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Tone2 Electra 2

VST, AU, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion

Moderator: Moderators (Main)

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KVRAF
 
7792 posts since 21 Mar, 2008, from Hannover, Germany
  

Postby Ingonator; Sat Jul 05, 2014 11:51 pm Re: Tone2 Electra 2

V0RT3X wrote:Apparently the synthesizers output a watermark in the signal of the synth, so maybe that's why tone2 synthesizers have a "sound" to them :hihi:

Whie Tone 2 uses watermarking there for sure is no watermark in the audio output of Tone 2 synths. Another rumor that was never proven.
Waldorf Beta Forum Manager
"Atmospheric Transients" for PPG Wave 3.V
"Analog vs Digital" for Blofeld
Win 7 64-bit / Live 9 / Reaper / Studio One 2.6 / Blofeld / Pulse 2 /Waldorf + Tone 2 plugins + others
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KVRAF
 
7792 posts since 21 Mar, 2008, from Hannover, Germany
  

Postby Ingonator; Sun Jul 06, 2014 2:18 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

According to Tone2's Faceboobk page Electra 2 will be released early next week which from now on should be a few days. Have not found details abou the upgrade price yet.
Last edited by Ingonator on Sun Jul 06, 2014 12:54 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Waldorf Beta Forum Manager
"Atmospheric Transients" for PPG Wave 3.V
"Analog vs Digital" for Blofeld
Win 7 64-bit / Live 9 / Reaper / Studio One 2.6 / Blofeld / Pulse 2 /Waldorf + Tone 2 plugins + others
KVRian
 
979 posts since 3 Jul, 2009

Postby sonicpowa; Sun Jul 06, 2014 4:48 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

Ingonator wrote:
V0RT3X wrote:Apparently the synthesizers output a watermark in the signal of the synth, so maybe that's why tone2 synthesizers have a "sound" to them :hihi:

Whie Tone 2 uses watermarking there for sure is no watermark in the audio output of Tone 2 synths. Another rumor that was never proven.

According to Tone2 it´s specifically audio watermarking, so we don´t know...
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KVRist
 
154 posts since 24 Jun, 2014, from Giza Plateau

Postby valerian_777; Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:03 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

sonicpowa wrote:According to Tone2 it´s specifically audio watermarking, so we don´t know...

That's pretty impossible no matter what they claim. ;)
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KVRAF
 
7792 posts since 21 Mar, 2008, from Hannover, Germany
  

Postby Ingonator; Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:11 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

Edited, nevermind...
Waldorf Beta Forum Manager
"Atmospheric Transients" for PPG Wave 3.V
"Analog vs Digital" for Blofeld
Win 7 64-bit / Live 9 / Reaper / Studio One 2.6 / Blofeld / Pulse 2 /Waldorf + Tone 2 plugins + others
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KVRAF
 
2482 posts since 18 Jul, 2008, from New York
  

Postby Frantz; Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:21 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

Ingonator wrote:But I know and based on what i know from Markus there is no audio watermarking...


So the manual contains lies?

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KVRAF
 
7792 posts since 21 Mar, 2008, from Hannover, Germany
  

Postby Ingonator; Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:26 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

Frantz wrote:
Ingonator wrote:But I know and based on what i know from Markus there is no audio watermarking...


So the manual contains lies?

Image


If the manual tells it it must be true...

Even if audio watermarking would be involved nobody could find an influence on rendered audio yet or detect the watermarking in rendered audio so far.
Last edited by Ingonator on Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:39 am, edited 3 times in total.
Waldorf Beta Forum Manager
"Atmospheric Transients" for PPG Wave 3.V
"Analog vs Digital" for Blofeld
Win 7 64-bit / Live 9 / Reaper / Studio One 2.6 / Blofeld / Pulse 2 /Waldorf + Tone 2 plugins + others
KVRian
 
979 posts since 3 Jul, 2009

Postby sonicpowa; Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:29 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

valerian_777 wrote:
sonicpowa wrote:According to Tone2 it´s specifically audio watermarking, so we don´t know...

That's pretty impossible no matter what they claim. ;)

It´s quite possible, there´s applications for it.
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KVRAF
 
7792 posts since 21 Mar, 2008, from Hannover, Germany
  

Postby Ingonator; Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:37 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

sonicpowa wrote:
valerian_777 wrote:
sonicpowa wrote:According to Tone2 it´s specifically audio watermarking, so we don´t know...

That's pretty impossible no matter what they claim. ;)

It´s quite possible, there´s applications for it.


No need to start and endless discussion on that topic again.

I would really prefer if at least once when discussing about Tone2 products there is a discussion about the actual product and not another flame war.
Waldorf Beta Forum Manager
"Atmospheric Transients" for PPG Wave 3.V
"Analog vs Digital" for Blofeld
Win 7 64-bit / Live 9 / Reaper / Studio One 2.6 / Blofeld / Pulse 2 /Waldorf + Tone 2 plugins + others
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KVRian
 
1103 posts since 1 Mar, 2010, from Paris, FR
    

Postby Karten; Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:39 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

I was under the impression that the watermarking was embedded as non-audio data in the audio files (wavetables) used by the synths.
That was, you could play them back without hearing any differences but if you tried to redistribute the raw wavetables, Tone2 would be able to tell.
Anyway, all this watermarking and file-searching has never bothered me. It's a way for protecting themselves that I'd prefer any day over a dongle or C/R activation.

And I'm looking forward to Electra2, which this thread should only be about.
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KVRist
 
154 posts since 24 Jun, 2014, from Giza Plateau

Postby valerian_777; Sun Jul 06, 2014 5:48 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

sonicpowa wrote:
valerian_777 wrote:
sonicpowa wrote:According to Tone2 it´s specifically audio watermarking, so we don´t know...

That's pretty impossible no matter what they claim. ;)

It´s quite possible, there´s applications for it.


No its not.

Don't make the mistake and confuse this audio watermarking with the watermarking of Sample-Libraries where they (only) can trace back to the owner of the leaked Lib.

I don't care anyway because i use legit stuff. I just can't stand "Facts" which try to make People believe something that isn't true. :)
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KVRAF
 
2780 posts since 10 Apr, 2010, from Germany

Postby chk071; Sun Jul 06, 2014 6:02 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

It surely isn't audible, i mean, that would be just silly, as a developer you fiddle and fiddle to get the sound right, and then you bring an uncontrollable element to the sound? Hardly believable. I think it's safe to say that Tone2 synths sound like they do, because the dev's want them to sound like they do.
KVRian
 
979 posts since 3 Jul, 2009

Postby sonicpowa; Sun Jul 06, 2014 6:05 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

valerian_777 wrote:No its not.

Don't make the mistake and confuse this audio wartermarking with the watermarking of Sample-Libraries where they (only) can trace back to the owner of the leaked Lib.

I don't care anyway because i use legit stuff. I just can't stand "Facts" which try to make People believe something that isn't true. :)

They haven´t been specific about the type of their watermarking (as far as I know) so it´s not so clear.
But anyway it´s possible and it even survives heavy tweaking. Try for yourself.

Btw, the Tone2 "sound" has nothing to do with the watermarking.
(that meaning it´s not audible)
Last edited by sonicpowa on Sun Jul 06, 2014 6:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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KVRAF
 
7792 posts since 21 Mar, 2008, from Hannover, Germany
  

Postby Ingonator; Sun Jul 06, 2014 6:15 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

chk071 wrote:It surely isn't audible, i mean, that would be just silly, as a developer you fiddle and fiddle to get the sound right, and then you bring an uncontrollable element to the sound? Hardly believable. I think it's safe to say that Tone2 synths sound like they do, because the dev's want them to sound like they do.


...and they have their own sound that does not really try to mimic the sound of synths from other develeopers (except mabye a Moog filter mode in a few of the Tone2 synths).

If you got all Tone2 synths (like i do) you should be able to notice that those could produce a huge spectrum of different sounds. Of course it is possible to program similar sounding patches. It is very difficult to reproduce some of the more digital sounds from Nemesis with e.g. Saurus and it is also very difficult to use Nemesis as a proper VA synth. Rayblaster could als produce some quite unusual sounds, depending on the waveform that is used (which is also used for the fiter response, even if no filter was involved with creating the waveform).

Not to forget that many people who complain about Tone2 synths sounding similar did not have a lok at the many soundsets available for the different Tone2 synths (each one with around 200 patches).
Personally i also got a bigger amount of patches taht were submitted but not included with soundsets yet (especially for Saurus and Rayblaster).

Electra 2 is more versatile and it would be easier to mimic sounds of other Tone2 synths with it than doing the same with the other Tone2 synths.



Ingo
Waldorf Beta Forum Manager
"Atmospheric Transients" for PPG Wave 3.V
"Analog vs Digital" for Blofeld
Win 7 64-bit / Live 9 / Reaper / Studio One 2.6 / Blofeld / Pulse 2 /Waldorf + Tone 2 plugins + others
KVRian
 
848 posts since 1 May, 2010

Postby xamido; Sun Jul 06, 2014 7:18 am Re: Tone2 Electra 2

Well anyway i cannot wait for Electra2. Just won their facebook give away last week and it also comes with free updates. :D
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