question about sfz format
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- KVRAF
- 2134 posts since 20 Sep, 2013 from Poland
Definitely 2, especially if you intend to share the samples - then it's guaranteed somebody will want to convert them to another format.
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- KVRian
- 901 posts since 3 Aug, 2001 from Montreal
You can tweaks volumes (in floating point dB using the volume opcode) in the sfz file without the "destructive editing" nature of the sample normalizing process.
my 2 cents.
my 2 cents.
David Viens, Plogue Art et Technologie Inc. Montreal.
https://twitter.com/plgDavid
https://plogue.com
https://twitter.com/plgDavid
https://plogue.com
- KVRAF
- 7124 posts since 8 Feb, 2003 from London, UK
Please, please, please never ever ever dream of normalizing individual samples in a library. Ever. Don't do it. Forget such a possibility might even have raise it's merest glimmer of consideration in your consciousness... please...
I've had to (okay, volunteered to...) convert a 10,000 sample library to SFZ2... all of the samples were normalised. I had to try to guess how loud each was meant to be relative to the other. It took me most of a year (in "spare time") to do it...
Personally, I reckon the facilities in SFZ2 make it much easier to achieve a natural tracking of MIDI velocity to volume when the samples aren't normalized, too.
I've had to (okay, volunteered to...) convert a 10,000 sample library to SFZ2... all of the samples were normalised. I had to try to guess how loud each was meant to be relative to the other. It took me most of a year (in "spare time") to do it...
Personally, I reckon the facilities in SFZ2 make it much easier to achieve a natural tracking of MIDI velocity to volume when the samples aren't normalized, too.
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- KVRAF
- 2134 posts since 20 Sep, 2013 from Poland
Depending on how you organize your velocity layers, it might be easiest use the amp_velcurve opcode, for example amp_velcurve_60=1 if across all notes you have a layer which tops out at velocity 60.
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- KVRist
- 33 posts since 11 Oct, 2012 from Stockholm
If I were to do something like that I would start out setting up my equip as for a high quality recording, then run through all notes/variations for that particular "preset" (picked guitar e.g) without changing any gear settings. Next step would be to shove all them samples into an audio editing program to measure their exact amplitudes. Hopefully there exists one you could script to name the samples after their amplitude in some nifty way.
Then i would make a small program/script that matched the samples to appropriate velocities based on their names/amplitudes. (After all, I don't think anyone can maintain a steady absolute picking amplitud of say 6 dB or 12 or whatever you can think of).
And, thinking a bit more, I would let the program spit out the complete sfz code for that particular "preset".
The bottomline being - record the samples and tailor the sfz after the actual result. The resulting velocity steps will vary from tone (pitch) to tone. But that's ok, after all you wanted it sound raw...
And if you wan't to check the result, create a set of midifiles, some with same velocities but different pitch to check the result. It should be even in amplitude.
Then i would make a small program/script that matched the samples to appropriate velocities based on their names/amplitudes. (After all, I don't think anyone can maintain a steady absolute picking amplitud of say 6 dB or 12 or whatever you can think of).
And, thinking a bit more, I would let the program spit out the complete sfz code for that particular "preset".
The bottomline being - record the samples and tailor the sfz after the actual result. The resulting velocity steps will vary from tone (pitch) to tone. But that's ok, after all you wanted it sound raw...
And if you wan't to check the result, create a set of midifiles, some with same velocities but different pitch to check the result. It should be even in amplitude.
- KVRAF
- 7124 posts since 8 Feb, 2003 from London, UK
I've a few scripts on my site that might do something like that -- it's pretty easy indeed. The results will always need tweaking to sound natural, though. There's a really nice utility called Voxengo Leveler, too - drop a bunch of samples on and it tells you their amplitudes.
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- KVRist
- 446 posts since 24 Apr, 2002
You were just given the samples - no control files (like Kontakt or something else)?pljones wrote:Please, please, please never ever ever dream of normalizing individual samples in a library. Ever. Don't do it. I've had to (okay, volunteered to...) convert a 10,000 sample library to SFZ2... all of the samples were normalised. I had to try to guess how loud each was meant to be relative to the other. It took me most of a year (in "spare time") to do it...
- KVRAF
- 7124 posts since 8 Feb, 2003 from London, UK
Yes, I had the Kontakt maps but I've never found a convert to SFZ 2 that works even vaguely as well as writing by hand. Go look at how I did it.chickeneps wrote:You were just given the samples - no control files (like Kontakt or something else)?
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- KVRist
- 446 posts since 24 Apr, 2002
I'm not sure why you you didn't consider contacting us (Chicken Systems with Translator); you could have cut your work down from what turned out to be a year to just a couple of days. If a convertor doesn't do the job for you, throw the problem back to the convertor manufacturer's court and let them handle it. I would have loved to do it for you.pljones wrote:Yes, I had the Kontakt maps but I've never found a convert to SFZ 2 that works even vaguely as well as writing by hand. Go look at how I did it.chickeneps wrote:You were just given the samples - no control files (like Kontakt or something else)?
If you remember and if you have time, please contact me at garth AT chickensys.com and let me know what the deficiency was. We'd love to fully address it.
- KVRAF
- 7124 posts since 8 Feb, 2003 from London, UK
Like I said, go take a look at what I did and see if you think you could have done it with any kind of automation.
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- KVRist
- 446 posts since 24 Apr, 2002
I'm not familiar with the URL of your site or other. Your earlier posts on this thread didn't seem to make that clear; forgive me if I've missed it, I just don't hang at KVR often.
- KVRAF
- 7124 posts since 8 Feb, 2003 from London, UK
All the relevant mappings are here: http://www.drealm.info/sfz/AnalogueDrums/ (Tape Series 2 at the top of the page)
The original sounds are here: http://www.analoguedrums.com/details-tapeseries2.php
The original sounds are here: http://www.analoguedrums.com/details-tapeseries2.php
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- KVRist
- 446 posts since 24 Apr, 2002
Thanks. I'm still pretty unclear about why a NKI->SFZ translation, then tweaking that, would have saved you months/years of time rather than remapping them completely by hand. Your web page just talks about the results of your mapping, it doesn't mention anything about why translations fall short or don't work. (Again, forgive me if I'm missing something.) Contact me at garth AT chickensys.com if you remember any of those things and can share them with us.
(Anyway, looks like you did a marvelous job! Congratulations.)
(Anyway, looks like you did a marvelous job! Congratulations.)
- KVRAF
- 5687 posts since 11 Feb, 2005 from Bordeaux France
Hey garth, could you please summarize for us the state of Kontakt->SFZ translations. What versions of Kontakt are actually supported, what banks formats specifically (nki,nkm, ...) That's not clear (at least for me) on your site.
You can't always get what you waaaant...
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- KVRist
- 446 posts since 24 Apr, 2002
This should be a Komplete (pardon the pun) statement:stanlea wrote:Hey garth, could you please summarize for us the state of Kontakt->SFZ translations. What versions of Kontakt are actually supported, what banks formats specifically (nki,nkm, ...) That's not clear (at least for me) on your site.
www.chickensys.com/products2/translator/formats.html
Any file saved with v4.1 and earlier can be converted. Any .nki or .nkm file saved with v4.2 can be converted but will ignore the modulators and filters. v4.2 .nkb's are not convertible yet. The file must reference WAVE or AIFF or SD II files, or if monolith must reference WAVE's inside the monolith; anything else is not convertible. These specs may and hopefully will improve in the future.
We write SFZ v2 opcodes so most SFZ's will reflect the Kontakt file fairly accurately. If there are any discrepancies anyone sees, we invite them to file a Bug Report at www.chickensys.com/translator/bugreports. This includes any Chicken product and also Kontakt's importing itself, since we support both.