that I think can be credited to some of the synths he has used - Roland JD-800 to be specific - and it is the very first, airy sample from this (unreleased!) track: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctPryzDzzGg (I believe it to be called "Deep Breath", but I'm not 100% sure since I only got my hands on a reference sample CD by USB-Samploscopie).

Some more proof of what a big sample CD user he is (skip to 21:03 if it doesn't automatically):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1VKvED76WQ&t=21m03s
Look at that pile!
KVRian
 
553 posts since 25 Jun, 2013

Postby HaganeSteel; Wed Feb 12, 2014 12:05 pm Re: [Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

The samples don't load or play for me. I can see them fine.

You're more than likely right about Silent Hill 1. I was only guessing there. I know later on he did record many sound effects himself, but I'm not sure if or how he used them in his music.

He also wouldn't have used a VST back in '98. The interview was after Silent Hill 3, I believe, I was just making the point that he moved on to software.

Pretty sure he mentioned the M-Tron, though, but I could be remembering wrong.

The others, for the most part, used a lot of Roland. Roland and Emu were the dominant forces in the industry later on. Observe, Michiko Naruke's gear:

Image

That is a Roland SC8850 at the top, 2 Emu Proteus 2000 modules, a Roland XV5080, and there's another module there that I forget the name of, but I know I've seen before.

Korg was dominant during the era of the M1, and the M1 was used some in Final Fantasy on the SNES, as well as Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past, I believe. Contra III: Alien Wars also used the M1 (Asuyuka corrected me on this: I thought it was a Proteus at first).

Korg was less represented later on, but the Trinity was used by Yoshino Aoki in Breath of Fire IV, I believe, and was most definitely used by Yoko Shimomura for Parasite Eve.

I'm saying all this to make it easier for you guys to figure out what's what.

All of the guesses I make are just that: Guesses based on my knowledge and experience with the gear. I don't have any inside information.

I'm also generally not too concerned with what exactly was used so much as what it took to get that sound. I know all of these things to help my music, since these sound modules basically had their own musical styles that I grew up on.
KVRer
 
5 posts since 11 Feb, 2014

Postby Nisto; Wed Feb 12, 2014 2:18 pm Re: [Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

So you mean they don't play when you press the play button? What browser are you using (+version) if I may ask? I will try to fix it if I can, but I can't do that unless I know everything's as it should on your side..

The interview was done by the time Silent Hill 2 was finished and at the start of Silent Hill 3. In other words, it was probably recorded around the end of 2001 or start of 2002.
KVRian
 
553 posts since 25 Jun, 2013

Postby HaganeSteel; Wed Feb 12, 2014 4:40 pm Re: [Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

I'm in Firefox 27 on Windows 7 64bit.

Yeah, it's been ages since I saw that interview. I can't really help you on Silent Hill. When it comes to sound modules, though, I'm your man.

I'm not really doing this for historical reasons, I'm doing this to understand my music.

Different synths are used in different ways, and I was never able to quite achieve what I wanted to do with my XP-30 or any of my other gear.

Not all sounds are created equal - Roland synths are useless to me without the Bright Strings patch from the SC88s, and I wasn't the only one who thought this - you can hear it being used as the primary string sound of most game composers who used Sound Canvases because it lends itself so well to fast runs and staccato.

But Roland synths never really change. For example: The SC8850 "Strings" patch is the Edirol Orchestral's "Full Strings" patch - they're the same sound, stereo and all - and it is superior to the strings you would find in a JV/XP because its loop point is better.

I know stuff like that. Sample CDs are outside my realm of expertise. :hihi:
KVRer
 
5 posts since 11 Feb, 2014

Postby Nisto; Fri Feb 14, 2014 7:37 am Re: [Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

Well, it turns out they screwed something up on one of the recent versions of Firefox (speaking of cancerous browsers...) I forgot that I was on the latest _ESR_ version of Firefox - I didn't have the problem you're experiencing there. It works in ALL other browsers. Again, even in IE6! I'm not gonna bother with reporting the bug to Mozilla because browser developers rarely do seem to actually care about fixing (minor) bugs. Anyway, I am unable to fix the issue, but it seems to have to do with HTTPS links (Dropbox unfortunately seems to force HTTPS), because it works from non-HTTPS locations as well as locally.

Anyway, for now I've uploaded an archive of the samples here: http://tinyurl.com/q4g269d
Not included in the archive above is THIS: http://tinyurl.com/oshe5lv
That's a sample used in Besaid Island from FFX. I'm sure you'll recognize it. I'm wondering if anyone knows where it might be from? I found that in a library called "Einstein" by German company Music-Store Köln, but I'm pretty sure it's originally from, maybe JV-2080, or a compatible expansion board - maybe SR-JV80-04? In the aforementioned library it's called ANACHIME, which is very likely short for "Analog Chime", and I notice the patch/wave listing on SR-JV80-04 has something called just that. Can anyone who owns either check for it?

I did some research on that M-Tron VST... It seems to have been released around 2000 [1][2]. So yeah, he most definitely didn't use that for Silent Hill 1 at least, as you guessed.
KVRian
 
553 posts since 25 Jun, 2013

Postby HaganeSteel; Fri Feb 14, 2014 2:38 pm Re: [Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

Besaid Island used Roland.

The Roland SC88s shared a lot of the same samples as found in the JVs, XPs and the SR-JV expansion boards.

The SC88, SC8820, SC8850, JV2080, XP-30, XP-60, XP-80 and just about all their other synths at the time were just minor variations of each other. They all drew from the same library of sounds, with different hardware, different features, etc.

The Sound Canvases (SC88s) were special because they gave you a wide variety of the Roland JV sounds - some of which came directly from the SR-JV expansions - for a relatively cheap price. This meant they were ideal for game musicians.

So the exact Roland model isn't important, and the sound you're looking for is probably on the SR-JV expansion boards, but it's also on the Sound Canvases, the SRX boards, etc.

The sound you're referring to is probably a Roland Gamelan, Jegogan, Jublag + cutoff turned out, etc., and it is on the SC88. It's under the ethnic percussion section.

Judging by the strings and the orchestral snare, etc. it's 100% a Roland SC88 Pro. Masashi Hamauzu is making good use of those Roland Bright Strings, which were later replaced on the XPs and JV2080+, etc. by what Roland considers superior string samples, but they are wrong.
User avatar
KVRAF
 
3014 posts since 3 Jul, 2012
  

Postby V0RT3X; Sat Feb 22, 2014 1:49 am Re: [Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

Was this ever used for producing game soundtracks?

http://www.kvraudio.com/product/s_yxg50_by_yamaha
KVRian
 
553 posts since 25 Jun, 2013

Postby HaganeSteel; Sat Feb 22, 2014 7:35 am Re: [Metal Gear Solid] What is this sounds library ?

V0RT3X wrote:Was this ever used for producing game soundtracks?

http://www.kvraudio.com/product/s_yxg50_by_yamaha


Not that specifically, but those older Yamahas were used in Saga Frontier, and you can find those sounds on current PSRs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hGAEujN_rg

Kenji Ito composed the Saga Frontier soundtrack on a Yamaha TG-500.

It has a really harsh sound, though, if the original PSF file is anything to go by.

Edit: I'm wrong on the XG compatibility. Whoa. I've sat here this whole time thinking the TG-500 was an XG synth. :nutter:

A friend of mine has told me that the sounds are pretty much the same, though. The TGs, the XGs and the PSRs, that is.
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