Arturia Matrix 12 vs Jupiter 8?

[Mutant]

I love Diva, but I have yet to hear it sound like any of the hardware synths I used to have when trying to program those "outside the box" sounds, nor have I heard any emulation pull it off.

Hmm... are you sure it is not just nostalgia distorting your memory ?
Can you provide some examples to these un-emulateable sounds ? (raw synth output, no effects)

[wagtunes]

I love Diva, but I have yet to hear it sound like any of the hardware synths I used to have when trying to program those "outside the box" sounds, nor have I heard any emulation pull it off.

Hmm... are you sure it is not just nostalgia distorting your memory ?
Can you provide some examples to these un-emulateable sounds ? (raw synth output, no effects)

Not personally because I sold all my hardware but I am sure if I dig through YouTube long enough (which I have no intention nor time to do) I can find at least one of these dudes who loves to turn dials and sh*t and make the most strange noises that particular synth can make.

In fact, just recently, I watched a synth demo on YouTube (wish I could remember the name of the synth but it was the topic of a thread here earlier this year) that totally blew me away with its unique sound. I'd pay big money to get an emulation that could do all that. Sadly, as of right now, it's not happening.

I guess I could go through my Youtube history and find the synth. It wasn't a big name brand. in fact, it was a very obscure synth, relatively speaking. If I think of it, I'll post the link and you can listen for yourself.

[dcfac73]

I rarely use Jupiter 8V and Matrix-12V without any external FXs but with them, especially a Bass enhancement plugin and a nice Reverb (+ a Chorus and/or Delay if necessary), they could sound really great.

With Diva adding external FXs is not so much necessary but could be nice too.

That's the thing isn't it. Even a freeware synth could sound fantastic with the right application of fx.

No i do not agree. Adding FXs will not make an average freeware synth sound like a Jupiter 8 or Matrix 12. They will also not make a totally crappy synth sound as great as e.g. Diva or other high quality emulations.
IMO for example OBXD sounds great and the sound quality is comparable to some expensive commercial synths.
Anyway i had found that adding certain FXs (e.g. a Chorus and a Reverb) made it sound better for me.

Even with real analog synths people have used external FXs for ages so it's no "cheating".

For me the point of adding external FXs to Jupiter 8V or Matrix 12V is also not to make them sound closer to the real thing but make them sound the way i like it.

"

"
No i do not agree. Adding FXs will not make an average freeware synth sound like a Jupiter 8 or Matrix 12."
"Even with real analog synths people have used external FXs for ages so it's no "cheating"."

I didn't say any of that, did I?
I was merely saying that even free/cheap synths could sound fantastic if programmed and mixed properly in the context of a track.
If I played you a chart hit song, would you be able to identify the source of the synths? Eg software,hardware, payware, freeware, which brand/model , analog or digital, emulation or original?

I'm not sure if the op was asking which was the better emulation, or which was the better sounding synth?

[pdxindy]

I love Diva, but I have yet to hear it sound like any of the hardware synths I used to have when trying to program those "outside the box" sounds, nor have I heard any emulation pull it off.

Hmm... are you sure it is not just nostalgia distorting your memory ?
Can you provide some examples to these un-emulateable sounds ? (raw synth output, no effects)

One of the great things about Diva, is that it holds up and still sounds great at extreme settings... not saying it will sound exactly like a specific synth, but that is has the character of an analog synth when you push it. Most soft synths start falling apart there.

[dcfac73]

Double post

[dcfac73]

Triple post

[Teksonik]

neither the M12 nor the Jupiter 8 qualify as "crappy hardware" no matter what you think about them.

Yea they really are crappy.......no matter what you think about them.

the fact that what was really cool in the late 80s isn't all that interesting anymore.

They weren't really cool back then either. I just wish I had bought up a boat load of them dirt cheap back then so I could sell them for the silly prices they command now. As an investment they have their value.

[Teksonik]

turn dials and sh*t and make the most strange noises that particular synth can make.

There you have it......emulations just can't nail those farting sounds.....what a shame.

[Mutant]

I love Diva, but I have yet to hear it sound like any of the hardware synths I used to have when trying to program those "outside the box" sounds, nor have I heard any emulation pull it off.

Hmm... are you sure it is not just nostalgia distorting your memory ?
Can you provide some examples to these un-emulateable sounds ? (raw synth output, no effects)

Not personally because I sold all my hardware but I am sure if I dig through YouTube long enough (which I have no intention nor time to do) I can find at least one of these dudes who loves to turn dials and sh*t and make the most strange noises that particular synth can make.

In fact, just recently, I watched a synth demo on YouTube (wish I could remember the name of the synth but it was the topic of a thread here earlier this year) that totally blew me away with its unique sound. I'd pay big money to get an emulation that could do all that. Sadly, as of right now, it's not happening.

I guess I could go through my Youtube history and find the synth. It wasn't a big name brand. in fact, it was a very obscure synth, relatively speaking. If I think of it, I'll post the link and you can listen for yourself.

Wasn't the YT video one of the Modals by any chance ?

Also we must be different on the "strange noises" actually beaing usable for anything other than toying with a synth alone in a dark room (which of course is fun too).

[Teksonik]

toying with a synth alone in a dark room (which of course is fun too).

I don't think it's a synth they are toying with in a dark room............

[ghettosynth]

neither the M12 nor the Jupiter 8 qualify as "crappy hardware" no matter what you think about them.

Yea they really are crappy.......no matter what you think about them.

the fact that what was really cool in the late 80s isn't all that interesting anymore.

They weren't really cool back then either. I just wish I had bought up a boat load of them dirt cheap back then so I could sell them for the silly prices they command now. As an investment they have their value.

I'm not really sure what you think that you're adding to the conversation? Obviously you have some definition of crappy that is out of alignment with the history of synthesizers. The M12 was the most powerful polyphonic analog on the market in 1986. With the exception of the long term reliability of the encoders, it's really decent engineering. I don't see how that qualifies as crappy. Both synths sell for thousands of dollars today.

Today, musically, I don't get as excited as I used to, but, you didn't have very many alternatives that were better in any dimension that you care to discuss.

There's no shortage of crappy hardware littering synthesizer history, but I don't think that you'll get very many people to agree with you that most of the major flagship synths of the big 3 (or 5 at the time) are/were crappy. For a mod/admin, you're coming off as a troll.

[Teksonik]

I'm not really sure what you think that you're adding to the conversation?

A refreshing dose of reality...........

Obviously you have some definition of crappy that is out of alignment with the history of synthesizers.

No I have a definition of crappy that was shared in the late 80's. No one cared about these limited dinosaurs. We were excited about the new forms of synthesis that could create new and exciting sounds....

Both synths sell for thousands of dollars today.

So does an ancient Ferrari but it can't perform nearly as well as today's super cars. The Ferrari has a collector value because they didn't make many and there aren't too many left not because they can compete with performance today.....just like ancient hardware synths........

For a mod/admin, you're coming off as a troll

Why ? Because I'm expressing an opinion you don't like ? If posting dissenting opinions were the benchmark the entire KVR member base would be "trolls"..........

[Mutant]

In fact, just recently, I watched a synth demo on YouTube (wish I could remember the name of the synth but it was the topic of a thread here earlier this year) that totally blew me away with its unique sound. I'd pay big money to get an emulation that could do all that. Sadly, as of right now, it's not happening..

Wasn't the YT video one of the Modals by any chance ?

Or maybe this one ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KEdj4A818XU
It is pretty high on my "good analog sound" list.

[wagtunes]

I didn't find the exact video but I did find the synth.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-h8FGCxCEgA

[ghettosynth]

Obviously you have some definition of crappy that is out of alignment with the history of synthesizers.

No I have a definition of crappy that was shared in the late 80's. No one cared about these limited dinosaurs. We were excited about the new forms of synthesis that could create new and exciting sounds....

No, that's not true, even then M12s were expensive, and although people were looking at new gear, I don't recall people talking about classic polys as crappy.

Both synths sell for thousands of dollars today.

So does an ancient Ferrari but it can't perform nearly as well as today's super cars. The Ferrari has a collector value because they didn't make many and there aren't too many left not because they can compete with performance today.....just like ancient hardware synths........

That doesn't make it "crappy hardware."

For a mod/admin, you're coming off as a troll

Why ? Because I'm expressing an opinion you don't like ? If posting dissenting opinions were the benchmark the entire KVR member base would be "trolls"..........

[/quote]

No, not at all. The use of inflammatory language without support is what makes you seem like a troll. Your definition of crappy is essentially, "not new." Yet, in fact, many of the synths that the masses dumped were replaced with synths that are/were truly crappy by any number of technical metrics. Basically, many regretted their overzealous foolishness at dumping powerful synthesizers to obtain crappy new digital filters. That's why the market is what it is today. In fact, from a performance point of view, there have been very few new analog polys that could compete with vintage synths.

I like analogs, I'm not a fanboy, I will use a plugin for most sounds. I think that there were a lot of mediocre synths, but neither the Jupiter 8 nor the Matrix 12 qualify as "crappy."

Honestly, anyone who would ask the question why would anyone want to clone a vintage synth doesn't strike as someone who has the kind of experience necessary to be a good moderator of a synth plugin forum. It reflects either a trolling mentality or a truly astonishing level of ignorance.