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im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable daw?

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion

Moderator: Moderators (Main)

hibidy
KVRAF
 
40715 posts since 20 Dec, 2005

Postby hibidy; Mon Feb 17, 2014 5:42 pm Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

AstralExistence wrote:here one more thing i noticed. and no, im not bullshitting myself because i remember yesterday what it was. studio one with no vsti loaded just plain studio one, used about 2,200 mbs of memory, now it uses little more then 1,500 mbs. and before, in s1v2, when i minimized/maximized windows, i would get that buffering sound you get when your audio stutters. not anymore. its like a HUGE jump in performance now.

this is just no words awesome because i haven't finished a song since 2010 due to my pc running so shitty. i would just sit there and and start writing a song and then all of the sudden, the cpu would start getting higher and higher and more and more ram used so i would stop what i was doing and start over again. man one i finished with my halion sonic v2 stress test/song i will post it in the music forum, reformat with studio one as my chosen daw/old drivers/tweaks then start writing music again. so f**king happy :D


If it took this thread to get you to where you can use your daw, then it was worth it :)
LawrenceF
KVRAF
 
4454 posts since 4 Dec, 2004

Postby LawrenceF; Tue Feb 18, 2014 8:58 am Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

hibidy wrote:All you can do is take a law of averages and hope for the best.

You summed up the only real point of my pontificating in one very simple and very concise English sentence. :hihi:

Thanks. :)
TheoM
KVRAF
 
19040 posts since 4 Sep, 2001, from Melbourne Australia

Postby TheoM; Tue Feb 18, 2014 9:25 am Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

LawrenceF wrote:
TheoM wrote:The only thing I haven't (obviously) tested is bitwig.

As a purely practical matter I kinda tend to doubt that. :) I say that in a non-offensive way, but it seems near impossible for anyone without a lot of time and resources and money to actually do that... fully test every single audio workstation.

I always take comments like that to mean... "I've tested everything I could actually get my hands on, mostly the things KVR cares about, things that have demos and/or things I already own."

I hope you realize for me to be saying something so positive about it means that I am really meaning what I am saying.

I know you aren't being intentionally misleading. But I also think - in general - most of this kind stuff is ... kinda silly unless it's framed into a reasonable context. :hihi:

I mean, Gargageband never really crashes either. That doesn't make it the most stable daw in the world. It only means for it's most typical and somewhat limited use cases it's very stable. It you tried to use it like PTHDx, recording and punching 48 tracks at a time while feeding 18 pairs of phones with FX on every cue, it might not be so stable. :hihi: Of course, most people making those claims don't even have that much I/O.

Same goes for Reason and Mixcraft. Most of the people making those kinds of determinations aren't doing enough with it to even make those claims. What they're really saying (the real meaning) is... "For how I personally use it, it's really stable." :hihi:

It's kinda obvious that even though all of these products are - audio workstations - most of the testing is with virtual instruments, not really tons and tons of audio files? That's the first thing I did with Tracktion 5, loaded up 65 audio stems. It didn't do so well.



You're wrong this time mate, and I know precisely how to torture test a DAW and spend much of my time (torturing myself :hihi: )doing it.

I can't think of a host i haven't tested with. PT, N Track both OS, Samplitude, Renoise, Mixcraft, Sonar, Logic, Cubase, S1, Band in a Box, Reaper, Live, FL, Orion, Reason, Logic, GB, DP8, Metro, Nuendo (at a friends legit setup),Tracktion, and even PT HD at the same guy's place (very stable). Wavelab, acoustica, Soundtrack, Waveburner, Audacity (most unstable 2 track around for me), Sound Forge. etc

and i still haven't covered the list as that is only what I can remember from my head. I test every single thing the moment it is released, like I will with Bitwig. Everything that makes the news at KVR that is.

Ok so just to be totally PC, it might not be every single piece of software in existence but I think having tested everything that people talk about here is a good enough representation.

And every host that used AU, VST, AAX and RTAS is susceptible to instabilities depending on the combination and instance amount of plugins used. I have made every single host above crash multiple times (some ALOT more than others), but I consider Logic to be among the "more stable".

Reason doesn't have these issues and one would argue it's plug in list is now extensive enough to be a major player. RE go through a quality control that VST and AU simply don't (cause they logistically can't).. the benefit of what i still consider a closed system.

You can disagree, that's your right.

But i stand by my post.. I am trying to help the OP. if he wants to turn his PC on, load his host and work all day and night and consistently without crashes, reason will give that to him. (note, my reason testing was far more vigorous on OSX but i didn't have any problems in Win7 either). He wants it to JUST WORK. I gave him a suggestion. :wink:
"Just call me shitload, cause I own a shitload of plugins!"
TheoM
KVRAF
 
19040 posts since 4 Sep, 2001, from Melbourne Australia

Postby TheoM; Tue Feb 18, 2014 9:34 am Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

Just wanted to add, i ALWAYS test multiple live track recording if the feature is available in the host. I use my older MOTU 18 input (16 analog) interface for this, i don't have the hardware or band to feed such an amount so i arm 16 mono or 8 stereo tracks and assign inputs and faux record. Any pops or clicks would still show up in the "blank" audio files. Same with instabilities.

Correction: spelling of "inout" to "input".
"Just call me shitload, cause I own a shitload of plugins!"
LawrenceF
KVRAF
 
4454 posts since 4 Dec, 2004

Postby LawrenceF; Tue Feb 18, 2014 9:49 am Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

I figured you might Theo. Again, the discussions about those kinds of comparative tests here seem to rarely mention those things, how they may compare from product to product, how one does well and another not so much. It seems to focus mostly on VI's and plugins because that's what the user base here cares about (logical).

I wasn't saying that - you - don't ever do it. I was only saying 'it seems to me that most people don't do it ... when they compare products... before they publish the comparative results and determinations and mark something as the literal best.

Thanks Theo. I was hoping you (or others) wouldn't take my comments the wrong way. So much for that. :)

We daw users mostly have tunnel vision. Whatever we personally do is (of course logically) the most important things for us, so we most typically base the overall judgement of a product on that, whatever it is we mostly do. It's why you see the "B" word (*best") tossed around so often.

The only other point was that some products are quite literally out of the reach of the masses - for just testing - because they don't have demos. If you want to test the SSL DAW or Scope or PTHDX 11 to see how stable it is with the DSP hardware, you kinda have to buy it or go use it somewhere where someone else has it, which is why I was saying it's very difficult to test all of them.

If you've tested all of those (and there are a few more like that) also, props.

It's really not a matter of me being right or wrong about anything. I can be as easily wrong as the next guy, if not more so. :) I was mostly just saying what I observe.

A good tester (like yourself) intending to publish valuable results for the masses, and for those results to have more value for the masses, tests everything, not just the parts he or she wants to use. :tu:

Again, I appreciate your efforts.
Last edited by LawrenceF on Tue Feb 18, 2014 10:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
CTStump
KVRist
 
390 posts since 9 Jan, 2012, from Dona Ana, New Mexiico in the US of A

Postby CTStump; Tue Feb 18, 2014 10:13 am Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

Well it's the interwebs, where honor is defended on a regular and rather unnecessary basis.

I'm glad the OP found a solution(that WORKS for the moment).
User avatar
SODDI
KVRAF
 
2622 posts since 2 Jul, 2007, from Oxycontin Acres, Georgia, USA

Postby SODDI; Tue Feb 18, 2014 1:02 pm Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

CTStump wrote:I'm glad the OP found a solution(that WORKS for the moment).


Well, there's the rub, isn't it? It's like every user has to find his own crash/bug-proofing strategies - and even then it's not guaranteed to last.

The Windows tweaks (for us Windows users) alone are enough to drive one bonkers mainly because there are conflicting "absolute rules". Adjust for best performance/background services? Use Aero or not? What to manually go in and un-tick/tick in msconfig.exe? Everything seems to work better both ways for someone or other.

All of the fixes seem to be one or more of the AAAs - Anecdotal, Apocryphal or Ad Lib. There are few hard and fast rules for crash/bug-proofing and users are on their own.
hibidy
KVRAF
 
40715 posts since 20 Dec, 2005

Postby hibidy; Tue Feb 18, 2014 1:47 pm Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

LawrenceF wrote:
hibidy wrote:All you can do is take a law of averages and hope for the best.

You summed up the only real point of my pontificating in one very simple and very concise English sentence. :hihi:

Thanks. :)



I have my moments
User avatar
Jace-BeOS
KVRAF
 
1801 posts since 7 Jan, 2005, from Corporate States of America

Postby Jace-BeOS; Tue Feb 18, 2014 2:33 pm Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

SODDI wrote:
CTStump wrote:I'm glad the OP found a solution(that WORKS for the moment).


Well, there's the rub, isn't it? It's like every user has to find his own crash/bug-proofing strategies - and even then it's not guaranteed to last.

The Windows tweaks (for us Windows users) alone are enough to drive one bonkers mainly because there are conflicting "absolute rules". Adjust for best performance/background services? Use Aero or not? What to manually go in and un-tick/tick in msconfig.exe? Everything seems to work better both ways for someone or other.

All of the fixes seem to be one or more of the AAAs - Anecdotal, Apocryphal or Ad Lib. There are few hard and fast rules for crash/bug-proofing and users are on their own.


This is why i hate computers. Especially running Windows. It's voodoo. There's nothing exact about computers. They behave like living things way more than they behave like machines, doing "only what we tell them to do".

:-D
- dysamoria.com
my music @ SoundCloud
hibidy
KVRAF
 
40715 posts since 20 Dec, 2005

Postby hibidy; Tue Feb 18, 2014 2:37 pm Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

There is some truth to that.
TheoM
KVRAF
 
19040 posts since 4 Sep, 2001, from Melbourne Australia

Postby TheoM; Tue Feb 18, 2014 3:59 pm Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

I didn't even realise the op had settled on a solution already. Next time I will learn TO read the entire topic :lol:
"Just call me shitload, cause I own a shitload of plugins!"
hibidy
KVRAF
 
40715 posts since 20 Dec, 2005

Postby hibidy; Tue Feb 18, 2014 4:34 pm Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

I was going to suggest a title change, but then thought it was prolly none of my business :hihi:

(ok, alright, yeah, it's getting a little thin)
tapper mike
KVRAF
 
3612 posts since 19 Jan, 2008

Postby tapper mike; Wed Feb 19, 2014 4:28 am Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

Jace-BeOS wrote:
This is why i hate computers. Especially running Windows. It's voodoo. There's nothing exact about computers. They behave like living things way more than they behave like machines, doing "only what we tell them to do".

:-D



You are only saying that because you are not part of the collective "we"
Silly humans believe everything they're told.
NAD
KVRian
 
1041 posts since 28 Jan, 2004

Postby NAD; Wed Feb 19, 2014 5:59 am Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

Jace-BeOS wrote:This is why i hate computers. Especially running Windows. It's voodoo. There's nothing exact about computers. They behave like living things way more than they behave like machines, doing "only what we tell them to do".

Brilliant! :clap:
LawrenceF
KVRAF
 
4454 posts since 4 Dec, 2004

Postby LawrenceF; Wed Feb 19, 2014 7:20 am Re: im so sick and tired of daw crashes. ie the most stable

NAD wrote:
Jace-BeOS wrote:This is why i hate computers. Especially running Windows. It's voodoo. There's nothing exact about computers. They behave like living things way more than they behave like machines, doing "only what we tell them to do".

Brilliant! :clap:


:tu: Computers kinda are living things. No two systems (once in the hands of actual users) are identical. That's pretty obvious. If they were, all software would always behave the exact same way for everyone on every system and that's clearly not the case. :hihi:

My system running most things in a stable way only really proves that, that my system runs most things in a stable way. It doesn't mean yours will. :)

That's why AVID does the "approved system" thing, so they can control a small part of that... but they still can't control the OS and maybe some dependencies being modified randomly as people install all kinds of other things.
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