Mixbus 32C Released

[Compyfox]

Giant frigging RED WARNING FLAG then...

At this price, you can't enforce a "no demo" policy and expect people to follow blindly (sadly, some will do because of the "good name" // in case of "independent programmers" because they're "fresh and deserve a chance")

Heck, if I want a large scale console, companies "invite me" over to their place to check it out first - and I still have a money back guarantee (same with medium sized consoles via an online retailer). Hosts? Even if we look at Steinberg's 4-months delay - there is still a demo eventually!


If somebody of you wants to check out "ARDOUR" (which is still the backbone) - https://ardour.org/download.html
Else - hands off - period.

[Robert Randolph]

Giant frigging RED WARNING FLAG then...

At this price, you can't enforce a "no demo" policy and expect people to follow blindly (sadly, some will do because of the "good name" // in case of "independent programmers" because they're "fresh and deserve a chance")

Heck, if I want a large scale console, companies "invite me" over to their place to check it out first - and I still have a money back guarantee (same with medium sized consoles via an online retailer). Hosts? Even if we look at Steinberg's 4-months delay - there is still a demo eventually!


If somebody of you wants to check out "ARDOUR" (which is still the backbone) - https://ardour.org/download.html
Else - hands off - period.

AFAIK, It's not even the same as ardour. From what I understand, mixbus is often months behind (or more?).

At least that's how it was for quite a while. I don't see how this hasn't changed.

[filkertom]

From product page:
"Is there a downloadable demo for Mixbus?

No, we do not currently provide a demo of Mixbus32C. It is our experience that learning a new DAW is a significant investment in a professional's time. We require that users purchase Mixbus32C, and we provide fast email support to help our customers install Mixbus and learn to use it effectively."

That argument makes no logical sense whatsoever - the fact that people need to invest time to learn to use it and can get fast support has absolutely no bearing on the provision of a demo, they are unrelated issues. If anything it's an argument for a reasonable demo period and clear manual/tutorials being available.

Of course not. Besides, to check if a certain DAW will answer our own requisites we don't need to "learn" it so deeply. It would be enough to check those functions that are standard in ANY DAW, and we all know which they are and where to look for them (unless they aren't there, or do not work as supposed). This is just a poor excuse.

Yep. Their entire philosophy seems to be, "Well, yeah, of course we have a steep learning curve. But it's so awesome that you should trust us on name alone. And if you don't, well, you couldn't have learned it anyway, it's too difficult." Which, in an era of constant tweaking (and occasionally overhauling) of the workflow, is a really shitty way to be.

[MadDogE134]

i have a tidbit...

i bought MB2 for $29 in a group buy... although qwerky... i loved the sound of it and started using it for a summing point/mixer for finished stems from other software. i liked the sound so much i jumped on the $40 upgrade to v3 (yes i know their retail quotes are off the charts and i would have never paid it... and i STILL have the email to prove these prices) i was happy... since i got it so cheaply... i joined the 'membership' for $9 a month to help development and they gave me 50% discount codes for plugins so i bought a few when they went on sale for half off the stated sale prices. so i STILL didn't have that much tied up into it and DID enjoy the summed sound. so i was happy.

THEN... i got the mailing a day early for the 32C for $99 which is as much as i have in the whole thing... so sought a demo. no such luck. i then wrote harrison and asked if there was any way to demo it before purchase and this is the mailing i got back:

No, sorry.

MB32C is identical to mixbus in every way, except for the mixer. If you could download a demo whenever your like, then you could just use it to open Mixbus sessions and use the 32C mixer whenever you like

Best,
-Ben

i don't know how you, the reader, will take this but myself... i took it as the company thinks everyone is a thief and criminal. also take note the emails were FROM my registered member's email account.

i will not go into the rest of the details... but i wrote back and told them i DID NOT appreciate being treated as a criminal. (and yes i have all the mailings) of course the boy wrote back and apologized for being in his own words 'unprofessional' and that they are under a lot of stress due to release. i wrote back and said i accept his apology but that does not release him from his actions and also told him:

if you feel every one is a thief or a criminal... why should anyone trust you and your word? who is to say you aren't a bloody liar? trust goes two ways

so i am basically done with harrison. i have what i have but i am ending my membership. they won't get any more of my support. i will continue to use what i have and who knows i 'mite' buy the 32C when it drops below $50 lol... but as my Papa told me as a child... "Mites grow around a chicken's ass"

i am too dang old to put up with this nonsense. it ain't the money.. it is the principle of the thing. cheers


jay

[wasi]

Well, to be fair, they made some great mixing tutorials for Mixbus.

They want to sell their software like a hardware console - to be used as such. So rather than driving your reels of tape halfway across the state to that guy that has a great Harrison console to get that particular vibe on the final mix, they want you to bring your tracks over into Mixbus/Mixbus32C for that particular vibe.

The confusion and irritation stems from the fact that in order to offer a complete in-the-box experience, they have to make a DAW out of it, at which point they're up against a ton of other DAWs that, as DAWs, are far more powerful.

So they're basically involuntarily selling a DAW to bring you a full hardware console experience.

[BenLoftis]

Hi Jay, I apologized for my flippant remark to you personally. As the project manager I've had many many long days leading up to the launch of 32C, and I answered your email quickly and poorly. Again I apologize.

We have many many thousands of users now, and I think we normally do an exemplary job of supporting them. I've got a few years under my belt now, so I'm finding myself quite un-bothered by your posting this. (I'm as surprised as you are; I used to take this kind of criticism very hard)

Our business model is quite different than other "DAW/Software" developers, and I'm very proud of that. Firstly because we are treating our customers as audio engineers worthy of respect ( the same way we treat our console customers ) and secondly because we have chosen to collaborate with, and contribute to, an open-source project. There's no doubt that Ardour was not a very full-fledged workstation when we launched Mixbus v1. There's also no doubt that, largely due to our contributions and support, it is now very powerful and stable. It's become an excellent platform for our products, and we are now able to showcase that with the new release of Mixbus 32C which has had an intense and incredibly successful launch.

Best Regards,
-Ben at Harrison

[BenLoftis]

@Wasi: thanks for your insightful comments!

I wouldn't use the word "involuntarily", because we are actually quite passionate about the DAW side, but I get your point.

-Ben at Harrison

[Compyfox]

The floodgates are now open...

[clintmartin]

I've been very pleased with my Mixbus 3 experience. When I have had questions or problems (some of my own making) Ben has contacted me personally and sorted things out.
Mixbus 3 is a very stable product now...with great sound. I don't own 32C.
It seems clear that you can trust the user base and invest $79...or not. There will never be a Demo. If you have to have a Demo to make your decision then move on...this isn't for you. No reason to bash a product you know nothing about.

[scalawag]

i have a tidbit...

i bought MB2 for $29 in a group buy... although qwerky... i loved the sound of it and started using it for a summing point/mixer for finished stems from other software. i liked the sound so much i jumped on the $40 upgrade to v3

And what about people like me who have spent $95 for Mixbus 1.5 (Linux and OSX only) + $49 for Mixbus 2 (Linux and OSX only) + $35 for the Windows version. And i'm sure there is even worst stories like this. I ended up with a not advertised limited vst support (too many plugins crashing). I never upgraded to MB3, even for "just" $40. I'm still on the fence doing so. I don't like to pay to be a beta tester. Harrison's support, and Ben's support in particular, is top notch thought... I'll maybe jump in again when it is really 100% stable.

[Lenticular]

They're selling a mixer that's pretending to be a fully featured & developed daw.

The fact that it's become more stable doesn't deny the fact that you're paying to beta test a product in development.
I find it odd people are willing to spend $ for that privilege with upgrade fees & new products.

MB2 is EOL? no problem, you can buy MB3. Want more buses & few more features using the same code, no problem buy this new shiny product (& for quite a bit more I might add)

The fact that they're not even willing to offer a demo , refund or guarantee only makes it more distasteful.

[Robert Randolph]

Our business model is quite different than other "DAW/Software" developers, and I'm very proud of that. Firstly because we are treating our customers as audio engineers worthy of respect ( the same way we treat our console customers )

I can get a large number of hardware products on a demo period for 30-days from dozens (hundreds?) of manufacturers. $10k box? No problem.

Hardware. Real stuff. Expensive stuff.

Harrison won't even give me a demo of their low-end software product. I'm expected to pay non-refundable money to have an opportunity to try the product. Not only that, but a product with a very poor reputation for stability.

Maybe back in the 70s that's how you respected your customers, but it's 2016 and I can get better opportunities to evaluate equipment from nearly every one else in the industry. Even Apple.

For that matter, I purchased MB1 and MB2, and never got a functioning product. Your solution for potentially getting a functioning product? More non-refundable purchases! Respect

(having to know the 'secret handshake' to get a demo isn't very respectful of your potential customers either)

[fmr]

I've been very pleased with my Mixbus 3 experience. When I have had questions or problems (some of my own making) Ben has contacted me personally and sorted things out.
Mixbus 3 is a very stable product now...with great sound. I don't own 32C.
It seems clear that you can trust the user base and invest $79...or not. There will never be a Demo. If you have to have a Demo to make your decision then move on...this isn't for you. No reason to bash a product you know nothing about.

Exactly WHOM are you addressing this? Did you realize that many people posting here are already using Mixbus, and even Mixbs 3 )that's my case, for example, although "run" here is a strong expression for what it does). I am still waiting for some clarification form Harrison regarding the roadmap posted for Mixbus 3, and that is VERY far from being accomplished. And no, I will not upgrade to get another EQ - I have plenty of EQs through VST. What I would like is better support of VST. And a more stable version, because in spite of what you say, Mixbus is far from being stable. Maybe Ben can clarify what are the plans regarding Mixbus.

BTW: What are you referring when you say: "invest $79...or not"? The e-mail I received says $149,00 (which I must say is outrageous considering what's added. This is at best a .5 upgrade, and Steinberg releases those at $49,00) [/quote]

[wasi]

Yeah, my main unanswered question is: Is this an evolutionary product, i.e. is it a continuation of Mixbus 3, or does it sit next to Mixbus 3 as an alternative?

[clintmartin]

I've been very pleased with my Mixbus 3 experience. When I have had questions or problems (some of my own making) Ben has contacted me personally and sorted things out.
Mixbus 3 is a very stable product now...with great sound. I don't own 32C.
It seems clear that you can trust the user base and invest $79...or not. There will never be a Demo. If you have to have a Demo to make your decision then move on...this isn't for you. No reason to bash a product you know nothing about.

Exactly WHOM are you addressing this? Did you realize that many people posting here are already using Mixbus, and even Mixbs 3 )that's my case, for example, although "run" here is a strong expression for what it does). I am still waiting for some clarification form Harrison regarding the roadmap posted for Mixbus 3, and that is VERY far from being accomplished. And no, I will not upgrade to get another EQ - I have plenty of EQs through VST. What I would like is better support of VST. And a more stable version, because in spite of what you say, Mixbus is far from being stable. Maybe Ben can clarify what are the plans regarding Mixbus.

BTW: What are you referring when you say: "invest $79...or not"? The e-mail I received says $149,00 (which I must say is outrageous considering what's added. This is at best a .5 upgrade, and Steinberg releases those at $49,00)

[/quote]

I was talking to everyone, but was referring to MB3. As I said I don't own 32C, and don't have plans to own it. I use Mixbus for mixing. It works great for me. I do have a few VSTs that don't work, but nothing I need for mixing.
If you own the product and are having problems...then by all means you should be asking for support.