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The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion

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KVRAF
 
6223 posts since 6 Sep, 2008
 

Postby Mushy Mushy; Mon Mar 24, 2014 9:46 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

ezelkow1 wrote:
Mushy Mushy wrote:^ px: are you sure about that? Is this available in Live8 as well?


yea you can, its under look and feel, uncheck autohide plugin windows, also enable multiple plugin windows so you can have open whatever you want

Oh my.
I'm kicking myself for not knowing this earlier.
Can't stand the undocking.

Thx guys 8)
"I was wondering if you'd like to try Magic Mushrooms"
"Oooh I dont know. Sounds a bit scary"
"It's not scary. You just lose a sense of who you are and all that sh!t"
KVRAF
 
3683 posts since 12 May, 2008

Postby Echoes in the Attic; Mon Mar 24, 2014 9:46 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

pdxindy wrote:
dsan@mail.com wrote:
pdxindy wrote:
kennyda wrote:
There is a button to show the plugin's GUI. If you display the GUI, it will stay visible no matter what you do, until you hide it again. However it won't show in full screen view on a Mac.It is not treated as a separate window on a Mac.


I like the configuration in Live where switching tracks shows only the open vst GUI's for that track. Are you saying Bitwig cannot do this?


I actually do not like how Live hides the VST GUI if another track is selected.

There have been many times I need to make an adjustment in a VST while working in a different track and have to jump back and forth to do so.

So I'm hoping BWS allows these GUI's to stay on top with the option to hide them if needed.

Actually, the option to work in whatever way suits the user is best, so I hope they have preferences for everything. :D

Happy Musiking!
dsan


You can configure it in Live in preferences...


Yeah this is one of those things that needs the option because neither way is "right". I would be bummed if switching tracks left the plug-ins open of previously selected tracks. It's a nice easy way to quickly see the plugs of different tracks having them automatically display for the selected track.
This is a block of text that can be added to posts you make. There is a 255 character limit. Once I have something clever, I will certainly fill it in.
KVRAF
 
8589 posts since 2 Feb, 2005, from in the wilds
 

Postby pdxindy; Mon Mar 24, 2014 9:47 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

Mushy Mushy wrote:^ px: are you sure about that? Is this available in Live8 as well?


auto-hide plug-in windows (on/off) has been there a long time...
KVRAF
 
1891 posts since 29 Sep, 2005

Postby dsan@mail.com; Mon Mar 24, 2014 9:47 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

I must have overlooked that possibility somehow, and believe me, I have looked often because that is such a nuisance to me.

AHA - thanks ezelkow1!

Maybe it's because the settings screens are so small print I didn't see it. Good excuse as any right :hihi:

Maybe it's because I didn't know what I was looking at or for :hihi:

Nah....I like the first excuse better :hihi:

Happy Musiking!
dsan
My System:
W7, i5, x64, 8Gb Ram
KVRAF
 
8589 posts since 2 Feb, 2005, from in the wilds
 

Postby pdxindy; Mon Mar 24, 2014 9:50 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

I heard the sun got in your eyes :hihi:
KVRian
 
1203 posts since 1 Oct, 2013

Postby Ogopogo; Mon Mar 24, 2014 9:53 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

Guys, I've decided that there is a lot more nuance to this bitwig vs live comparison than I thought, my only having demoed Live makes it harder to see which differences are important, different people want different things and I am not privy to all of bitwig right now anyway. So I'm just gonna post the list as it is now and you guys can add or repost it anywhere as you wish. I think it probably covers all the big name features anyway which is what I really wanted.

With Bitwig out now many will be wondering how it compares to Live, so here's an overview of the differences.
Pros:
Arrange clip launcher
Hybrid audio/midi tracks
Track editing mode
Layered editing (view and edit multiple tracks or clips and the same time)
Modulate anything with simple click and drag based modulation system, even vst parameters
Full screen edit view
Metadata based browser
Open javascript controller support
More flexible window system (support for 3 monitors, view mixer in the arrange view, and more)
Open multiple projects at once with tabs
Multiple audio events within an audio clip (editing within audio items)
Selectable editing tools
Histogram views for editing distribution of note and automation node parameters
Latency compensated automation
Inspector for centralized track/item/note editing functions and options
Supports 64 and 32 bit plugs
Plugin crash guard (plugins run in a separate process so they can crash and be reloaded without stopping the host)
Nested fx
Package manager for an overview of currently installed and downloadable content
Linux support
Polyphonic note expressions for factory devices and plugs that support it: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=389923&p=5683228#p5683228
Global and per clip shuffle and accent control
Device parameter search/filter
Return and master channel clips
Macro controls for each device
Custom device panel mapping
Mixer strip device list
Extreme flexibility in device arrangement: Put an EQ (AudioFX) -> Bass to Midi (instrument) -> Chromaphone (Instrument) on an Audio Track and it actually works as expected, converting the EQed Bass input to midi playing Chromaphone

Cons:
No sidechaining besides the included devices (however the included envelope follower can be used to modulate any device or plugin parameter based on an audio input)
No audio to midi
No crossfades
No groove pool/groove extraction
VST only (no AU)
No midi routing between tracks
No VST multiouts*
No group tracks*

*However regarding these last two Dom of Bitwig has said that they will be coming before v2:
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=389923&p=5685093#p5685089

Other:
No visual programming environment like Max for Live available upon release, but will come integrated in a later version. So I guess there are pro and con aspects of that.
Devices that come with Bitwig: http://0dbpl.files.wordpress.com/2014/0 ... -chain.pdf
Ableton Live Intro/Standard/Suite feature comparison: https://www.ableton.com/en/live/feature-comparison/ There is only one version of Bitwig.
KVRAF
 
8589 posts since 2 Feb, 2005, from in the wilds
 

Postby pdxindy; Mon Mar 24, 2014 10:01 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

Additional Cons:

No tap tempo
No A/B crossfader
No tempo nudge
No time signature changes (within a song)
No key mapping
No freeze/unfreeze
User avatar
KVRist
 
405 posts since 21 Mar, 2010, from Manchester UK
 

Postby kennyda; Mon Mar 24, 2014 10:03 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

fluffy_little_something wrote:
tooneba wrote:I think I'll pass verision.1 and wait 4 years for 2.0. Seems there are many fancy looking features but at the same time lacking many basic features...


I haven't followed that endless development phase, so which basic features are missing? :? I have only used two entry-level DAW's so far, but such a statement doesn't sound very promising...

What I don't like is the dark interface, but maybe there are skins.
Nor do I like the rotated module labels.


Hi fluffy, when I used Live I never liked dark skins and I made my own. I have a serious eye condition so I struggle with high contrast and fine detail. However Bitwig's skin is very easy to look at, very practical, and there are actually several advantages to just having the one skin, because colours can have specific meanings that are universal.
Since using Bitwig I've gone up to the highest resolution on my Mac, which I couldn't use with Live because things were too small.
What do you mean by rotated module labels?

Bitwig Studio is not 'promising', no. It doesn't need to promise. It is delivering features Live users can only dream of, by the bucket load, and exist in no other DAW.
Studio One, OS X 10.0, M-Audio Oxygen 25 keyboard.
Old websites:
http://www.bitwigtutorials.net Free Bitwig Studio tutorials
http://www.macableton.com Free Ableton Live and Mac tutorials.
KVRist
 
103 posts since 6 Feb, 2012

Postby D.Josef; Mon Mar 24, 2014 10:12 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

Hey guys,

Sorry for the noobish question... After watching the Bitwig videos and reading up stuff, I'm wondering whether the 2x markup over the price of Logic Pro X or FL Studio PE would be worth it for me. :)

My understanding is that Bitwig aims primarily at a sequencer-minded, EDM producer crowd, which definitely does hit home with me. I know that its workflow is mostly compared to Ableton Live... Now that said, I've never used Ableton Live, so I'm wondering whether it would be a good choice, given the cheap competition - FL Studio with the quick and dirty sequencer approach, or Logic Pro as the industry leader in mixing and finishing...
User avatar
KVRAF
 
2908 posts since 5 Jun, 2012

Postby fluffy_little_something; Mon Mar 24, 2014 10:18 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

kennyda wrote:
fluffy_little_something wrote:
tooneba wrote:I think I'll pass verision.1 and wait 4 years for 2.0. Seems there are many fancy looking features but at the same time lacking many basic features...


I haven't followed that endless development phase, so which basic features are missing? :? I have only used two entry-level DAW's so far, but such a statement doesn't sound very promising...

What I don't like is the dark interface, but maybe there are skins.
Nor do I like the rotated module labels.


Hi fluffy, when I used Live I never liked dark skins and I made my own. I have a serious eye condition so I struggle with high contrast and fine detail. However Bitwig's skin is very easy to look at, very practical, and there are actually several advantages to just having the one skin, because colours can have specific meanings that are universal.
Since using Bitwig I've gone up to the highest resolution on my Mac, which I couldn't use with Live because things were too small.
What do you mean by rotated module labels?

Bitwig Studio is not 'promising', no. It doesn't need to promise. It is delivering features Live users can only dream of, by the bucket load, and exist in no other DAW.


Same here, my vision is not the best anymore :?

Well, the labels of those individual modules seem to be rotated counterclockwise by 90 degrees. At least on the screenshots on the site, maybe they have changed that meanwhile.

Does it come with instrument samples like energyXT or Mixcraft?
But I get the impression it is greared at studios and professionals, not so much the bedroom guys :roll:
KVRAF
 
1891 posts since 29 Sep, 2005

Postby dsan@mail.com; Mon Mar 24, 2014 10:53 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

D.Josef wrote:Hey guys,

Sorry for the noobish question... After watching the Bitwig videos and reading up stuff, I'm wondering whether the 2x markup over the price of Logic Pro X or FL Studio PE would be worth it for me. :)

My understanding is that Bitwig aims primarily at a sequencer-minded, EDM producer crowd, which definitely does hit home with me. I know that its workflow is mostly compared to Ableton Live... Now that said, I've never used Ableton Live, so I'm wondering whether it would be a good choice, given the cheap competition - FL Studio with the quick and dirty sequencer approach, or Logic Pro as the industry leader in mixing and finishing...


If price is the primary and major concern D.Josef, then BWS may not be for you.

If you consider value for price paid then that's a different story.

But it really depends on what it is you want to do.

For what it does Logic certainly has an enticing price, no doubt. When I used it (ver 7) I truly enjoyed working in it.

Since moving to Live I more enjoy the work flow. I think BWS will work more like Live and anxiously anticipate the release.

I'm not getting along with Live as it is extremely crash prone on my system. BWS may also be but it looks like the developers are taking many steps to avoid this scenario.

I own FLS but just could never get along with it. It was stable on my system but for some reason I just couldn't get it down.

If you are looking to make a purchase based on price and usability then you may want to consider (and I may regret saying this :hihi:) Reaper. Certainly a good price for what it does. Personally it is another I cannot get along with.

There's also Mulab and Traktion with decent price points.

I know price is relevant to many and BWS's tag is not cheap. I tend to buy though based on what it does for what I am paying. I think BWS will be worth the price and we'll all know in a couple of days. :wheee:

I suggest demo'ing it before counting it in or out either way.

HTH

Happy Musiking!
dsan
Last edited by dsan@mail.com on Mon Mar 24, 2014 11:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
My System:
W7, i5, x64, 8Gb Ram
KVRAF
 
1891 posts since 29 Sep, 2005

Postby dsan@mail.com; Mon Mar 24, 2014 11:00 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

fluffy_little_something wrote:......But I get the impression it is greared at studios and professionals, not so much the bedroom guys :roll:


That's strange how we all have different takes on things fluffy.

I got it was more geared for the home studio guys. But that's just my take.

I am sure BWS can and will be used by many different types of producers.

The only thing that may cause some home producers to not get involved will be that price tag.

I am sure there was a lot of disappointed KVR's when the price was announced.

Whom ever decides to use it though I sure hope we don't see it up on the warez sites! These guys have worked too hard for that crap.

Happy Musiking!
dsan
My System:
W7, i5, x64, 8Gb Ram
KVRAF
 
3683 posts since 12 May, 2008

Postby Echoes in the Attic; Mon Mar 24, 2014 11:11 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

Regarding the bounce in place, are there options for whether the automation is included? And which types of automation are included? I'd imagine wanting to bounce everything but an effect for example, so turn the effect off first, keep any automation on that effect and turn it back on after bounce.Hos do they handle this kind of thing?

Also, does bounce in place automatically inlcude all effects? So if you bounce a section and then play it back, will the audio then be printed with effects and then going through effects again unless you disable them?

I guess I'll find out in a couple days but...
This is a block of text that can be added to posts you make. There is a 255 character limit. Once I have something clever, I will certainly fill it in.
KVRAF
 
18908 posts since 4 Sep, 2001, from Melbourne Australia

Postby TheoM; Mon Mar 24, 2014 11:16 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

dsan@mail.com wrote:
fluffy_little_something wrote:......But I get the impression it is greared at studios and professionals, not so much the bedroom guys :roll:


That's strange how we all have different takes on things fluffy.

I got it was more geared for the home studio guys. But that's just my take.

I am sure BWS can and will be used by many different types of producers.

The only thing that may cause some home producers to not get involved will be that price tag.

I am sure there was a lot of disappointed KVR's when the price was announced.

Whom ever decides to use it though I sure hope we don't see it up on the warez sites! These guys have worked too hard for that crap.

Happy Musiking!
dsan



I'm with you, I think it's geared towards home studios and composers. No way studios recording multiple takes of audio will even look at it. (IMO). Will still check it out as I'm not happy the way the sandboxed logic is headed, but would be good to know if any of the cons in the post above (which I agree with but it needs to take lanes added also) will be addressed in updates. I really hope to hear some official word from the devs on which of those on the list they are willing to change.
"Just call me shitload, cause I own a shitload of plugins!"
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KVRAF
 
2908 posts since 5 Jun, 2012

Postby fluffy_little_something; Mon Mar 24, 2014 11:22 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

OK, I was judging from the price tag mostly and some of those features described, which sound freakish to me. Since I have never used it, I can't tell. Was simply wondering...
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