KVR Audio

medienhexer · Post by **medienhexer** » Thu Dec 08, 2016 1:22 am

Does everybody else prefer the one they started with?

I think a lot of GUIs are very elegant and efficient these days. I prefer clean GUIs, but that doesn't make them the best, as in objectively the best...

However, started with Logic and it will always make the most sense to me. Used various versions of Cubase, Pro Tools le, a bit of tracktion and DP in between but they all just keep distracting me and being bad for my blood pressure. Shortcuts are all wrong, editing, zooming, scrolling, transport controls, window management, I did re-learn every time but it still felt wrong all the time.

Didn't click with Reason back in the day and couldn't get anything going with Live. Until I demoed v9. And added Push. Then it started making sense and quickly became my go-to solution for experimentation. Which, I feel, is the weak spot of the linear, timeline-based DAWs. At least for one-man-endeavours like myself.

So, I'd love to be able to say Logic and that's that. But it needs the grid view and it needs the Push controller for that.

masterhiggins · Post by **masterhiggins** » Thu Dec 08, 2016 1:28 am

EnGee wrote:Personally, I consider it a masterpiece of coding! All that in Assembly?! Crazy how he did that! It seems that users of SAW Studio are mostly professionals and they know for what they are using it. I've never heard crash problems with SAW Studio (well, from what I read in the net).

Yeah you eliminate potential problems when you never modify your code.

EnGee · Post by **EnGee** » Thu Dec 08, 2016 5:15 am

masterhiggins wrote:
EnGee wrote:Personally, I consider it a masterpiece of coding! All that in Assembly?! Crazy how he did that! It seems that users of SAW Studio are mostly professionals and they know for what they are using it. I've never heard crash problems with SAW Studio (well, from what I read in the net).
Yeah you eliminate potential problems when you never modify your code.

Do you mean he haven't modified his code since he released it? I doubt that.

Michael L · Post by **Michael L** » Thu Dec 08, 2016 6:18 am

medienhexer wrote: couldn't get anything going with Live. Until I demoed v9. And added Push. Then it started making sense and quickly became my go-to solution for experimentation. Which, I feel, is the weak spot of the linear, timeline-based DAWs.

If I don't use any loops, what are the advantages of Live over linear DAWs for experimentation?

medienhexer · Post by **medienhexer** » Thu Dec 08, 2016 7:33 am

Michael L wrote:
medienhexer wrote: couldn't get anything going with Live. Until I demoed v9. And added Push. Then it started making sense and quickly became my go-to solution for experimentation. Which, I feel, is the weak spot of the linear, timeline-based DAWs.
If I don't use any loops, what are the advantages of Live over linear DAWs for experimentation?

It's really all to do with the use of scenes. I found a tutorial on youtube which kind of demonstrates what's so good about scenes.

https://youtu.be/PbDHfFee5_0

Now, the important thing to wrap your head around is that loops (or clips) don't have to be pre-recorded. I usually start recording a phrase or beat on Push for an intro, or a verse or a chorus...

I then start recording other instrument phrases and stack them all on top of each other to make sure the phrasing (rhythm and melody) is tight and any combination of phrases will work.

Then I experment with combinations and move/copy them to scenes. I usually record a few clips of just breaks for the rhythmic instruments. By setting the scene transition time to a very low value, I can experiment in real time with different combinations of clips to create a succession of scenes which build the song structure.

By switching back and forth, I can check if the scenes work seamlessly and actually create a buildup or release of energy between verse and chorus, then to the next verse, etc.

I can quickly add variations or new combinations of clips for a pre-chorus or bridge in another Scene.

I can switch from a straight beat to a break clip to try and add some natural feel to a part (verse, chorus). By setting 1/16 as the switching time, I can try out where best to place a break.

Now, once I have basically laid out the entire track/song as Scenes (adding clips as needed), I record what I play back and trigger scene after scene. Humm and sing along while doing that to make sure you record the appropriate number of repetitions and the dramaturgy really works as planned.

Then switch to the linear view and finish the track. And really, this is where I REALLY prefer Logic over Live. Detailed editing, automation, mixing...

Michael L · Post by **Michael L** » Thu Dec 08, 2016 9:08 am

Thank you! The video+your explanation of the workflow is very clear, especially:

medienhexer wrote:stack them all on top of each other to make sure the phrasing (rhythm and melody) is tight and any combination of phrases will work. Then I experiment with combinations and move/copy them to scenes

medienhexer · Post by **medienhexer** » Thu Dec 08, 2016 12:14 pm

Michael L wrote:Thank you! The video+your explanation of the workflow is very clear, especially:
medienhexer wrote:stack them all on top of each other to make sure the phrasing (rhythm and melody) is tight and any combination of phrases will work. Then I experiment with combinations and move/copy them to scenes

You're welcome. I really hope, something very similar is in development. Studio One introduced a "sketching zone" as their version of covering the need and Cubase works with Arrangement Tracks, but it's all still linear and doesn't take you to a completely different mindset like Live does.

exmatproton · Post by **exmatproton** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 2:13 pm

FL Studio (11.x +); clean, dark, low contrast, supersmooth animations, vectorized...i love it

Saukar30 · Post by **Saukar30** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 2:41 pm

reusenoise wrote:Synapse Orion,sadly discontinued,had one of the best and easy of use gui

+1

This was my 4th DAW. Ive been using Orion since version 3. 1st was Digital Orchetsrator Pro (all MIDI, but super functional. Before VSTS... so everything I did was MIDI. Damn I'm old LOL) 2nd was Magix Studio Maker (unfortunately the audio & midi were split into 2 different daws at the time). 3rd was Cubasis (yeah... wayyyyyy back in the day. It was sold with a soundcard that sucked). Then my brother turned me onto Orion. Has been my main tool since then because everything works with patterns. Ive eventually purchased Reaper & FL Studio since... but my workflow is beyond compare with Orion even though it's discontinued. I'm trying to make a complete switch to Reaper but the MIDI part is killing me. Its just not fun to use.

Nielzie · Post by **Nielzie** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 2:53 pm

I still love Orion too. It's was my first DAW after using mod trackers in the old days. I'm still using it btw. Very sad that it's discontinued though, although it still works on the latest windows OS's.

Resonant- Serpent · Post by **Resonant- Serpent** » Fri Dec 09, 2016 5:43 pm

All time favorite was Sonar 8.5.3 because of how much I could customize it. Even with the color adjustments now available in the X-series, I can't stand how it looks and behaves. My new favorite was Cubase 8.5, and that's been even more solidified after the release of 9 and the interface improvements.

jtrake · Post by **jtrake** » Sat Dec 10, 2016 10:08 am

Cubase with Studio One as a close second.

zenophilix · Post by **zenophilix** » Thu Dec 15, 2016 9:01 pm

I love Live to the end of the earth. It's clean, minimal, and only presents you with what you need. The sidebar has improved massively since version 8, and everything feels fluid. FL is nice, but the color scheme and some of the animations strike me as a bit flashy and consumer grade.

incubus · Post by **incubus** » Thu Dec 15, 2016 9:22 pm

medienhexer wrote:Does everybody else prefer the one they started with?

No, most definitely not.

Currently, the mixer in FL studio (12 onward) is the best I've ever seen. The rest of it is .... ok.

Most hosts are fugly, blocky and cluttery. I think I'll make that my signature....."welcome to the future, where hosts are mostly like 2007 still"

Yeah, gonna do it.

And the best GUI of all the DAWS in your opinion is... ?