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Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

Plug-in hosts and other software applications discussion

Moderator: Moderators (Main)

HobbyCore
KVRist
 
403 posts since 5 Dec, 2007, from Location! Location!

Postby HobbyCore; Tue Jul 01, 2014 4:22 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

macmurphy wrote:it's restricted to sixty days, no?


It says it is, yes. Does it stop you? no.

In that time period, which amounts to around 45 hours of explicit demo use, I have produced zero public or private work in the software.

The evaluation box also doesn't account for how infrequently I've demoed it. That time period accounts for 2 explicit demo attempts and one time 'checking in' for about an hour. The software was deleted after each demo. I simply have been running the same 'system' (time machine backup restores) for 6 years now on various computers, so the license file appears to count the time since my first install of it.

Personally I feel that very little would be lost if I never looked at Reaper again, but I'm always looking to challenge my views and evaluate new options.
dwozzle
KVRist
 
182 posts since 27 Dec, 2012, from Boston area

Postby dwozzle; Tue Jul 01, 2014 5:02 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

I don't work for Cockos or speak for them, but it seems to me that HobbyCore's repeated explorations don't constitute adoption, and are within the spirit of Cockos' intent.

To put it differently, a person could decide it's not for them in its current state, delete it, and the next day they find out that something about it has or may have changed or they learn something new about using it, so they install it again for another trial. That's essentially what's happening here, minus the actual delete. I'd guess HobbyCore has updated it multiple times during that period, to see what's changed and how it works for him now.

If it's being used to make music, rather than to check it out, that's clearly a violation, but that's not what I'm hearing.
macmurphy
KVRAF
 
2390 posts since 21 Jul, 2004

Postby macmurphy; Tue Jul 01, 2014 6:42 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

edit. whatever...
macmurphy
KVRAF
 
2390 posts since 21 Jul, 2004

Postby macmurphy; Tue Jul 01, 2014 6:48 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

spaceman wrote:
macmurphy wrote:it's restricted to sixty days, no?


To quote Cockos:

The evaluation version of REAPER is complete and uncrippled. There are no artificial interruptions or restrictions, and you can save and load projects normally. We believe in giving you a fair chance to make sure that REAPER works correctly with your hardware and suits your workflow.

The REAPER installer simply copies REAPER and its support files to disk. It does not install anything except itself.

If after 60 days you decide that REAPER is not for you, simply delete it.

If you decide that REAPER is for you, you must purchase a license.


ahh thought so. the 'honour' system.
User avatar
aMUSEd
KVRAF
 
19656 posts since 14 Sep, 2002, from In teh net

Postby aMUSEd; Tue Jul 01, 2014 8:36 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

dwozzle wrote:I don't work for Cockos or speak for them, but it seems to me that HobbyCore's repeated explorations don't constitute adoption, and are within the spirit of Cockos' intent.

To put it differently, a person could decide it's not for them in its current state, delete it, and the next day they find out that something about it has or may have changed or they learn something new about using it, so they install it again for another trial. That's essentially what's happening here, minus the actual delete. I'd guess HobbyCore has updated it multiple times during that period, to see what's changed and how it works for him now.

If it's being used to make music, rather than to check it out, that's clearly a violation, but that's not what I'm hearing.


I did the same thing, I'm sure they are cool with this. I demo'd Reaper on and off for well over a year till I was convinced enough to buy it. I don't think there is anything wrong with that.
hibidy
KVRAF
 
40741 posts since 20 Dec, 2005

Postby hibidy; Tue Jul 01, 2014 10:40 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

The thing I can understand about reaper is that a person KEEPS coming back. It's like, it's almost there but not quite. Used to be there were so many updates it was just fun to watch it grow but I believe that has slowed quite a bit.
User avatar
chk071
KVRAF
 
2886 posts since 10 Apr, 2010, from Germany

Postby chk071; Tue Jul 01, 2014 10:51 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

dwozzle wrote:I don't work for Cockos or speak for them, but it seems to me that HobbyCore's repeated explorations don't constitute adoption, and are within the spirit of Cockos' intent.

To put it differently, a person could decide it's not for them in its current state, delete it, and the next day they find out that something about it has or may have changed or they learn something new about using it, so they install it again for another trial. That's essentially what's happening here, minus the actual delete. I'd guess HobbyCore has updated it multiple times during that period, to see what's changed and how it works for him now.

If it's being used to make music, rather than to check it out, that's clearly a violation, but that's not what I'm hearing.

Not that i want to make a bigger deal out of it than it is... but what is so difficult to understand about this?
The evaluation version of REAPER is complete and uncrippled. There are no artificial interruptions or restrictions, and you can save and load projects normally. We believe in giving you a fair chance to make sure that REAPER works correctly with your hardware and suits your workflow.

The REAPER installer simply copies REAPER and its support files to disk. It does not install anything except itself.

If after 60 days you decide that REAPER is not for you, simply delete it.

If you decide that REAPER is for you, you must purchase a license.

There is no room for interpretations there, it clearly says that you have to buy a license after 60 days of evaluating it. Especially with that kind of generous trial, i think one can just respect the usage agreement. Trialing it for over 2 years is nothing else but illegally using it.
Top-L
KVRer
 
11 posts since 28 Jun, 2014

Postby Top-L; Tue Jul 01, 2014 10:54 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

I deleted Reaper after about an hour.

Kind of like dating a foreign girl; if she's pretty you might be willing to overlook the language barrier. However, If she's dog ugly your tolerance for poor communication is much lower.
User avatar
ZenPunkHippy
KVRAF
 
10272 posts since 18 Jun, 2008, from Melbourne, Australia

Postby ZenPunkHippy; Tue Jul 01, 2014 10:59 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

chk071 wrote:There is no room for interpretations there, it clearly says that you have to buy a license after 60 days of evaluating it. Especially with that kind of generous trial, i think one can just respect the usage agreement. Trialing it for over 2 years is nothing else but illegally using it.

But there is a distinct difference between "trialling it wink, wink" every day for 2 years and deleting / reinstalling each update to check out new features / bug fixes etc.

It's this 2nd case that I think the OP was referring to, as far as I can see.
User avatar
chk071
KVRAF
 
2886 posts since 10 Apr, 2010, from Germany

Postby chk071; Tue Jul 01, 2014 11:05 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

Then i don't get the 60 days limit. They could just write "Trial it as long as you want". Or we go on making our own rules. My opinion is still that when a company makes such a generous trial offer, and puts so much trust in the people trialing it, then one can respect that. More than that, the moment you start the trial, you agree to their terms of usage already. And again, they allow you a trial period of 60 days.
HobbyCore
KVRist
 
403 posts since 5 Dec, 2007, from Location! Location!

Postby HobbyCore; Tue Jul 01, 2014 11:06 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

chk071 wrote:
The evaluation version of REAPER is complete and uncrippled. There are no artificial interruptions or restrictions, and you can save and load projects normally. We believe in giving you a fair chance to make sure that REAPER works correctly with your hardware and suits your workflow.

The REAPER installer simply copies REAPER and its support files to disk. It does not install anything except itself.

If after 60 days you decide that REAPER is not for you, simply delete it.

If you decide that REAPER is for you, you must purchase a license.

There is no room for interpretations there, it clearly says that you have to buy a license after 60 days of evaluating it. Especially with that kind of generous trial, i think one can just respect the usage agreement. Trialing it for over 2 years is nothing else but illegally using it.


I agree that there is no need for interpretation, but it appears that you have some trouble with reading comprehension.

"If you decide that REAPER is for you, you must purchase a license."

I certainly have at no point in time decided that Reaper is for me.
User avatar
chk071
KVRAF
 
2886 posts since 10 Apr, 2010, from Germany

Postby chk071; Tue Jul 01, 2014 11:11 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

HobbyCore wrote:I agree that there is no need for interpretation, but it appears that you have some trouble with reading comprehension.

Or maybe you do?
If after 60 days you decide that REAPER is not for you, simply delete it.
HobbyCore
KVRist
 
403 posts since 5 Dec, 2007, from Location! Location!

Postby HobbyCore; Tue Jul 01, 2014 11:20 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

chk071 wrote:Then i don't get the 60 days limit. They could just write "Trial it as long as you want". Or we go on making our own rules. My opinion is still that when a company makes such a generous trial offer, and puts so much trust in the people trialing it, then one can respect that. More than that, the moment you start the trial, you agree to their terms of usage already. And again, they allow you a trial period of 60 days.


I do not think you understand that the counter on the trial started when I first installed it to demo it 2 years ago. I demoed it, did not like it, deleted it. It was installed it once in the meantime for about an hour, deleted it.

About 13 days ago, I installed it again. Since the license/demo file resides elsewhere on the operating system from the .app, the counter was never reset. I deleted it already 3 days ago.

In the in between time I've used it at one other studio and stood-in with bands who had members who own Reaper. I've also checked the forum fairly frequently and read discussions elsewhere about the software.
HobbyCore
KVRist
 
403 posts since 5 Dec, 2007, from Location! Location!

Postby HobbyCore; Tue Jul 01, 2014 11:22 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

chk071 wrote:
HobbyCore wrote:I agree that there is no need for interpretation, but it appears that you have some trouble with reading comprehension.

Or maybe you do?
If after 60 days you decide that REAPER is not for you, simply delete it.


You do not seem to comprehend that when you delete Reaper.app on OS X, the file that keeps track of when you first opened the software is not deleted.

You could install it once 4 years ago, delete it, and if you open it again 4 years later it will say that you have been demoing for 1461 days.
User avatar
chk071
KVRAF
 
2886 posts since 10 Apr, 2010, from Germany

Postby chk071; Tue Jul 01, 2014 11:26 am Re: Maybe you folks could help me find my daw...

As i said, it's no big deal. It's just that i think saying "Oh well... i guess they're cool with it..." is not really the right way of dealing with it (i know you didn't say that, so it's not directed at you). I mean, the alternative would be to have a crippled, restricted trial, which wouldn't be satisfyable too. I think this kind of total trust in the people who trial your software is pretty unique, so the usage agreement could well be respected.
HobbyCore wrote:
You do not seem to comprehend that when you delete Reaper.app on OS X, the file that keeps track of when you first opened the software is not deleted.

You could install it once 4 years ago, delete it, and if you open it again 4 years later it will say that you have been demoing for 1461 days.

Well, when you trial Cubase now, activate the trial key, and don't touch it for 2 months, it has expired, and you won't be able to demo it at all. Tough luck. :P
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