How to make free synths sound crisp as Spire?
- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 185 posts since 27 Aug, 2014
Hello,
So if you heard Spire synth it sounds very crisp.
I think all the crispness appears after the affection of the shaping(distortion) section processing. So what's the logic of it? How can I create similar result just with some free synth and plugin chain?
For example GTG 44 S is great free synth but it lacks of crispness(sharpness). Same for Synth1. I would like to understand the logic to create that crispness to the sound so I could use GTG 44 S(or other not crisp synth) and get as crisp sounds with it as Spire or some other synths do.
P.S.
Check GTG has really good several free VST synths: http://www.gtgsynths.com/plugins.htm
So if you heard Spire synth it sounds very crisp.
I think all the crispness appears after the affection of the shaping(distortion) section processing. So what's the logic of it? How can I create similar result just with some free synth and plugin chain?
For example GTG 44 S is great free synth but it lacks of crispness(sharpness). Same for Synth1. I would like to understand the logic to create that crispness to the sound so I could use GTG 44 S(or other not crisp synth) and get as crisp sounds with it as Spire or some other synths do.
P.S.
Check GTG has really good several free VST synths: http://www.gtgsynths.com/plugins.htm
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- KVRAF
- 1675 posts since 3 May, 2014
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fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
GTG synths are made with SynthEdit. Here is one possible reason in my view: Most SE synths have Gibbs effect turned on, which one cannot turn off as a user, only the developer can turn it off when making the synth.
I have two synths which are exactly the same except for that Gibbs effect. The one where it is disabled has a lot more high frequencies, one can hear the difference particularly well with lower notes, but really, it happens across the entire keyboard. Now, when you have those higher frequencies, you can always take them away with the filter. But when they are missing to begin with you can't really create them out of nothing with an EQ.
Made two little examples, 100% identical settings:
https://app.box.com/s/c84enoe6o1f9bwtk4uqh
https://app.box.com/s/td0iebqa1akoe2wj0jz2
When I test a new synth, the first thing I do is go to one of the lowest octaves and try the sound of a simple saw. On good synths even very low notes don't sound muted. Proprietary synths always sound better in this respect.
I have two synths which are exactly the same except for that Gibbs effect. The one where it is disabled has a lot more high frequencies, one can hear the difference particularly well with lower notes, but really, it happens across the entire keyboard. Now, when you have those higher frequencies, you can always take them away with the filter. But when they are missing to begin with you can't really create them out of nothing with an EQ.
Made two little examples, 100% identical settings:
https://app.box.com/s/c84enoe6o1f9bwtk4uqh
https://app.box.com/s/td0iebqa1akoe2wj0jz2
When I test a new synth, the first thing I do is go to one of the lowest octaves and try the sound of a simple saw. On good synths even very low notes don't sound muted. Proprietary synths always sound better in this respect.
- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 185 posts since 27 Aug, 2014
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Touch The Universe Touch The Universe https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=190615
- KVRAF
- 4757 posts since 2 Oct, 2008
eq on spire adds alot too imo
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- KVRer
- 18 posts since 13 Aug, 2014
I'm not sure what you mean. Can you be a more specific about what you mean with crispiness? This can be different for everyone and you haven't given any examples, just an explanation. From from just listening to the difference between these synths, I'd say an exciter is exactly what you're looking.arseniy2 wrote:But exciter doesn't work that way.
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fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
Yes, I was also not sure what is meant by crispness. To me it implies the opposite of muffled somehow, but maybe he means something else...yiNXs wrote:I'm not sure what you mean. Can you be a more specific about what you mean with crispiness? This can be different for everyone and you haven't given any examples, just an explanation. From from just listening to the difference between these synths, I'd say an exciter is exactly what you're looking.arseniy2 wrote:But exciter doesn't work that way.
- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 185 posts since 27 Aug, 2014
Here made some example.
First it sounds as is(GTG 44 S), then more crisp from Bitcrusher, CamelCrusher and EQ.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/670 ... test1a.mp3
I m not sure how it described in sound. In images it opposites to sharp/blurred.
So I would like to know how to make sound more sharpen from some synths which cannot make such crisp sound like Spire or some other do.
First it sounds as is(GTG 44 S), then more crisp from Bitcrusher, CamelCrusher and EQ.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/670 ... test1a.mp3
I m not sure how it described in sound. In images it opposites to sharp/blurred.
So I would like to know how to make sound more sharpen from some synths which cannot make such crisp sound like Spire or some other do.
- KVRAF
- 8404 posts since 2 Aug, 2005 from Guitar Land, USA
I don't think you can get anywhere near Spire, that's an entire engine of quality. Maybe you could slap on a bunch of oversampling containers??
I would say if you honestly like it, then for you it's worth saving up for.
I would say if you honestly like it, then for you it's worth saving up for.
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https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCprNcvVH6aPTehLv8J5xokA -Youtube jams
https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCprNcvVH6aPTehLv8J5xokA -Youtube jams
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- KVRAF
- 35262 posts since 11 Apr, 2010 from Germany
Yeah, i double that. If you really like Spire's sound, then i'd rather go for it. You'll only be disapointed trying to mimic it with other synths. That's pretty much valid for any synth.RunBeerRun wrote:I don't think you can get anywhere near Spire, that's an entire engine of quality. Maybe you could slap on a bunch of oversampling containers??
I would say if you honestly like it, then for you it's worth saving up for.
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fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
I agree with RunBeerRun, it is just a different league. Those Russians would not spend so much time and effort on programming Spire if one could get the same sound out of any freeware SynthEdit synth as well. I don't know that GTG 44 S synth as such, but I assume its envelopes are also not as tight (yet another subjective word). Then there are zero-delay feedback filters and other aspects that set top-notch synths apart.arseniy2 wrote:Here made some example.
First it sounds as is(GTG 44 S), then more crisp from Bitcrusher, CamelCrusher and EQ.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/670 ... test1a.mp3
I m not sure how it described in sound. In images it opposites to sharp/blurred.
So I would like to know how to make sound more sharpen from some synths which cannot make such crisp sound like Spire or some other do.
Have you tried other freeware like Charlatan and Full Bucket stuff? Despite being freeware or donationware, they are clearly superior to any SE synth out there in terms of mere sound quality.
If for whatever reason you want to stick to the GTG 44 S, you can use the effects people have already mentioned to get at least a bit closer to Spire.
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- KVRist
- 439 posts since 20 Jun, 2005
Here's my take to sound crisp :
https://soundcloud.com/xorxist/crisp-test
All freeware, except Live's Eq8.
1st part thrillseeker xtc off, 2nd part on.
If it sounds like sh*t, please let me know
https://soundcloud.com/xorxist/crisp-test
All freeware, except Live's Eq8.
1st part thrillseeker xtc off, 2nd part on.
If it sounds like sh*t, please let me know
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fluffy_little_something fluffy_little_something https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=281847
- Banned
- 12880 posts since 5 Jun, 2012
Just downloaded that GTG synth, it sounds ok, pleasant even on the mid and low octaves. But also muffled as described above or below, depending on your board settings
No velocity knob, that's irritating And the GUI could be a bit bigger
Using just one oscillator and turning off the chorus makes things a bit less fuzzy.
No velocity knob, that's irritating And the GUI could be a bit bigger
Using just one oscillator and turning off the chorus makes things a bit less fuzzy.
- KVRist
- Topic Starter
- 185 posts since 27 Aug, 2014
Thanks.
I'm more need to save for new PC.
And what is oversampling containers?
I'm more need to save for new PC.
And what is oversampling containers?