Is Nine Volt Audio The New Crysonic?

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http://www.ninevoltaudio.com

Weren't they going out of business over a year and a half ago?

I tend to lose respect for companies who advertise a limited time sale, that seems to go on indefinitely, with what appears to be an attempt at luring unsuspecting customers into a 'get it while you can' sale.

NVA's limited time group buy has been going on since at least Nov of 2013.

There's nothing wrong with putting your products on permanent price discount. Just be honest with your potential customers.

How long is a limited time?

Carey
Last edited by careyletendre on Tue Aug 04, 2015 6:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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In a nutshell, no NVA isn't the new Crysonic.

Crysonic were a company which had the strange idea to constantly spam potential customers (thus stopping them from wanting to be customers) almost weekly / daily about 4 years ago.
Their products were, at best, mediocre.
They also never responded to any emails / messages / complaints.


Nine Volt Audio, or to be precise the man Kyle Z, doesn't spam customers / ex-customers weekly/daily.
The sample libraries were good for their time (peak 2008-2011) and introduced a pretty useful REX stretching idea that was ahead of most other competitors (check SoundOnSound for reviews etc).
Even now Kyle will respond to emails / messages / complaints.

I take your point about a never-ending ''limited discount'' sale seeming a bit weird (although the sale was pulled for a few months after NVA officially closed in 2012-ish due to piracy issues).
However, this issue has already been raised in a couple of previous threads last year at KVR.

I've got no idea why Kyle still advertises it as a limited time sale - perhaps you should ask him?

Either way, the NVA libraries are pretty good even now and I don't have any major problem with a permanent ''time limited'' discount.

FWIW, Kyle's new company In Session Audio has been producing some excellent guitar libraries in the past couple of years.

So no, NVA are not like the spamtastic cowboys Crysonic.
Last edited by Doug1978 on Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Yeah, they are definitely heading that way. I mean crysonic is the undefeated champion, but NVA is taking steps in that direction. I agree that a permanent limited time out of business sale is questionable business conduct.

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My main tools: Kontakt, Omnisphere, Samplemodeling + Audio Modeling. Akai VIP = godsend. Tari's libraries also rock.

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They're getting there a bit I guess
circuit modeling and 0-dfb filters are cool

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I guess what's rubbing some the wrong way is his use of the phrase "going-out-of-business sale". Well... so what? Are you being spammed at all about this sale? No.

I don't see the problem. I can understand Kyle not wanting to clutter his new website with the legacy stuff, and IMO, $200 for the bundle is a good deal, especially if you use a lot of loops in your productions.

Basically, you have a reputable vendor offering his older, but still useful, products at a nice bundled price. By doing this, he can still make a few bucks on a sale here and there, and a popular line of product doesn't disappear off the internet.

Kyle's a good guy, and has always stood by his products and customers. That fact should be the final criteria of this argument. :roll:

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careyletendre wrote: I tend to lose respect for companies who advertise a limited time sale, that seems to go on indefinitely, with what appears to be an attempt at luring unsuspecting customers into a 'get it while you can' sale.

NVA's limited time group buy has been going on since at least Nov of 2013.

There's nothing wrong with putting your products on permanent price discount. Just be honest with your potential customers.

How long is a limited time?

Carey
To answer your question "How long is a limited time?" I would say it's as long as it pays. Doing this kind of indefinite closing sale is a way to get sales (through web searches), it's a well known marketing technique and it's not totally dishonest because it will eventually close for good (when it will stop bringing money in). So it's really a close out sale, but without any specific closing date.

Is it fishy? A lot of marketers like to play with words, giving the impression that something will not be available forever, when in fact it can come back any time (or not). I don't like to use those techniques myself, but I can see why they are doing this (it pays). Most people who will see the site will either be interested or not, few people will come back after years just to see if the thing they didn't bought is still for sale.

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Well first of all, it actually is illegal in all 50 U.S. states for a business to advertise a going out of business sale when it is NOT legally in the process of going out of business. Regulations can be found under the FTC's deceptive advertising guidelines, but every state has related laws because there has been a great deal of retailer abuse of "going out of business sales" on regional levels by retailers. FTR, I'm a very experienced marketer, from the world of big brands, with accolades from more than one of the largest U.S. marketing associations as a marketing expert.

Now, if the question is, "Will 9 Volt Audio be prosecuted?" I'd say it's unlikely because it's such a small business and it would take a very persistent and angry customer or more likely group of customers bringing this to the attention of his/her state attorney general because there's a lot of this kind of deceptive advertising going on. It's a textbook example of deceptive advertising. So, I completely understand why this business'es practices are so disturbing to many people. We want the businesses/developers we deal with to be fair and honest and to see one be so brazenly dishonest is upsetting. I recently saw a promoted post in my feed from Facebook from Nine Volt Audio -- probably two years from the first time I saw an ad from the dev promoting 9 Volt Audio "going out of business sale." Again, this clearly falls under false advertising laws and would be a slam dunk in the court system if someone pursued this matter with an interested attorney general. But I would first suggest someone contacting the developer and pointing out this and some of the other past threads about his fake going out of business sales first to see if he has any interest of correcting his practices and doing the right thing.

From the FTC:

"WHEN CAN A COMPANY ADVERTISE A "GOING OUT OF BUSINESS SALE"?
The short answer is: only when a store is going out of business. It would be deceptive to advertise a “going out of business sale” when a store is not going out of business. If a store in your area is advertising what looks to be a bogus “going out of business sale,” contact your state Attorney General’s office."

https://www.ftc.gov/tips-advice/busines ... l-business
Last edited by eDrummist on Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Was this there before this thread was posted?

Why are we doing this?

We recently gave away a free loop collection and in less than 10 days there were over 4500 downloads of the library.

We received a ton of emails from musicians that were hearing of Nine Volt Audio for the first time.
Many of these emails said something like:

“Please: Can I still get the ‘Going Out of Business’ collection at the $199.99 Group Buy price?”

For now, the answer is: YES!
Its not like they are saying "Buy now! Going out of business sale! Get it before its gone!!!"

Seems up front well enough.

Calling them Crysonic is harsh especially since there's no spam or broken promises, or complaints about support... bla, bla, bla. I don't understand the problem.

Also I'm sure after reading this, they might be more inclined to close it up rather than tarnish their reputation by being lumped together with Crysonic... Which will probably lead to emails asking for the deal (as it is a ridiculous amount of content for $199), which is probably why they left it up (easier to have an automated sale, than to respond manually to every request - plus when you are in the business of selling products, why not sell what is already a finished product).

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They are nothing like Crysonic. And Crysonic isn't necessarily bad.
Hey - most of you people want this world of chopping up our lives into arbitrary bits of money and fighting over it. So don't get butthurt when the people who run companies do what they have to do to survive. f**king planet full of salespeople and freeloaders.

:D

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Technically, they keep changing the name of the sale, which you're kind of allowed to do (more or less, and with caveats), but ultimately no, this does seem a bit dishonest. And you're not allowed to "re-open for a limited time" but still offer a "going out of business" discount. It's one or the other.

Besides, when I asked them a year ago, they said the new company (In Session Audio) was going to handle the loops and licensing. I didn't want to have a problem with a license for loops when the company I bought them from disappeared a week later.

I guess they didn't transfer the license business or any of the existing loop libraries to In Session Audio.

Steve
Here's some of my stuff: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife. If you hear something you like, I'm looking for collaborators.

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planetearth wrote:Technically, they keep changing the name of the sale, which you're kind of allowed to do (more or less, and with caveats), but ultimately no, this does seem a bit dishonest. And you're not allowed to "re-open for a limited time" but still offer a "going out of business" discount. It's one or the other.

Besides, when I asked them a year ago, they said the new company (In Session Audio) was going to handle the loops and licensing. I didn't want to have a problem with a license for loops when the company I bought them from disappeared a week later.

I guess they didn't transfer the license business or any of the existing loop libraries to In Session Audio.

Steve
When people post that it is dishonest... are they also reading what is listed on their website???? I included it in my post above.

What part is dishonest?

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Melda must be the second runner up. I get e-mails from them nearly every single day announcing one of their never-ending sale bullish*t.

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So, the point here is that people want him to stop selling the old loops? And why exactly would that make you happy?

I like the Melda sale format just fine. They’re very clear about what it is, it’s called the eternal sale and it’s explained in the email. I bet they’d take you off the mailing list if you asked.

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bongo_x wrote:So, the point here is that people want him to stop selling the old loops? And why exactly would that make you happy?

I like the Melda sale format just fine. They’re very clear about what it is, it’s called the eternal sale and it’s explained in the email. I bet they’d take you off the mailing list if you asked.
I don't see where anyone suggested that Nine Volt Audio should stop selling the old loops.

The concern has been about their (seemingly) never-ending "going out of business" sale on those loops. Just lower the damn price already and stop calling it a "sale". The discounted prices are the effective sale price anyway, and have been for months. Lower the price, stop pretending you're "going out of business" (only to "re-open" again), and no one will be able to complain about the seemingly shady practices.

Steve
Here's some of my stuff: https://soundcloud.com/shadowsoflife. If you hear something you like, I'm looking for collaborators.

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