KVR Audio

cowby · Post by **cowby** » Fri May 02, 2014 3:01 am

Hi,

Anyone compared Blue 2 with Nemesis ? Will be picking up one of them soon.

I've played with the nemesis demo. sounds pretty different to other (I have FM8) but think I love the Blue 2 UI & some of the new features.(haven't demo but watched Youtube by Rob). Any recommendation which one to pick?

Regards!
Cowby

core · Post by **core** » Fri May 02, 2014 8:22 am

I did a short review on Nemesis at http://rekkerd.org/review-tone2-nemesis ... er-plugin/
Great synth, but quite different from BLUE 2 I think. I have only spent a little while with BLUE 2 yet, but it's outstanding as well. I am a sucker for pads and I think BLUE is the better option for this. Also, if you like presets, Rob's work is incredible. So make sure to demo it as well. I'd say you can't go wrong with either one, but it will depend on what kind of sounds/features you're after.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Fri May 02, 2014 8:34 am

I don't thimnk that Nemesis and Blue 2 are really comparable synth at all besides the fact that both seem to be capable of doing FM. Not sure if Blue 2 could do "real" Fm like the NeoFm modes in Nemesis, opposing to phase modulation used in most other Fm synths in the past. This could be a huge diffrence, especially when using more complex waveforms.
To get an idea i would have to program similar patches in Blue 2 and the Blue 2 demo.

I only have a short experience with the Blue 2 demo yet but had owned Blue which i sold a few yeras ago. I simly did not really use it. Same about Predator.
Still got Albino 3 which had another update before futher updates were discontinued and will be usable quite a long time due to being available as 64-bit.

FWIW 3 soundsets have been released for Nemesis already and another one will follow (like mentioned in the list at the website):
http://www.tone2.com/html/overview%20ne.html

In the "Classic FM" soundset for Nemesis only the phase modulation modes have been used and only waveforms based on the first 16 partials of the additive waveform editor (no waveform import). Opposing to this the upcoming new soundset should be based on only using the "NeoFM", the "Reso" and Formant modes.

The laest soundsets relased at Tone2 are "Synth Legends" for Saurus (just released) and "Rompler" for ElectraX:
http://www.tone2.com/html/synth%20legends.html
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 7&t=410547
http://www.tone2.com/html/rompler.html

Concerning ElectraX a bigger update seems to be in progress. No details yet.

Ingo

cowby · Post by **cowby** » Fri May 02, 2014 8:54 am

core wrote:I did a short review on Nemesis at http://rekkerd.org/review-tone2-nemesis ... er-plugin/
Great synth, but quite different from BLUE 2 I think. I have only spent a little while with BLUE 2 yet, but it's outstanding as well. I am a sucker for pads and I think BLUE is the better option for this. Also, if you like presets, Rob's work is incredible. So make sure to demo it as well. I'd say you can't go wrong with either one, but it will depend on what kind of sounds/features you're after.

I agree that Blue can produce very nice PAD sounds from various sources that I've learnt from the Web.

I will also try to request for a Demo this week end. But I hate myself not to spend just $99 to buy one 2 months ago......

Caine123 · Post by **Caine123** » Fri May 09, 2014 1:58 pm

is there any special sale somewhere?

i wanna get it but dont have 150 euros atm on paypal lol.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Fri May 09, 2014 2:19 pm

Caine123 wrote:is there any special sale somewhere?
i wanna get it but dont have 150 euros atm on paypal lol.

with the new Saurus soundset they added a "Bundle" with Saurus and all soundsets/expansios for 199 €:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 7&t=410547

Next Nemesis soundset is "work in progress".

Ingo

Caine123 · Post by **Caine123** » Fri May 09, 2014 2:24 pm

Ingonator wrote:
Caine123 wrote:is there any special sale somewhere?
i wanna get it but dont have 150 euros atm on paypal lol.
with the new Saurus soundset they added a "Bundle" with Saurus and all soundsets/expansios for 199 €:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 7&t=410547

Next Nemesis soundset is "work in progress".

Ingo

hehe this doesnt help if you read my post

*g*

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Fri May 09, 2014 4:46 pm

Caine123 wrote:
Ingonator wrote:
Caine123 wrote:is there any special sale somewhere?
i wanna get it but dont have 150 euros atm on paypal lol.
with the new Saurus soundset they added a "Bundle" with Saurus and all soundsets/expansios for 199 €:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 7&t=410547

Next Nemesis soundset is "work in progress".

Ingo
hehe this doesnt help if you read my post *g*

This was to show that sometimes they offer discounts too and those bundles will usually stay permanently.
Of course the bundle only helps if you want to get the synth with all soundsets.

I am quite sure that at one point (maybe when 6 or more soundsets are reached) a bundle will also be available for Nemesis.

Ingo

Caine123 · Post by **Caine123** » Sat May 10, 2014 10:37 am

finally got it

well no time until evening sadly

but as it is real fm, maybe some people program a DX7 bank?

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Sat May 10, 2014 11:17 am

Caine123 wrote:finally got it well no time until evening sadly
but as it is real fm, maybe some people program a DX7 bank?

Well, the FX7 and most other Fm synths did NOT use real Fm but phase modulation (which is found in the PM modes in Nemseis.

The patches in the "Classic FM" bank for Nemesis make exclusive use of the those phase modulation modes in combination with the additive waveform editor (in that bank only using the first partials of the additive editor were allowed, no waveform import). alsu use of teh Unison was forbidden in the "Classic FM" bank while e.g. using the Ensemble or Chorus FXs was allowed.

The next bank for Nemesis will focus on the "NeoFM", Resonant and formant modes.
In the formant mode the "NeoFM" knob controls the Formant frequency.

Ingo

Blue-eyed Blonde Ape · Sat May 10, 2014 3:58 pm

Caine123 wrote:finally got it well no time until evening sadly
but as it is real fm, maybe some people program a DX7 bank?

DX7 sounds are from it's 32 algos, want DX7 get FM8, Nemesis will only approximate it with it's waveforms and wave editor but it won't give DX7 since it's not DX7 recreation it's a "new" take on FM, at least they say so, in reality it's a synth with emphasis on FM and many features to take FM further and to make it more "interesting", won't get much DX7 classics from it, most of it will sound kind of like it, but if you want DX7 get FM8..
So "real FM" is different kind of real FM here and doesn't mean that one will be able to port sounds from DX7 or FM8 to it.

Ingonator · Post by **Ingonator** » Sat May 10, 2014 7:53 pm

Blue-eyed Blonde Ape wrote:
Caine123 wrote:finally got it well no time until evening sadly
but as it is real fm, maybe some people program a DX7 bank?
DX7 sounds are from it's 32 algos, want DX7 get FM8, Nemesis will only approximate it with it's waveforms and wave editor but it won't give DX7 since it's not DX7 recreation it's a "new" take on FM, at least they say so, in reality it's a synth with emphasis on FM and many features to take FM further and to make it more "interesting", won't get much DX7 classics from it, most of it will sound kind of like it, but if you want DX7 get FM8..
So "real FM" is different kind of real FM here and doesn't mean that one will be able to port sounds from DX7 or FM8 to it.

Like already explained older Fm synths inclusing the DX7 mostly did not actually use frequency modulation but phase modulation which in several cases could sound identical which also depends on the waveform used. Phase modulation does work properly with Sine and "Sonoid" waveforms while it does not work properly with more complex waveforms.
The "NeoFM" modes in Nemesis do use real frequency modulation and it is possible to use any waveform (including complex ones) properly.
It should be quite simple to notice a difference when using a certain waveform and switching between "NeoFM" and the PM/FM modes (= phase modulation).

Anyway as already mentioned Nemesis also includes a few phase modulation modes like in the DX and other older FM synths and in the "Classic FM" soundset this was used exclusively.

Ingo

Mac of BIOnighT · Post by **Mac of BIOnighT** » Sat May 10, 2014 8:07 pm

Whether it can copy sounds from the past or not, I've been programming sounds for it since before it was released, and I still find fresh ideas every single time I open it... and that can't be bad.

Caine123 · Post by **Caine123** » Sat May 10, 2014 8:33 pm

thanks so much, sorry but i need to learn more i guess, i know standard subtractive synthesis (im no sound designer, more a tweaker and accident sound designer ;D) how it works, but i dont understand for example how i need to set up Nemesis to get true FM sounds, which waves I MAY only use for it etc. for any help im REALLY thankful, i will download the manual today and try to read and understand.

or maybe how and what i MAY use to get vintage sounds

!

Mac of BIOnighT · Post by **Mac of BIOnighT** » Sat May 10, 2014 8:44 pm

Ingo is way more technical than I am, so I'm sure he can give better tips than I would ;-P
As to your being an accident sound designer, I can't help quoting Bob Ross: "We don't make mistakes, we only have happy accidents"

So I'm sure what you do is good

Tone2 Nemesis is released!