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Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion

Moderator: Moderators (Main)

User avatar
spaceman
KVRAF
 
8172 posts since 9 Jan, 2004, from leroyaumeuni

Postby spaceman; Thu Feb 13, 2014 6:17 am Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

Slarti wrote:
ENV1 wrote:Its a while ago, but i think Orion pretty much worked like that.

Rather than a traditional timeline arrangment you have a 'sequences arranger' (or pattern sequencer) where you chain together blocks of sequences/patterns. With loop enabled you should able to record live audio of any length while the sequences just keep looping.

Trial Version: Here


Pretty pricey also! :(

What you're describing is what i'm after!

What he's describing can be done in any host that can loop a clip in arrange view. Again, that's almost any linear host.
My other host is Bruce Forsyth
Slarti
KVRist
 
160 posts since 22 Jul, 2012, from Magrathea

Postby Slarti; Thu Feb 13, 2014 6:43 am Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

spaceman wrote:
Slarti wrote:
ENV1 wrote:Its a while ago, but i think Orion pretty much worked like that.

Rather than a traditional timeline arrangment you have a 'sequences arranger' (or pattern sequencer) where you chain together blocks of sequences/patterns. With loop enabled you should able to record live audio of any length while the sequences just keep looping.

Trial Version: Here


Pretty pricey also! :(

What you're describing is what i'm after!

What he's describing can be done in any host that can loop a clip in arrange view. Again, that's almost any linear host.


No, you have to spread that looped clip out over the lenght of the recording time which, again, does not work well with recordings of undetermined lenghts!

This is the ideal situation:

.........|-------------| . . . .\
Track 1 | short seq | . . . . \
.........|----------------| . . ./ these looped independently
Track 2.| . short seq .| . . /
.........|----------------------------
Track 3 | i m p r o v
.........|----------------------------

One should not have to cut-and-paste or draw the sequences of Tracks 1 and 2 over the timeline, instead there should be a 'per sequence loop' functionality!
User avatar
mcnelson
KVRian
 
696 posts since 26 Mar, 2004, from Surrey, UK

Postby mcnelson; Thu Feb 13, 2014 6:56 am Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

Couple of copies of Live (lite & Launchpad) going here for $35 each:
viewtopic.php?f=43&t=402084

You might be able to talk the seller down a bit. $35 does seem a bit much for lite editions, especially as a previous poster said, they have gone for $15-$20 before and probably will again....especially when bitwig hits the market.

HTH
ABLETON LIVE 9 : TRACKTION 5 : AUDIO DAMAGE : SONIC CHARGE : SUGAR BYTES : TWISTED TOOLS
Nation of Korea vs Sh*tty Dog
User avatar
Sendy
KVRAF
 
4418 posts since 20 Jul, 2010

Postby Sendy; Thu Feb 13, 2014 7:00 am Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

Slarti wrote:
spaceman wrote:
Slarti wrote:
ENV1 wrote:Its a while ago, but i think Orion pretty much worked like that.

Rather than a traditional timeline arrangment you have a 'sequences arranger' (or pattern sequencer) where you chain together blocks of sequences/patterns. With loop enabled you should able to record live audio of any length while the sequences just keep looping.

Trial Version: Here


Pretty pricey also! :(

What you're describing is what i'm after!

What he's describing can be done in any host that can loop a clip in arrange view. Again, that's almost any linear host.


No, you have to spread that looped clip out over the lenght of the recording time which, again, does not work well with recordings of undetermined lenghts!

This is the ideal situation:

.........|-------------| . . . .\
Track 1 | short seq | . . . . \
.........|----------------| . . ./ these looped independently
Track 2.| . short seq .| . . /
.........|----------------------------
Track 3 | i m p r o v
.........|----------------------------

One should not have to cut-and-paste or draw the sequences of Tracks 1 and 2 over the timeline, instead there should be a 'per sequence loop' functionality!


Notator on the Atari ST used this kind of workflow. Each track was essentially a list of events, which could have it's own loop and other settings. Then you could arrange each list of lists into a bigger list called Arrange, which had four channels so you could have multiple patterns playing together or overlapping, each with multiple channels.
http://sendy.bandcamp.com/releases < My new album at Bandcamp!
JoeCat
KVRian
 
777 posts since 19 May, 2011, from North Carolina

Postby JoeCat; Thu Feb 13, 2014 7:11 am Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

If I understand correctly, methinks Renoise can approach that:

http://tutorials.renoise.com/wiki/Pattern_Editor
woggle
KVRist
 
425 posts since 23 Nov, 2012

Postby woggle; Thu Feb 13, 2014 7:49 am Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

usine hollyhock http://www.sensomusic.com/usine/ should be able to do that. There is a free version and some old versions that are now free I think. It is quite difficult to get used to but if it suits you then should do what you want
SAW75
KVRian
 
587 posts since 17 Sep, 2007

Postby SAW75; Thu Feb 13, 2014 8:01 am Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

Audiomulch, definitely.

Expensive though at $189, I think.
User avatar
spaceman
KVRAF
 
8172 posts since 9 Jan, 2004, from leroyaumeuni

Postby spaceman; Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:33 am Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

Slarti wrote:No, you have to spread that looped clip out over the lenght of the recording time which, again, does not work well with recordings of undetermined lenghts!

This is the ideal situation:

.........|-------------| . . . .\
Track 1 | short seq | . . . . \
.........|----------------| . . ./ these looped independently
Track 2.| . short seq .| . . /
.........|----------------------------
Track 3 | i m p r o v
.........|----------------------------

One should not have to cut-and-paste or draw the sequences of Tracks 1 and 2 over the timeline, instead there should be a 'per sequence loop' functionality!

As I said, Live is the tool for you. Record a clip one one track in session view, and another one on another track, play the clips in recording mode to record then to the arrangement, play on a third track in arrange view for the improv.
My other host is Bruce Forsyth
User avatar
SODDI
KVRAF
 
2704 posts since 2 Jul, 2007, from Oxycontin Acres, Georgia, USA

Postby SODDI; Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:38 am Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

Slarti wrote:.
I haven't used many DAW's until now. (Computer)Muzys in the past and now only a bit of Mulab and i 'skimmed' a tiny bit of Reaper.

My question is two-fold:

I want to work with looped melodic sequences in various tracks of different lenghts that must be looped independently and triggered 'on the fly'. Thus a DAW/sequencer with only a linear timeline is not really suited for this workflow.

Ideal would be e.g.:

Track 1 - seq. 3 bars (set to loop)
Track 2 - seq. 5 bars (set to loop)
Track 3 - record improv of undetermined lenght

Linear DAW's can do this, but one has either to cut-and-past all sequences or 'draw' them out but this doesn't cater for the improv. of undetermined lenght!

Therefore my question is: which DAW (pref. free- or budgetware) has a 'non-linear' workflow?


And secondly; which DAW (linear or otherwise) has the possibility to record in loop mode a sequence of undetermined length as a whole? (e.g. loop-time is 30 sec., recorded sequence is 3 minutes. Just a rough example).

In older days I knew that Muzys had that functionality, but alas Mulab doesn't seem to do this. . :(


I hope someone can help me and i await your suggestions. . . :)

S.


Audiomulch. Its native loop players and automation should do EXACTLY what you want done.

Its workflow is determined by whatever audio path you have chosen to build and with what devices in the chain. So for instance you have a stereo loop playing. You can direct either or both audio outputs to any layout of devices you choose just by connecting devices. If you already have a series of devices set up, it's no problem to take that initial audio signal and connect it to a whole nother device setup.

It's all visual. Fun to play in. You can create layouts of devices and signals that would be flatly impossible to recreate in a standard DAW.

However, no MIDI note recording, no piano roll. It only records and sends MIDI CC.
jeffh
KVRist
 
433 posts since 9 Feb, 2012

Postby jeffh; Thu Feb 13, 2014 11:52 am Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

I think Giada (or other loop-centric things that aren't quite DAWs) may be able to do something like that, but I haven't spent enough time with it...

If I may(please excuse my ignorance): Why would you want to loop a 3-bar and 5-bar sequence independently on top of each other indefinitely? I'm not knocking what you're doing, I'm just genuinely curious as to why someone would want to do that...
mutools
KVRAF
 
5603 posts since 24 Jun, 2008, from Europe

Postby mutools; Thu Feb 13, 2014 12:36 pm Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

Slarti wrote:This is the ideal situation:

.........|-------------| . . . .\
Track 1 | short seq | . . . . \
.........|----------------| . . ./ these looped independently
Track 2.| . short seq .| . . /
.........|----------------------------
Track 3 | i m p r o v
.........|----------------------------

One should not have to cut-and-paste or draw the sequences of Tracks 1 and 2 over the timeline, instead there should be a 'per sequence loop' functionality!


Slarti what's the prob with, in MuLab, stretching individually looped sequence parts over say 10 minutes or so. Then you got the same effect as the Loop Composition in Muzys. And so you got all the time to record your polyrhythmic improvisation. Right? Maybe i'm still missing something?
User avatar
SODDI
KVRAF
 
2704 posts since 2 Jul, 2007, from Oxycontin Acres, Georgia, USA

Postby SODDI; Thu Feb 13, 2014 2:42 pm Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

jeffh wrote:If I may(please excuse my ignorance): Why would you want to loop a 3-bar and 5-bar sequence independently on top of each other indefinitely? I'm not knocking what you're doing, I'm just genuinely curious as to why someone would want to do that...


They will beat against each other in a most interesting way.
jeffh
KVRist
 
433 posts since 9 Feb, 2012

Postby jeffh; Thu Feb 13, 2014 3:10 pm Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

SODDI wrote:They will beat against each other in a most interesting way.


Fair enough...

I will share the answer: Any DAW can do it.

Step 1: Multiply 3 x 5 (or whatever x whatever)
Step 2: Loop both patterns to 15 bars (or whatever)
Step 3: Profit

Then it's just a matter of recording takes over it, then exploding the takes out...
Nokenoku
KVRAF
 
1668 posts since 10 Feb, 2008, from Berlin, Germany

Postby Nokenoku; Thu Feb 13, 2014 3:15 pm Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

Slarti wrote:I want to work with looped melodic sequences in various tracks of different lenghts that must be looped independently and triggered 'on the fly'.
Do you know the FLStudio Performance mode?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9u7E-L0b_Ks
User avatar
KrisM
KVRian
 
823 posts since 25 Aug, 2009

Postby KrisM; Thu Feb 13, 2014 4:54 pm Re: Looking for a DAW with 'non-linear' workflow

I'm pretty sure I have a copy of Live Lite that you can have for free, if you decide it will work for you. iirc it will become Live 9 Lite on registration, too.
Meh.
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