Halion 5 vs. Falcon Granular Synthesis?

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Uncle E wrote:HALion
Excellent included library
Good sound design capabilities
Very easy to use

Falcon
Weak included library
Exceptional sound design capabilities (perhaps the best currently available)
Easy to use as a UVI player but quite complex and difficult as a synth
Yes. Best breakdown yet.

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The library is by far the weakest part of Falcon. I'm actually considering buying a used Machfive 3 just so I can use its library in Falcon. Falcon is otherwise a sound design dream and jaw dropping tool kit, but for those who sometimes want to just dive in and play, it is lacking. I find it particularly odd that there is so little sample content, because working with samples in Falcon is where it has most shined for me, thus far. I'm still just getting my bearings, however.
Tangled roots perplex her ways.

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thejonsolo wrote:
Uncle E wrote:HALion
Excellent included library
Good sound design capabilities
Very easy to use

Falcon
Weak included library
Exceptional sound design capabilities (perhaps the best currently available)
Easy to use as a UVI player but quite complex and difficult as a synth
Yes. Best breakdown yet.
+1
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To come back to the original subject, granular synthesis in Falcon and in Halion5, keeping in mind that I have Falcon but not Halion 5 and as a Cubase user I am very tempted by Steinberg's Halion5 StValentine offer, here is what Simon Stockhausen writes about both compared (including PadshopPro) :

With Falcon a new multi-granular engine was introduced, it now plays up to 8 grain streams like HALion and Padshop do and there are numerous controls for shaping the grains, also those streams can be spread out up to 15 second (up to 100% in H5/PSP), Where HALion/PSP are still superior is, that they can randomize grain position over the entire sample whereas Falcon only does up to 500 ms, and they have a few more grain shapes available as a selectable preset and you can set different quality modes for sample interpolation to avoid aliasing when extremly transposing samples (especially down), Falcon only has a high interpolation mode for normal sampling. Then HALion can do crossfade looping for granular samples, actually the only granulator which does this, Falcon loops forward or alternate back and forth without crossfading.
But Falcon is almost up to par now with the Steinbergs concerning granular synthesis.

EDIT: and Falcon/HALion are of course far superior to Padshop Pro, as they can granulate multi-sampled instruments with hundreds of keygroups/zones, PSP can only use 2 samples per patch and doesn't have a mapping function (in PSP you can only fade out samples towards one end of the register by assigning key follow to volume, so fake splits are sort of possible).

EDIT 2: and HALion/PSP have grain lengths up to 1 second, Falcon up to 500 ms (crusherX up to 1 minute).
Windows 7, Cubase 9.5 and some extra plug-ins | Takamine EN-10C and PRS Mira

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So my personal take is: For as far as granular synthesis is concerned, Falcon is close to Halion5, but Halion will normally be the next to upgrade. As a synth, I like Falcon a lot. Once its structure is grasped it is more a question of gaining experience that of a steep learning curve. Halion on the other hand comes with lots and lots or other things included: sampled instruments, synths,... that UVI sells separately.

So yes, I am very tempted and hate that time limit - I hate to have to choose 'now'. For example: I got the Steinberg Symphonic Orchestra and I cannot get rid of something as basic as vibrato in the solo strings. And I will get a lot! that I probably won't ever use.

Yet, if it were only for granular, I'd choose AccSone's CrusherX which is arguably less 'poppy', less 'dance' but a serious tool for the Xenakis etc kind of sound sculptor.
Windows 7, Cubase 9.5 and some extra plug-ins | Takamine EN-10C and PRS Mira

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I'm pretty sure we will see Halion 6 this year
Released in 2013 and normally Halion will be updated every 2 years. So it's already more than 2 years ;)
Synth Anatomy
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Sound Design and Software / IOS Synthesizer Videochannel

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That may indeed be the catch! The end of Halion5 is near, so sell what can be sold in a half-price Valentine offer and come with Halion6 after the grace period so most of the new users will upgrade without complaining too much because they did get half price after all.
Mmmm...
Windows 7, Cubase 9.5 and some extra plug-ins | Takamine EN-10C and PRS Mira

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Caine123 wrote:halion5 is on sale and im a sucker for granular synthesis, i still use alchemy and NOTHING could replace it for me. falcon i couldnt get quite into it yet, so i ask how halion 5 is compared?
For granular synthesis purpose only, I don't think you need to that deep or far as Falcon. It's overkill. Falcon is much more than just a granulator. If you buy it, you buy it for OTHER reasons than just and only the granulation it can do.

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ErikH wrote:That may indeed be the catch! The end of Halion5 is near, so sell what can be sold in a half-price Valentine offer and come with Halion6 after the grace period so most of the new users will upgrade without complaining too much because they did get half price after all.
Mmmm...
Well I picked this up on their online store yesterday. What you get after purchase is an activation code, just like the box. The store account is separate from the MySteinberg account. And my purchase record does not automatically show up in MySteinberg after purchasing. I'm not sure, but I believe if you want you can hold off on activating until 6 is on the horizon. That may get you the free upgrade. They are very clear that the grace period is relative to activation date, not to purchase date.

In any event, I'm in no rush so I'm holding off on downloading and activating. Still have a lot of work to do in Falcon for now :) .

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I jumped in on this offer as well, I love boxes and manuals, so boxed version obviously,...

Order procces went well, item available with green light, but then came this mail from Steinberg:
we are experiencing a backorder situation on the product(s) you ordered.
We currently have no exact date of delivery for new products
Bad style from Steinberg, invite for a sale, worldwide, without having the shelf filled up !!!!!

Many things in life we can not predict, but this one they could predict very very well, no excuse :dog:

Not any catastrophe, I am busy with other things next two mounths, but I suddenly remember why
many years back I stopped dealing with Steinberg, and went with Reaper, and Studio One,...

I thought the time was ready to give them a chance again, and imidiately they screw up again

Worse thing, they give me absolutely no time-frame, and just ask if I want to cansel the order !!!

Almost seems as if Halion 6 is near, and the production of more Halion 5 boxes is unlikely to happen ???

Should I expect that they let me wait for several mounths and then finally offers me Halion 6 insteadt ???

Not sure how to act, I could ask for a download-version insteadt, guess they likely would accept that ???

(could then consider waiting with activation to just before Halion 6 if so decided)

I could also just cancel the hole thing ,.. your opinion is welcome :wink:
HM

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Well, I wouldn't expect a printed manual in that box. With the exception of MOTU, I believe those days are long gone. There may or may not be an elicenser, and there will be an activation code.

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HM wrote:I jumped in on this offer as well, I love boxes and manuals, so boxed version obviously,..
I've thrown away hundreds of Steinberg boxes. I'll happily send you the next one we're throwing away. Do you mind if it's a box for an educational version or possibly a next version?

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HM wrote:I jumped in on this offer as well, I love boxes and manuals, so boxed version obviously,...

Order procces went well, item available with green light, but then came this mail from Steinberg:
we are experiencing a backorder situation on the product(s) you ordered.
We currently have no exact date of delivery for new products
Bad style from Steinberg, invite for a sale, worldwide, without having the shelf filled up !!!!!

Many things in life we can not predict, but this one they could predict very very well, no excuse :dog:

Not any catastrophe, I am busy with other things next two mounths, but I suddenly remember why
many years back I stopped dealing with Steinberg, and went with Reaper, and Studio One,...

I thought the time was ready to give them a chance again, and imidiately they screw up again

Worse thing, they give me absolutely no time-frame, and just ask if I want to cansel the order !!!

Almost seems as if Halion 6 is near, and the production of more Halion 5 boxes is unlikely to happen ???

Should I expect that they let me wait for several mounths and then finally offers me Halion 6 insteadt ???

Not sure how to act, I could ask for a download-version insteadt, guess they likely would accept that ???

(could then consider waiting with activation to just before Halion 6 if so decided)

I could also just cancel the hole thing ,.. your opinion is welcome :wink:
Have you used the 30 day fully functional trial version yet? If not, download it and use that for the next month while you await the one you paid for in the mail. It will make no difference to you, plus it gives you another month to fall within a grace period if a version 6 does appear. I've just about used up my 30 day trial version. But, because I have it, I opted for the boxed version, which should arrive tomorrow (I'm in the US). I think it would be a mistake to cancel it.

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I wrote them, only to get an answer from a seemingly unrelated "asknet" domain, had to google for safety, ok, but strange,..

On the possetive side they reacted quick, even two persons, with two mails, contradicting eachother :-)

One said the deliver time was 2-3 weeks ,.. the other one still said "unknown" ,..

I took the first on his word, but replyed to both, that I will wait 2-3 weeks then, but unknown deliver-time is unaccebtable obviously

I heard nothing since I made this reply

Both refused changing my order to download, they would glady cancel, but I would have to pay full price for download version then,.. :roll:

That's not OK ,.. and I wonder if its the effect of sourcing out the customer-care to the third-part "asknet" support actor. They are realy stiff to dance with.Cchanging a order to download should be possible in such case here, even more so when they are self to be blamed for the missing delivery.

Yes I could play with the trail version until it arrivers ,.. and no matter what I should carefully consider when to activace due to H6

But somehow I already regret that I didn't just cancel ,.. hope for the best ,.. and soon

Thanks for the reply's, look forward to ear the included sounds, sofar Sampletank 3 has been such an disappointment, so the bundeled sounds are also of interest, someone mentioned Motif-sounds being
a part, and I use to love the sounds from Yamaha synths
HM

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I have had a similar case with (non music) software. The company could simply not deliver on time because of technical and stock problems.
We agreed that for as long as they did not deliver, they would renew my four weeks trial. That way the stress duisappeared at their side and I was a happy customer. Providing you with a new temp serial when you have indeed already paid seems to me an absolute normal solution.

Since that time, I have a fast Internet connection and now I download everything. Much easier, although sometimes boring.
Windows 7, Cubase 9.5 and some extra plug-ins | Takamine EN-10C and PRS Mira

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