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The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion

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hibidy
KVRAF
 
42030 posts since 20 Dec, 2005

Postby hibidy; Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:49 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

Yeah, I have a tough time with "easily" replace but glad you are diggin' it. I've got no doubt they'll address the issues. I just think that that price and that product are quite a ways off imho.
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summer2000
KVRist
 
316 posts since 24 Dec, 2002

Postby summer2000; Wed Mar 26, 2014 8:59 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

hibidy wrote:Yeah, I have a tough time with "easily" replace but glad you are diggin' it. I've got no doubt they'll address the issues. I just think that that price and that product are quite a ways off imho.


I hear ya. I would gladly pay the asking price if all the current issues were addressed. For now in my opinion Bitwig Studio is not ready for prime time.
Open Labs Neko LX5 | Bitwig Studio 1.1.2 | Studio One v2 - Sonar X3e | Reason 7 | Ozone 6 Advanced
hibidy
KVRAF
 
42030 posts since 20 Dec, 2005

Postby hibidy; Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:18 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

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Tronam
KVRAF
 
1550 posts since 14 Mar, 2002, from Seattle, WA - USA

Postby Tronam; Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:22 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

I'd have a difficult time "replacing" Reason with anything. Even after all these years it's still one of the most unique environments I've ever worked in.
pdxindy
KVRAF
 
8968 posts since 2 Feb, 2005, from in the wilds

Postby pdxindy; Wed Mar 26, 2014 9:43 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

It was claimed that putting a device into an instrument FX slot would be per note. This is not so. FM-4 has no filter and you cannot add one that is per voice. So dropping the filter in the FM-4 FX slot is really no different that putting a filter after an instrument in any host. Well, you can modulate parameters in the device in the fx slot with the macro knobs from the instrument which is cool, but it is still monophonic and I can do that easily in Live as well.

I definitely like the modulation system, but since it is monophonic, and all the instruments are individually too simple for my tastes. It does not become a sort of modular system that I feel an excitement to use all that much. For example, I can do more in Zebra and do it easier.

While the modulation system is slick for built-in devices, it is less so for vst plug-ins. When one puts say Zebra in a track, it has 8 macros that one can assign to Zebra parameters. The frustrating thing is, you cannot just click on the parameter in Zebra itself. You have to select from a long list of hundreds of all available parameters in the Bitwig device. Okay, I spent about 2 minutes looking through the list for the parameter I want and I assigned it to Macro 1 and set the range. Now I go do some other things... then I decide I want to adjust the range so I go back to that device. I see no way to just go straight to that parameter in the list so I have to again look all through that long list to find the parameter I assigned to macro 1. If I remember what the parameter was called, then I can do a search which is faster but still means selecting the text field and typing in a few characters.

For VST's it is easier in Live.
Bathrobe
KVRist
 
182 posts since 10 Oct, 2011

Postby Bathrobe; Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:21 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

pdxindy wrote: The frustrating thing is, you cannot just click on the parameter in Zebra itself. You have to select from a long list of hundreds of all available parameters in the Bitwig device. Okay, I spent about 2 minutes looking through the list for the parameter I want and I assigned it to Macro 1 and set the range. Now I go do some other things... then I decide I want to adjust the range so I go back to that device. I see no way to just go straight to that parameter in the list so I have to again look all through that long list to find the parameter I assigned to macro 1. If I remember what the parameter was called, then I can do a search which is faster but still means selecting the text field and typing in a few characters.


I agree.

It should not be hard to implement a highlight in the list when touching a gui element.
Just a matter of prioritization of what to implement first.

Spacebar focus stealing and soundtoys parameter listing is also an issue.

I guess vst standards comes after adressing bitwigs internal fixes.
Last edited by Bathrobe on Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:47 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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spaceman
KVRAF
 
8205 posts since 9 Jan, 2004, from leroyaumeuni

Postby spaceman; Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:25 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

mysticvibes wrote:I'm considering trying ableton now after this release.. I hear its good for electronic music but how does it compare to studio one?

20-40% better
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tooneba
KVRist
 
399 posts since 6 Nov, 2012

Postby tooneba; Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:28 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

pdxindy wrote:It was claimed that putting a device into an instrument FX slot would be per note. This is not so. FM-4 has no filter and you cannot add one that is per voice. So dropping the filter in the FM-4 FX slot is really no different that putting a filter after an instrument in any host. Well, you can modulate parameters in the device in the fx slot with the macro knobs from the instrument which is cool, but it is still monophonic and I can do that easily in Live as well.

I definitely like the modulation system, but since it is monophonic, and all the instruments are individually too simple for my tastes. It does not become a sort of modular system that I feel an excitement to use all that much. For example, I can do more in Zebra and do it easier.

isn't there way to add expression for devices? No expression for devices go after generator?
hibidy
KVRAF
 
42030 posts since 20 Dec, 2005

Postby hibidy; Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:29 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

hahahahaa! Ah the 20-40% rule, it will NEVER get old!
hibidy
KVRAF
 
42030 posts since 20 Dec, 2005

Postby hibidy; Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:35 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

mysticvibes wrote:I'm considering trying ableton now after this release.. I hear its good for electronic music but how does it compare to studio one?


TBF, for some, live for whatever reason isn't stable. Also, TBF, you need to look into the PDC issue and see if that is going to turn you off.

Now for me :D

Live is INCREDIBLE for electronic music. Copying, pasting patterns is so easy. Midi is good, the groove pool is indispensable, transferring to the arrangement view is painless and things like racks make it a joy. ALL of my plugins (and as you may know I collect them :D ) work (including waves) and unless your PC is woefully out of touch, CPU use is fine*

I use live every day, many hours a day and do audio and VST recordings and it just goes and goes. And if you can afford it, push is just a joy as well.

*it's not like reapers, but it's better than studio one for the record.
hibidy
KVRAF
 
42030 posts since 20 Dec, 2005

Postby hibidy; Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:42 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

BTW mystic, if you can, get a copy of someone live "lite" and just test run it to see if works or try the demo. Before I bought suite, I ran my little lite copy and abused it to death to make sure it was what I want. Doesn't do everything but it's a good way to muck around for free. I'm certain SOMEONE here has a copy they'll give you if you don't have access to it.
pdxindy
KVRAF
 
8968 posts since 2 Feb, 2005, from in the wilds

Postby pdxindy; Wed Mar 26, 2014 10:58 pm Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

Bathrobe wrote:
pdxindy wrote: The frustrating thing is, you cannot just click on the parameter in Zebra itself. You have to select from a long list of hundreds of all available parameters in the Bitwig device. Okay, I spent about 2 minutes looking through the list for the parameter I want and I assigned it to Macro 1 and set the range. Now I go do some other things... then I decide I want to adjust the range so I go back to that device. I see no way to just go straight to that parameter in the list so I have to again look all through that long list to find the parameter I assigned to macro 1. If I remember what the parameter was called, then I can do a search which is faster but still means selecting the text field and typing in a few characters.


I agree.

It should not be hard to implement a highlight in the list when touching a gui element.
Just a matter of prioritization of what to implement first.

Spacebar focus stealing is also an issue.

I guess vst standards comes after adressing bitwigs internal fixes.


Your last statement points to a vague sense I've had for quite some time that 3rd party plugins are not the highest priority for Bitwig.

I have nothing to base this on but a hunch, but it feels like there is a bit of the closed system thinking going on there. Like maybe they think, in some recess of the mind, that they can make a set of instruments and a modular environment that should be enough for people to use.

Seems to me there is a considerable gap between how much went into making the workflow for Bitwig devices and for 3rd party plugins.

In any case, I know it is unlikely that I will do anything differently than I do now. Which is to say, I rely almost entirely on plug-ins for instruments and effects. At least at this point, that nullifies one of the big selling points for Bitwig.
homunculus
KVRist
 
100 posts since 28 Dec, 2011, from Puerto Rico

Postby homunculus; Thu Mar 27, 2014 1:54 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

The sad thing about all of this is, even though Bitwig is missing on some stuff its still better than Ableton Live, Live has become a joke, PDC GG WP. One thing I'm going to miss in Live is the EQ8, best freaking plugin EQ in the market right now.
I love music but more than that, I love making it
ThomasHelzle
KVRAF
 
3031 posts since 9 Dec, 2008, from Berlin

Postby ThomasHelzle; Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:56 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

Ogopogo wrote:I dunno, going to live instead seems like overkill considering how much stuff I love about bitwig. But it is seriously annoying that it works like this. Why do a two step process to enter notes when you could have a one step one? It really adds a lot of work to midi composing.

I'm really hoping I'm missing something here. Or maybe it's a bug. If not, maybe they could just add it, since double click drag with the pointer tool does nothing so it wouldn't mess anything up.


Hahahaha - remember when I told you that you will find something you hate about Bitwig. There we are ;-)

And who would have thought it's something as simple (to solve (hopefully) ) as a note-entering tool ;-)

I hope you will enjoy the ride anyway. :party:

Cheers,

Tom
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Ingonator
KVRAF
 
8247 posts since 21 Mar, 2008, from Hannover, Germany

Postby Ingonator; Thu Mar 27, 2014 3:03 am Re: The All In One Source Bitwig Information & Speculation Thread

homunculus wrote:The sad thing about all of this is, even though Bitwig is missing on some stuff its still better than Ableton Live, Live has become a joke, PDC GG WP. One thing I'm going to miss in Live is the EQ8, best freaking plugin EQ in the market right now.


That's your opinion, not mine.

To me this first version of Bitwig is more if a "joke" than Live 9 ever was (not that i really agree that Live is a "joke").

Personally i just uninstalled the Bitwig demo. Maybe will check again when version 2 (or 3...) is out. At the moment i stay with Live 9 Suite and Reaper.

Looking forward to check Live 10 and also Reaper 5 once they are released.


Ingo
Waldorf Beta Forum Manager
"Atmospheric Transients" for PPG Wave 3.V
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Win 7 64-bit / Live 9 / Cubase 7.5 / Studio One / Reaper / Pro Tools // Blofeld / Pulse 2 / many plugins
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