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software VA synthesizers make me wish i had analog hardware.

VST, AU, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion

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ghettosynth
KVRAF
 
3948 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Postby ghettosynth; Mon Apr 07, 2014 11:53 am Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had hardware.

BBFG# wrote:
Gamma-UT wrote:
BBFG# wrote:Analog.
More often in the states, analogue is a literary term, analog is a mechanical term.


Analogue is the British English spelling. That's all.


In fact, most of Europe too. Simply explaining that many of us here use them to denote specifics. But yes, they are functionally interchangeable for the most part. 'Analogue' is consider archaic in dealing with electronics or mechanics though.



If you must know, I use it on purpose, but I have a valid justification. Even though I live in the states, I hail from across the pond. It's one of the little things that reminds me where I'm from. I still spell colour with the 'u' as well, even though KVR highlights it for me as a misspelling. That's less intentional and more habit learned from a young age.
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V0RT3X
KVRAF
 
4007 posts since 3 Jul, 2012

Postby V0RT3X; Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:45 pm Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had analog hardware.

Ok so don't get me wrong, i love what is offered but I guess I'm just saying I wish i had a hardware synthesizer and would buy one if i could afford it for analog synthesizer duties over a VA. At least for the more complex stuff, but i suppose for general purpose sounds Diva and Synthsquad do cover alot of ground which is nice.

For now I'll be content with Synthsquad and eventually I will be rebuying Diva because it is totally worth it. Maybe if i get enough saved up in the future I'll get a Doepfer A100 Modular built :)
ghettosynth
KVRAF
 
3948 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Postby ghettosynth; Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:52 pm Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had analog hardware.

V0RT3X wrote:For now I'll be content with Synthsquad and eventually I will be rebuying Diva because it is totally worth it. Maybe if i get enough saved up in the future I'll get a Doepfer A100 Modular built :)


A small modular is definitely the kind of tool that augments an ITB setup well. I think that the best value on the market right now in a little monosynth is Artuira's microbrute. The semi-modular arrangement with the i/o in the little patch bay means that it will work nicely with a small modular configured as an expander.

I'm personally not a fan of any of the new polys and would suggest sticking either with Diva, or, working with Kontakt and and a nice monosynth/modular for analog poly sounds.

That's not to say that I think analog polys aren't worth having. I'm just not impressed with what's available new. I would keep my eye on Korg though, it wouldn't surprise me if they try to do a poly over the next few years.
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V0RT3X
KVRAF
 
4007 posts since 3 Jul, 2012

Postby V0RT3X; Mon Apr 07, 2014 5:09 pm Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had analog hardware.

aMUSEd wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icGWQZw5n24


I pre-ordered it before it came out. Great movie and a major part of my inspiration in wanting to go modular.
deastman
KVRAF
 
3994 posts since 6 Aug, 2003, from San Francisco Bay Area

Postby deastman; Mon Apr 07, 2014 5:32 pm Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had hardware.

ghettosynth wrote:
pdxindy wrote:
ghettosynth wrote:
layzer wrote:i went to a laptop with all vst synths and a usb controller keyboard for a while. but ended up going back to a hw/sw setup again. theres something about real synths being fed into a good audio card (maudio 1010LT for me) that just sounds bigger and better to me.


You just record your noodlings. The advantage with hardware, if you're willing to give up some flexibility in how you record real time sound changes, is that the "hardware control" knobs are already perfectly mapped to the synth, so there's no time wasted mapping the USB knobs to synth parameters.


That is really dependent on the hardware... lots of hardware synths have nested menus. Just cause something is 'hardware' does not automatically make it ergonomic, well laid out and immediate to use.


Of course, even a lot of really good hardware has that issue, so, if I may use the word, obviously, those aren't the synths that I'm talking about.

I was thinking of how immediate my Future Retro 777 is when I wrote that. Although I like the sound of some ITB 303 sequencers, I've never found one that feels like the 777 for live noodling.


Call it blasphemy, but I actually prefer sequencing my 777 from the DAW instead of using the internal one.
Incomplete list of my gear: 1/4" audio patchcord
ghettosynth
KVRAF
 
3948 posts since 13 Oct, 2009

Postby ghettosynth; Mon Apr 07, 2014 5:48 pm Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had hardware.

deastman wrote:Call it blasphemy, but I actually prefer sequencing my 777 from the DAW instead of using the internal one.


Sure, it's a different work flow. The things that I like are being able to change the loop point, accent, and glide in real time from each step. You get a lot of variation out of the sequencer that way. That said, the 777's choice of how midi affects the parameters makes it easy to sequence from a daw as well.

Part of the charm of live playing, of course, is the knobs and switches which can't be automated at all. Love that warp CV switch.

Some years ago I had a party and some friends saw my 777+909 and wanted to hear me play something. I gave them a little acid show. Afterwards they asked if they could try, sure, why not. They noodled for a couple of minutes, looked at me and said, "oh, I guess there's some skill involved." Yes, but not much. The party synth that just won't stop no matter who's playing, however, is the Star Instruments Synare. If your guests get ahold of that baby, it's bawooooughowww all night long. Each one seems to think that they haven't been playing for very long and everybody else just wants whoever's playing to stop so that they can have a turn.

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zerocrossing
KVRAF
 
7102 posts since 26 Jun, 2006, from San Francisco Bay Area

Postby zerocrossing; Tue Apr 08, 2014 8:49 am Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had hardware.

So... here we are again. :roll:

As a hardware synth (especially analogs) I'll go out on a limb and say that hardware synths make me want software. So easy to use and configure, as we all know. As for programming, I'm a little puzzled by the fact that so many people have problems with them. Sure, some are a bit confusing to use but once you get the hang of them... I imagine it would be the same as if I got put in front of someone else's big modular system. It would take a while to get the lay of the land.

So... why don't I just stay 100% ITB? Well I'm one of those deluded fellows who think an analog synth has sonic characteristics that have not been matched in the VA world. To the people who start comparing oscs, I say that's like comparing twins by looking at their eyeballs that have been removed... or looking at photos of them from 50 ft away.

Now take the same twins and spend a few hours with them in a room. All sorts of small differences add up really quickly and soon you'll think, "Why did I ever have a hard time telling these two apart? I listen to Diva and sometimes I wonder why people think it's the best vintage VA emulator. It's good, don't get me wrong, but the XILS Lab synths sound warmer and more organic to my ears. Diva sounds kind of modern in comparison. Now, of course, Diva and the XILS Lab synths are emulating different instruments so you can't compare them really, but I'm talking about a general impression. Also, I don't want people to think I equate vintage sound with better sound. To me I'd rather have a modern synth than deal with the issues of old vintage synths. I wouldn't even buy the MS20 Mini because I can't route velocity to filter or filter amount or anything.

But... well my hunch is that we're really close to finally putting a nail in this coffin, at least for me. I don't think analog synths are unemulatable. It's just a matter of time before clever programming and fast processors become The Way. As I type this I have a KingKorg on it's way and I'm thinking that it might be good enough for me to be able to clear out a few of my hardware synths. I guess I'll see. If a hardware VA can do it, I can't think of a reason that a software VA can do it at some point in the future.
Zerocrossing Media
http://www.zerocrossing.net
4th Law of Robotics: When turning evil, display a red indicator light. ~[ ●_● ]~
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zerocrossing
KVRAF
 
7102 posts since 26 Jun, 2006, from San Francisco Bay Area

Postby zerocrossing; Tue Apr 08, 2014 8:58 am Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had analog hardware.

V0RT3X wrote:Ok so don't get me wrong, i love what is offered but I guess I'm just saying I wish i had a hardware synthesizer and would buy one if i could afford it for analog synthesizer duties over a VA. At least for the more complex stuff, but i suppose for general purpose sounds Diva and Synthsquad do cover alot of ground which is nice.

For now I'll be content with Synthsquad and eventually I will be rebuying Diva because it is totally worth it. Maybe if i get enough saved up in the future I'll get a Doepfer A100 Modular built :)


Afford it? I don't quite understand statements like that when there are a nice handful of synths out now that range from $300-500 USD (and cheaper used) and software like Diva will run you $179. It's not like you have to save up for a Moog Voyager XL to get a taste of true analog.
Zerocrossing Media
http://www.zerocrossing.net
4th Law of Robotics: When turning evil, display a red indicator light. ~[ ●_● ]~
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V0RT3X
KVRAF
 
4007 posts since 3 Jul, 2012

Postby V0RT3X; Tue Apr 08, 2014 11:33 am Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had analog hardware.

zerocrossing wrote:
V0RT3X wrote:Ok so don't get me wrong, i love what is offered but I guess I'm just saying I wish i had a hardware synthesizer and would buy one if i could afford it for analog synthesizer duties over a VA. At least for the more complex stuff, but i suppose for general purpose sounds Diva and Synthsquad do cover alot of ground which is nice.

For now I'll be content with Synthsquad and eventually I will be rebuying Diva because it is totally worth it. Maybe if i get enough saved up in the future I'll get a Doepfer A100 Modular built :)


Afford it? I don't quite understand statements like that when there are a nice handful of synths out now that range from $300-500 USD (and cheaper used) and software like Diva will run you $179. It's not like you have to save up for a Moog Voyager XL to get a taste of true analog.



Your right and I am thinking about getting a Korg MS-20 to start off with. I am probably only going to really buy Semi-modular & modular synthesizers for the more wild analog stuff that is still kind of hard to nail 100% in a VA.


As far as my polysynth needs go I am well covered with VA software and I definitely will be rebuying most of the U-he stuff I sold off. I don't think I would ever buy a Voyager XL because it's friggin huge and i could get the same thing by buying the RME and two expanders which basically are built into the XL.
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4damind
KVRAF
 
3460 posts since 17 Aug, 2004, from Berlin, Germany

Postby 4damind; Tue Apr 08, 2014 11:49 am Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had analog hardware.

Maybe... I can understand musicians (not sound designers) if they move back to hardware. Software VAs are sometimes not very usable, they are over-complicated and often hard to use.
Frank Arnold Musician & IT Freelancer

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grabme
KVRist
 
104 posts since 9 Mar, 2010

Postby grabme; Tue Apr 08, 2014 12:24 pm Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had analog hardware.

I don't think having analog will allow you to create better music necessarily, it might inspire you to create something different. Once you have analog there will be more pressure on you to deliver the goods musically. :wink:
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cryophonik
KVRAF
 
4005 posts since 6 Sep, 2006, from Elk Grove, CA

Postby cryophonik; Tue Apr 08, 2014 12:54 pm Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had analog hardware.

grabme wrote:Once you have analog there will be more pressure on you to deliver the goods musically. :wink:


Sorry, but I totally disagree with that. First, analog, digital, hardware, software, etc. are all just different ways of making sounds. Anybody who thinks that other people need to somehow validate their acquisition of analog gear by demonstrating an improvement in the quality of their music needs to have their head (and ego) checked. Second, for many (but not all) people, making music is about the journey, not the destination. If using analog (or even digital) hardware synths makes the journey more enjoyable than clicking away on a mouse at a computer, that's really all that matters IMO. For me personally, the only pressure that I care about is the pressure that I put on myself to create something that I'm happy with (and, of course, the people that I may be collaborating with). Other people's expectations of what I do with my gear during my time means absolutely nothing to me.
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layzer
KVRAF
 
1587 posts since 11 Jun, 2006

Postby layzer; Tue Apr 08, 2014 3:01 pm Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had analog hardware.

V0RT3X wrote:and I am thinking about getting a Korg MS-20 to start off with.


good choice! i have a yamaha AN1x that never really impressed me much as far as a ballsy fat analog synth. thinking of putting it it up on ebay and look for a good deal on an MS20 myself! :D
i love my Akai AX80 for basses and i'm thinking the 20 will serve the leads roll very nicely :love:
HW SYNTHS [KORG T2EX - AKAI AX80 - YAMAHA SY77 - ENSONIQ VFX]
HW MODULES [OBi M1000 - ROLAND MKS-50 - YAMAHA TX802]
SW [DIM PRO - RAPTURE - Z3TA+ - CRONOX3 - KLC - RMiV]
DAW [ENERGY XT2/1U RACK XPSP3 PC/MAUDIO 1010LT PCI]
grabme
KVRist
 
104 posts since 9 Mar, 2010

Postby grabme; Mon Apr 14, 2014 12:51 pm Re: software VA synthesizers make me wish i had analog hardware.

cryophonik

Anybody who thinks that other people need to somehow validate their acquisition of analog gear by demonstrating an improvement in the quality of their music needs to have their head (and ego) checked


A bit confused about where the head and ego fit into this? I was actually complimenting software synths. My point is that some software synths are so good nowadays that it can be hard to justify owning hardware synths.

Ultimately you are looking for a source of inspiration so its irrelevant whether this comes from a soft or hard synth, however as with any financial outlay of significance comes some pressure to justify the expense. I'm speaking on a personal level, I couldn't care less whether 'other' people produce better material after purchasing hardware synths.
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