Mixbus 32C Released

[fmr]

I was talking to everyone, but was referring to MB3. As I said I don't own 32C, and don't have plans to own it. I use Mixbus for mixing. It works great for me. I do have a few VSTs that don't work, but nothing I need for mixing.
If you own the product and are having problems...then by all means you should be asking for support.

I did, but there are things that go beyond support, since they are inherent to the current status of the program And are you sure that MB3 will still have a future? Why is Harrison so silent about this?

[clintmartin]

they use the same code. They will update and mature together. I don't see a reason for me to buy the new one just for four more buses I don't need and a new EQ, but I know a lot of people were wanting that.
I don't own any of Harrisons plugins because I use 3 different daws from time to time, and want my purchases to work on all 3.

[fmr]

they use the same code. They will update and mature together.

Yes, I know THAT sounds reasonable but... Did someone from Harrison confirmed you that? I would like to see an official confirmation.

[LawrenceF]

$0.02: I personally think the relative "no demo" bashing here towards Harrison is completely legit and not remotely subjective at all in any real way. There's a lot of regular kinda "drama queen" or "the sky is falling!" griping on KVR but this one isn't that.

For a company that sells mega-buck hardware, I wonder what they're so afraid of with the comparatively inexpensive software. Honestly, I could probably get the Windows installer easy enough to demo it, just by asking a bunch of owners via PM's in various forums until someone agrees to send me one... and it will run with the "demo beep" or whatever because I have no license.

It's baffling, that decision.

I have to agree with CompyFox. The only thing that makes any logical sense at all related to that decision is that they maybe think they'll sell more if people can't demo it, for some reason, which might be stability on some platforms. Otherwise, it makes absolutely no sense in at all.

[MadDogE134]

i stated you DID apologize Ben and i stated i DID accept your apology and that was decent of you. but the fact is... i am going on 60 yrs old, have supported the company best i could being with limited funds (disabled) and i was NOT snippy in my question about the demo. i DO understand stress... that is why i accepted the apology. but being in the position you are in and representing the company you should be a little more guarded at your responses to folks because it DOES reflect on the company in a very bad light. but i am done riding you about it... it is over and water under the bridge.

thing is i DO keep my word and you basically lost me as a customer. sure you didn't make a killing off of me but i was a benefit because i always talked highly of your company and your product to whoever was interested. many in the past year or so have asked me about mixbus and why i like it so i am pretty sure your company made a little second hand profit off my praises. but like i said... i could care less about the money... money means nothing to me except when i am dead broke when bills are due.

i am sure you don't remember since you deal with a lot of people in your position but we HAD talked a few times before via email so i don't understand why i was treated as i was. you knew i was a member or you should have known... but i really don't blame you... the whole world has lost trust. even cops treat everyone as criminals without reason these days and every man distrusts his fellow man but that does not make it right. in the end it will only make life more miserable than it has to be. as i stated before... trust works both ways. i am what the young call old school... i am from an era when a man's word was his honor and honor meant something. today it seems no one has honor and no one cares. trust me... all this selfishness and mistrust of others will bite you all in the ass eventually. i trust everyone at least once but when trust is broken you can never get it back. cheers and wish you well


jay

[BenLoftis]

@jay: I do remember our previous discussions and that's why I was willing to be flippant with my reply to your question. I'll try not to make that mistake again. It's easy to forget that an email reader cannot hear your tone of voice.

[BenLoftis]

they use the same code. They will update and mature together.

Yes, I know THAT sounds reasonable but... Did someone from Harrison confirmed you that? I would like to see an official confirmation.

Mixbus and Mixbus32C are the same program, except for the differences in the mixer. It's a different "sound", on the same platform. This is something that our users have been requesting.

They have equal presence on our web site, and will be continuously updated just like we have been updating Mixbus in the past.

Best,
-Ben at Harrison

[Compyfox]

Once more the question(s) - and no jumping around the topic (neither will I speak through the flower this time around):

Why no demo?!

Why were severe bugs (see GS threads especially) never addressed - instead a next major update hit, and people had to shell out 99USD in order to even see if their bug reports were being addressed, on top of the 30USD "Windows Beta" (which still isn't stable!)?

Why the drastic price slash after a short while? Not to mention insult THOSE people that invested 99USD as upgrade, while others could later simply grab it for literally 20bucks less as "new" (no, I don't let the argument "you had early access" count - something is fishy here!). Doesn't that "theoretically" devalue your tool, and pull your main point of argumentation for a "no demo, no refunds" into BS territory?



I think these are the three most pressing questions in this thread (probably also on GS - haven't checked in a while) - and so far, the answers have been graciously evaded.




I emphasize on my earlier comment once more:

You sell a broken host, with "branded in" plugins(!!!) and insist on reinventing the wheel. Yes, you can pretty much see "Mixbus" as a digital HARRISON console and all-in-one record-to-tape solution (oh hey, something that can be bought in hardware form for less than 2500USD these days! Behringer/Midas anyone?!). However... this is not(!) inventing the wheel anew, this is wasted potential.

I mean, look at the competition: Waves, Slate Digital, SKNote, Acoustica Audio, Sonimus, SoundToys, Softube, Brainworx, Hornet Plugins - all of them have a 2-plugin "console suite" concept. No, it's not "branded" into a host. But take away the custom GUI/connection and what do you have? Individual modules. And if we look at the hardware in question - it's also individual modules (building blocks) connected together that create a specific console in question or rather "sound". The only difference is the UI. An example with NEVE: use the Neve 8048 frame and switch out the 1073 for a 1081 - same core frame (backbone), different UI and sound (modules).

You are primarily selling an UI concept, and insist that this is the best since fresh sliced and toasted bread, not to mention so much more superior than me using Cubase and loading Slate VCC in Insert one of every channel and the summing bus, to recreate a Trident console, then use the Trident A EQ from who-ever and any compressor to my liking because it was NOT part of the console. Granted, not as "pretty", but just as straight forward, way more flexible (because I can mix and match my tone!), but it does the job. And to my understanding, the Harrison 4032 frame, where the 32C was built into (as module), never had any compressors either.


So what you're doing is preaching about the land of milk an honey, while force-bundling your Harrison tools into a <insert insult here> broken, overpriced, open source host! That you insist on having "fixed" (which is apparently still not the case, see reports on KVR alone, and once more: GearSlutz).

At this point, I highly question why Harrison still has a collaboration with UAD - because this is a VST/AU/AAX plugin... yet the company is incapable of releasing the EQ's and compressors to the wild in the same formats, but native (no UAD needed), that are standards for 15+ years?! No, they HAVE TO BE locked away in a buggy host so that people have to bend backwards to even use it. Reason: "innovation", "special concept".

You just wanted to play along in the 20+ host market (quick cash in?) and clearly fail for YEARS at this point. And now you expect users to fork out another 300USD just for the "special" 32C EQ?!

Then throw in two famous names: Bruce Swedien and Michael Jackson... while ignoring that "their sound" not only came from the Harrison console, but also the production, the tape machine they used, and the outboard gear that was connected to it. Something that a lot of people love to ignore!



I ask once more - if VST/AU/AAX plugins are already possible, and if ARDOUR is nothing more than a "shell" (custom GUI) for your already created and usable "modules" (plugins)... why not drop the host in favor for more popularity, therefore sales, and go VST/AU/AAX? Which would also reduce frustration, issues with bugs and broken projects, etc. Heck, you can even sell the plugin suite for the same darn price as the host! I mean, what does the SSL Duende Native "Dynamic/EQ" bundle cost? 409EUR plus VAT. The RND Portico bundle costs 399EUR (incl VAT). Waves bundles cost around 499USD, Slate VCC costs 149USD. Combine Slate VCC and Focusrite Midnight for a "custom british console" and you invest less than 300USD and you have an oustanding console sound.

The argument "due to fear of the tools being cracked instantly" doesn't count either... have you hit Google on that behalf recently?



In all honesty - I don't get it.

And as somebody that has used MIXBUS, with devastating / discouraging results even, I refuse to support this behavior. And I do like old hardware consoles that are different from the usual suspects NEVE and SSL.

[fmr]

they use the same code. They will update and mature together.

Yes, I know THAT sounds reasonable but... Did someone from Harrison confirmed you that? I would like to see an official confirmation.

Mixbus and Mixbus32C are the same program, except for the differences in the mixer. It's a different "sound", on the same platform. This is something that our users have been requesting.

They have equal presence on our web site, and will be continuously updated just like we have been updating Mixbus in the past.

Best,
-Ben at Harrison

Finally. At least now we have some official statement on the subject. Now, when will we have a proper and decent VST support, that will allow us to use basically ALL of our plug-ins, and not just half of them? This is something your users have been requesting for ages, and you should concentrate on that before coming with something else. That and a better ASIO support. I know a lot more users have been requesting these, and yet...

[ras.s]

At BenLoftis or any Mixbus user --- how's the MIDI control implementation in Mixbus? Is it possible to set up controllers once and then have those controllers assigned in every project? If that's well done, then it's a more interesting piece of software, since assigning controllers to plugins in each project is a major pain in the proverbial.

And at Ben, does Harrison have any plans for selling a controller to complement Mixbus? For the hands-on mixing experience, instead of mixing with the mouse ..

[chk071]

Jeez, people are really hardcore sensitive these days when they always feel like being treated as a "thief and criminal".

[Sailor16]

I just spent the $149 required to demo Mixbus 32C.

Love the new EQ stuff. I'm only using Mixbus to mix audio tracks that were exported from various DAWs and so far I'm getting very pleasing results with Mixbus 32C. Well worth the upgrade cost.

However, it's very unfortunate that there is no demo. I'd guess most people are not as crazy as me, spending $149 just to demo a product on their machines.

It's a compatibility thing, not a UI thing. Harrison please re-consider your policy. Also the argument that you want people to spend time learning Ardour isn't going to happen anyway, because Ardour sucks IMO. It's buggy as hell and all I basically do with it is hit playback, stop and import/export audio files. Not exactly rocket science.

IMO it would actually be a better product if you deleted the Ardour part and just kept the Harrison mixer part and refined the audio engine and DSPs. Some sort of hardware mixer controller with motorized faders and knobs would be quite nice too.

[Compyfox]

And at Ben, does Harrison have any plans for selling a controller to complement Mixbus? For the hands-on mixing experience, instead of mixing with the mouse ..

They already have that:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8L-zwyU45o

Actually, they did create an app integration with "TouchOSC" (iOS - 5USD) and the Jazzmutant Lemur App (25EUR for Android and iOS) - or at least planned to. They declared it as "proof of concept" in their recent videos. Of course you need a hardware tablet, the app and Mixbus 3.1+ for this. Don't know if the script will cost extra - but wouldn't surprise me.

Jeez, people are really hardcore sensitive these days when they always feel like being treated as a "thief and criminal".

Rightly so, no?
I mean... read just this comment directly after your post:

I just spent the $149 required to demo Mixbus 32C.

In short, Sailor16 paid for the "crossgrade", a risk he's taken (though volunteeringly), without possible chance of refund.

[ras.s]

Ha, that's just silly.

Big fan of TouchOSC over here, by the way. Good stuff, though I wouldn't use it for controlling a entire mixer live. I'm mainly using it to control aux effects parameters (for instance, buttons can send arbitrary CC values, so controlling a delay precisely is a breeze).

[chk071]

Jeez, people are really hardcore sensitive these days when they always feel like being treated as a "thief and criminal".

Rightly so, no?
I mean... read just this comment directly after your post:

I just spent the $149 required to demo Mixbus 32C.

In short, Sailor16 paid for the "crossgrade", a risk he's taken (though volunteeringly), without possible chance of refund.

I don't know what the one thing has to do with the other. Apart from that, i don't believe that customers are weak-willed sheep which have to eat everything they are being served. Noone has to upgrade, and if you don't like the fact that you can't demo before upgrading, then why the hell would you upgrade if you don't know what to expect?

Btw, i didn't know that every company offers a refund now when you bought their software online. Care to elaaborate?