How to use a sample pack?

[brekehan]

I've spent very little on sample packs. Only bought one before, from Wave Alchemy, and was disappointed. Perhaps, it is because I just lack the skills, but the drums sounded weak and most of the loops just sounded silly.

So, I gave it another go. Everyone seems to rave about Vengeance Club Essentials 1 & 2, so I plopped down the $100 to get Vol 1. I got a bonus check this week anyway, so fudge it. Learning fund.

I quickly went through the wavs, and it seems mostly drums and rolling basses.

My question is what is the best way to use these? I've seen very little on the net about how to load up samples from a pack and use them creatively. I can only assume their demo at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=av9bQeShNXw is chalk full of post processing. I'd like to recreate a few clips from there and see if I really got my money's worth.

I can load the drum samples into Battery 4 easy enough. But I am unsure how to treat the non drum sounds. They are all keyed at one note, so if I load it up into Kontakt or Live9's sampler, they will shorten and grow in length at different note values. Also, I wonder how I can get modulated sounds from them, like filter sweeps and such. They don't seem to have the same instrument at different cutoff levels, so I'd have to find some that are wide open and apply LP or HP afterwards?

Any suggestions? I've got Komplete 9 and Live 9 at my disposal.
Are there any videos anywhere covering the things I mentioned?

[brekehan]

Is the video false advertising or are we suppose to work magic on the samples? I went through every sample in it and I don't see anything that would sound like the bassline at 2:40 in their demo. Anyone familiar with it that can name off the sample they supposedly used? Did they do post processing on it? Use a slice of something? Loop one?

[DJ Warmonger]

Next time think about what you need before spending 100$ on it.

You didn't say what style you are after, where is your production and your skill now, what are you still missing and looking for.

They are all keyed at one note, so if I load it up into Kontakt or Live9's sampler, they will shorten and grow in length at different note values.

Ableton allows to control length and transpose separately in clip view. Not sure about Simpler, but I never tried to sample bassline or melodic loop with it, either. Results will most certainly be disastrous.

In general to usea lot of samples, you need to own hardware sampler. I own Push. It totally changes the perspective. But packs or gear can't make up for lack of creativity.

[brekehan]

Next time think about what you need before spending 100$ on it.

You didn't say what style you are after, where is your production and your skill now, what are you still missing and looking for.

They are all keyed at one note, so if I load it up into Kontakt or Live9's sampler, they will shorten and grow in length at different note values.

Ableton allows to control length and transpose separately in clip view. Not sure about Simpler, but I never tried to sample bassline or melodic loop with it, either. Results will most certainly be disastrous.

In general to usea lot of samples, you need to own hardware sampler. I own Push. It totally changes the perspective. But packs or gear can't make up for lack of creativity.

Well, I did think about it for a good month before I bought it. Everyone that I've spoken to, whom has production skills I envy, recommended it. My needs really consist of drums. Kick drums snares and claps in particular. Word on the street is Club essentials vol 1 and 2 is where to go.

As far as skills go, well who knows. I think I suck, but I've been at it for a few years and been tracking for 5 or so before that. I've yet to ever make a complete song that I'd feel good about showing any chick that gave me a boner, but on the flip side, I can listen to other's soundclouds and most of the time say to myself, "sheesh I can do better than that.", but who really knows.

I am not entirely disappointed. There are some samples on there that please my ear.

What I am posting about is that same feeling I had last time I bought a sample pack. You listen to the demo and say to yourself, "Wow that really sounds good. If I can even get that one sound, it will be worth it." Then you go through the pack, looking for that sound, and its simply not there. Maybe its possible to make it, but its not just a wav you're gonna load up.

Playing with it some more, I think they most definitely had to of layered drums together, layered snare and claps, played samples at varying positions, added effects, and things of that nature. (In fact, it really seems as if a lot of the drum samples are made to be layered together.) All of which, I suck at and need to learn to do. There seems to be very little I can find specific to using samples.

[DJ Warmonger]

Good samples are of course useful, but they are still only single samples. The age of Magic Music Maker is gone. In order to get anywhere with production, you need to tailor them to your needs. Layering, equalizing and other processing is necessary. But to get there, you need a goal. Vengeance samples will only complement your production, but are never the starting point.

Well, there are of course people who mangle tons of samples in real time to get some nice techno / breakbeat and what not. But to do that, you at least need to have lots of decent loops and a controller. Doesn't sound like that's what you're after, though.

[bailees7irish]

Good samples are of course useful, but they are still only single samples. The age of Magic Music Maker is gone. In order to get anywhere with production, you need to tailor them to your needs. Layering, equalizing and other processing is necessary. But to get there, you need a goal. Vengeance samples will only complement your production, but are never the starting point.

Well, there are of course people who mangle tons of samples in real time to get some nice techno / breakbeat and what not. But to do that, you at least need to have lots of decent loops and a controller. Doesn't sound like that's what you're after, though.

Hmmm... http://www.magix.com/us/music-maker/

[brekehan]

So, for comparison, here is their demo part looped from their youtube channel:
http://christopherpisz.strangled.net/te ... ceDemo.mp3

Here is mine after 29 hours of work, layering, EQs and effects everywhere trying my damnest to match it:
http://christopherpisz.strangled.net/te ... ceMine.mp3

I am pretty sure I found the same samples.
I'll be damned if I can find that swelling bass sound in there yet.

Lesson: Buying a samplepack will not make you sound anywhere near their demo until you reach sonic guru level.

[DJ Warmonger]

Basslines, especially main ones, are certainly the part you synthesize on your own every time.

Also, don't trust the ads

[ImNotDedYet]

I'm surprised you feel that way about the Wave Alchemy stuff. I really like their stuff and got the drum machine combo I believe as well as a couple other sample packs.

Anyway, if you load the sample into a Sampler on a drum rack in Ableton, or just a Sampler period, you can do all the modulation within Sampler. (I'm really growing to love Sampler as an instrument) Also, changing the Root Key on a Sampler for a sample you play on a different note (or modifying the scale) to account for the different pitches and hence not lengths is what you want. Regarding how to do that in Battery, I have no idea. But, I know that if you were to assign a sample to a cell in Battery, you could right-click the cell and change it's output (in the popup menu) to 1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8, etc. up to 15/16. Then have another audio track set to in that receives from the Battery-loaded track's 1/2, 3/4, yadda yadda.

[brekehan]

I'm surprised you feel that way about the Wave Alchemy stuff. I really like their stuff and got the drum machine combo I believe as well as a couple other sample packs.

Anyway, if you load the sample into a Sampler on a drum rack in Ableton, or just a Sampler period, you can do all the modulation within Sampler. (I'm really growing to love Sampler as an instrument) Also, changing the Root Key on a Sampler for a sample you play on a different note (or modifying the scale) to account for the different pitches and hence not lengths is what you want.

Regarding how to do that in Battery, I have no idea. But, I know that if you were to assign a sample to a cell in Battery, you could right-click the cell and change it's output (in the popup menu) to 1/2, 3/4, 5/6, 7/8, etc. up to 15/16. Then have another audio track set to in that receives from the Battery-loaded track's 1/2, 3/4, yadda yadda.

That's pretty much what I did in Battery, assign kick layers and output them to 3/4, tune them, adsr, etc in Battery, and then EQ and glue them in their own audio track. Same with snares, claps, etc. They simply don't sound as good as in the demo. They aren't terrible and I'll use them, it's just not a what you hear is what you get scenario, as was Wave Alchemy's pack when I listened to that demo. They should simply demo the sounds with no post processing for true advertising, throw in a "this is a demo of.." voice over it to stop the rips offs.

I used Kontakt for the instrument samples, just because it seems to have more control. I'll play with Live's Sampler to and see if the results vary. If I remember correctly, it only has start, end, filter, volume w/ mapping to velocity, adsr controls though, nothing super magical.

I'm sure with a big enough skill set, the demo sound could be acheived, it just seems deceptive to me that the demo makes one assume "Oh if I can get that sound right there, I'll be happy" only to end up with something that sounds like it came over a phone line.

I'll probably check out NI's Machine too (spelling) after I do more research.

[Biome_Digital]

$100 is a lot of money! Buying sample packs should give you samples and sounds for you to be creative with, not whole songs as you are still meant to do the production! Check out my sample packs (yeah that's shameless self promotion right there!) www.BiomeDigital.co.uk and email me with ANY questions you have and I will be happy to help you find what you are after, even if I don't sell it!

[kbaccki]

Lotta verb and delay and stereo processing and layering and... in that youtube clip... that's music production, friend... whether it's samples or synths or acoustic recordings or whatever... You need to have soemewhat of am aural vision of the sound you're trying to make before you can try to understand how toake that sound. In your case you're referencing the demo track... Start with the kick -- how is that sound made? Sounds thick and layered and probably "low end boosted", compressed, maybe a bit of hapnic distortion... Who knows! Try to reproduce one sound at a time... There's a heckuvalot going on in that track...

[brekehan]

To further make me unhappy, I see this when trying to open the exs files. I double checked both the zipped download and the folder I extracted to and they do not exist. Every exs file complains of missing samples.

Can anyone verify whether or not these examples exist in their copy of Vengeance Essential Clubsounds Vol 1?



I redownloaded to verify. Files aren't there. I really did buy this. I got the receipt!
These do come from https://refx.com right? I didn't go to some rip off site, right?

[msvs]

they had been renamed
B and H are german descriptions for the keys, the correct international descriptions are A# and B
so your Acid 12 B is named Acid 12 A#

[brekehan]

they had been renamed
B and H are german descriptions for the keys, the correct international descriptions are A# and B
so your Acid 12 B is named Acid 12 A#

Ah, excellent. So, if I rename all Bs to A#s and Hs to Bs, it should load up! I'll give it a shot tomorrow. Thanks!