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reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

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Mickey21
KVRist
 
53 posts since 13 Mar, 2013, from Denmark

Postby Mickey21; Wed May 28, 2014 1:32 am reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

Hey guys..

Im looking for an answer to something that might be quite easy?.. i dont know..


In MANY tracks.. Before the actually vocal starts.. The artists slide it in with some kind of reverb / Reversed reverb before the vocal starts.. So it sounds like the actually vocal just in reverb or something?..

I know this is a pretty shitty way to explain it.. But i simply dont know what it is.. or what they do?..

Hope someone can help despite the shitty explaining!..

Mickey
Maadfoo
KVRist
 
249 posts since 27 Apr, 2005, from right beside you

Postby Maadfoo; Wed May 28, 2014 1:55 am Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

Maybe export your Vocals with a reverb on it as audio, import it in your host again and reverse it. But you should take care to cut all vocalsounds and just leave the reverb-sound. I mean that you only hear the noise of the reverb.
Keith99
KVRian
 
1044 posts since 15 Mar, 2007, from Yorkshire, England

Postby Keith99; Wed May 28, 2014 1:59 am Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

Yeh its a common trick, what you do is

1. create a new copy of the vocal track
2. reverse it
3. send it to a reverb and export just the reverb
4. bring this back into the project and reverse it again
5. position it correctly
svrc
KVRist
 
115 posts since 12 Sep, 2007

Postby svrc; Wed May 28, 2014 2:06 am Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

Reverse vocal, record with reverb and reverse again
JCJR
KVRian
 
885 posts since 17 Apr, 2005

Postby JCJR; Wed May 28, 2014 6:27 am Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

Mickey, as others explained, in some cases this could be an intentional effect, but in the case of music recorded before analog tape recorders became obsolete, the pre echo was very likely unintentional print thru. Something that "just happened".

When recording at hot levels, the layers of tape on the reel could corrupt each other, printing thru low levels of the audio from one layer of tape on the reel to an adjacent layer on the reel.

If it printed thru to a location later in time, the echo was quiet enough to be inaudible in most cases, but when it would print thru to a tape layer ahead in time, in quiet parts such as the beginning of a song, or a vocal solo break when instruments drop out, it was easier to hear the pre echo.

There were two ways to store tape, tails out (don't rewind after recording) and heads out (rewind the tape before putting it on the shelf). May be remembering wrong, but IIRC it was said that pre echo print thru could be minimized by storing tails out, but maybe that was a myth, or I remember it wrong.
Wildfunk
KVRian
 
712 posts since 26 Sep, 2008

Postby Wildfunk; Wed May 28, 2014 1:32 pm Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

Keith99 wrote:Yeh its a common trick, what you do is

1. create a new copy of the vocal track
2. reverse it
3. send it to a reverb and export just the reverb
4. bring this back into the project and reverse it again
5. position it correctly


svrc wrote:Reverse vocal, record with reverb and reverse again


I think it's more this order:

1. Export just the reverb of the vocal
2. Reverse the reverb sample
3. Put itbefore the actual vocal
User avatar
cryophonik
KVRAF
 
3964 posts since 6 Sep, 2006, from Elk Grove, CA

Postby cryophonik; Wed May 28, 2014 1:54 pm Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

Wildfunk wrote:
I think it's more this order:

1. Export just the reverb of the vocal
2. Reverse the reverb sample
3. Put itbefore the actual vocal


No, that will give you a copy of the reverb effect playing backward from the end of the song (or clip) to the beginning, so it won't be properly aligned with the original track. The other methods mentioned will give you a copy of the reverb that is playing from beginning to end and aligned with the original track, except that the reverb tails will fade in, rather than fade out.
User avatar
Biome_Digital
KVRist
 
70 posts since 9 Jan, 2014, from UK

Postby Biome_Digital; Wed May 28, 2014 2:21 pm Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

Keith99 wrote:Yeh its a common trick, what you do is

1. create a new copy of the vocal track
2. reverse it
3. send it to a reverb and export just the reverb
4. bring this back into the project and reverse it again
5. position it correctly


It's this. Reverse first word vocal, record reverb wet, reverse reverb and line up into the main vocal. Something like that should work.

Play around. Experiment! :0)
http://www.biomedigital.co.uk - Premium Samples & Presets
50% off In July! Sale EXTENDED!!!
JCJR
KVRian
 
885 posts since 17 Apr, 2005

Postby JCJR; Wed May 28, 2014 6:28 pm Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

Yeah, reverse reverb isn't unknown.

Here is what MAY BE an example of print thru for comparison. Starting at 4:00. Maybe it is an intentional effect in this song, but could easily be print thru on Robert Plant's voice. Sounds trippy in this context, a good effect even if possibly accidental.

The print thru effect could easily be done nowadays. Clone a track in the sequencer, advance the clone ahead in time, greatly reduce the volume and mess with the tone, maybe smear the pre-echo clone with a bit of reverb.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mln0RciE2o0
JCJR
KVRian
 
885 posts since 17 Apr, 2005

Postby JCJR; Thu May 29, 2014 9:21 am Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

Here is the reverse effect applied to long guitar chords, on a tune I recorded some 20 years ago. Copied the guitar off tape into digital performer which was slaved to tape. Cut the guitar track into individual one chord pieces, reversed each piece, then moved each reversed piece ahead in time so that each reversed chord ended right as the non reversed chord would begin.
http://errnum.com/MP3Files/Black%20Wido ... roDotz.mp3
BERFAB
KVRAF
 
5349 posts since 25 Mar, 2004

Postby BERFAB; Thu May 29, 2014 9:54 am Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

JCJR wrote:Yeah, reverse reverb isn't unknown.

Here is what MAY BE an example of print thru for comparison. Starting at 4:00. Maybe it is an intentional effect in this song, but could easily be print thru on Robert Plant's voice. Sounds trippy in this context, a good effect even if possibly accidental.

The print thru effect could easily be done nowadays. Clone a track in the sequencer, advance the clone ahead in time, greatly reduce the volume and mess with the tone, maybe smear the pre-echo clone with a bit of reverb.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mln0RciE2o0


As I was reading this thread from the top, I was thinking of asking about this exact tune. First time I heard it on a decent stereo as a kid in the '70's, I wondered if that was intentional.

Does anyone know for sure if this was intended? A "happy accident" perhaps?

-B
Berfab
So many plugins, so little time...
beau921
KVRist
 
84 posts since 5 Aug, 2009

Postby beau921; Thu May 29, 2014 10:07 am Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

I remember reading an interview with Jimmy Page where he discussed the 'Whole Lotta Love' effect.

He turned the tape around and played it [backwards] through the reverb, thus making what was first become last...reverb at the end coming before what was originally the start of the vocal line. He printed the reverb track, then turned the tape back around and played it [forwards], which made the reverb appear just before the vocal track began.
beau921
KVRist
 
84 posts since 5 Aug, 2009

Postby beau921; Thu May 29, 2014 10:08 am Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

I know...after the word "tape" that description doesn't help you much using a computer.
JCJR
KVRian
 
885 posts since 17 Apr, 2005

Postby JCJR; Thu May 29, 2014 11:09 am Re: reversed vocal reverb before vocal starts?

beau921 wrote:I remember reading an interview with Jimmy Page where he discussed the 'Whole Lotta Love' effect.

He turned the tape around and played it [backwards] through the reverb, thus making what was first become last...reverb at the end coming before what was originally the start of the vocal line. He printed the reverb track, then turned the tape back around and played it [forwards], which made the reverb appear just before the vocal track began.


Thanks, interesting to know it was intentional!

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