sonar or samplitude?

[woggle]

in my almost completed quest to find an alternative to reaper I have pretty much settled on sonar or samplitude. They are both very attractive but obviously demoing things is not the same as using them for a few months across a range of projects so...

What fantastically useful things does Sonar have that Samplitude doesn't?
and
what fantastically useful things does Samplitude have that Sonar hasn't ?

neither has spline based automation curves which is a shame

[siriusbliss]

Object-based editing in Samplitude.
(NOT just track-based clips)

Still the #1 feature IMO.

I think you can try Samplitude Music Studio demo to check out editing features.
http://www.magix-audio.com/us/samplitude-music-studio/

G

[woggle]

Object-based editing in Samplitude.
(NOT just track-based clips)

Still the #1 feature IMO.

I think you can try Samplitude Music Studio demo to check out editing features.
http://www.magix-audio.com/us/samplitude-music-studio/

G

thanks I have been deom-ing them both and they both are very good. How is object based editing in Samplitude different to the way clip editing works in Sonar (or Reaper for that matter). To me as a demo-er they seem fairly similar as far as fx automation goes, although Samplitude is definitely easier and more thorough than Sonar or Reaper in focusing on the object/clip
Probably the only thing I have found where Sonar and Reaper are better is in a mixerless workflow - ie driving the mix via the track view rather than a mixing "desk" Reaper has its folder system that I like very much and Sonar seems to be a bit better with its folder system being a bit easier and more flexible. That's probably the last area for me to explore before I make a purchase

[siriusbliss]

Samplitude has folders in track (VIP) view.

Objects in Samplitude are real-time and can be automated (rather than waiting to render effects, etc.).
Objects are individual objects and self-contained rather than editing regions along a track.

I also really like the Comparisonics view when doing editing, as well as the in-line spectral editor.

Have you checked out all the Kraznet videos on YouTube yet?

G

[woggle]

Samplitude has folders in track (VIP) view.

Objects in Samplitude are real-time and can be automated (rather than waiting to render effects, etc.).
Objects are individual objects and self-contained rather than editing regions along a track.

I also really like the Comparisonics view when doing editing, as well as the in-line spectral editor.

Have you checked out all the Kraznet videos on YouTube yet?

G

thanks - probably not seen all of kraznet but they are a great resource and definitely a factor in making Samplitude attractive.

I've had another look at folders and they will be fine in Samplitude - I don't really like the way the tracks or folders get coloured, but that is no big deal.

And I agree the comparisons and spectral editor are a smart idea. Although, I am not sure what the difference is between the suite version and the pro version as far as the spectral editor goes. Also I need to test out how Samplitude works with an external editor again - I use RX5 and can't see me changing from that and I also use Audition - which might end up redundant. RX5 seems to work but I need to test it more

EDIT - getting bluescreens on win10 from Samplitude. Have asked on their forum but there will have to be a great answer to stop Samplitude going on the "never buy" list. I haven't had a bluescreen on windows for years (think the last one was Reaper a few years back)

[lfm]

Quite a bit of pro and cons for both in my view.

Sonar - nobody in the business seems more determined with updates on regular basic. Cakewalk shown a lot of guts - leaving the old gui and remake with X-series and now Mac version as well.
Cons would be support - in reality non-existent.
Context sensitive help is good though - so I could most of the time find my way.
Overall feel - nothing much happends with new features.

Samp - many good things in gui for workflow, selection history, various zoom buttons etc, but needs quite a bit of documentation read. To me it was confusing with two different mode settings and get the feel what will be affected by next operation - it was mouse mode part from some other editing mode on toolbar to take into consideration or result becomes very different.

There are many ways to affect how much delay you get when doing a recording monitoring through samp - but it takes a bit of brainmotion. There is a table that can be shown as you deal with this - which mode to choose - and there are reasons since it's almost rocket science.

I find support good and interested in your issue or question.

Personally I never got what was special about object editing - nothing that you could make an object from everything in a range of timeline, including tempotrack - which I hoped for, just moving one part anywhere as an object. Why give it an abstract name like object editing anyway - even in marketing - who knows and can explain it even? I never got what was special about it compared to how you did things in any other daw. But a lot of care to have the right mode or editing affect much more than you expected - it's not fully built on that what is selected is affected - do a readup on that.

There are also various modes to think about if automation will follow or not when editing. I always felt I needed to have a lot in my head while doing anything.

One thing I used Samp for was also moving projects from Reaper. In Reaper making midi clips external file on disc - it also comes right into Samp, the only format ever I succeded in doing that. Worked quite well, some thing about tempo but fairly useful. I think format was EDL. So then I could export as OMF to other daws as well, but without the midi clips then(when will industry provide us with interchange format that support midi clips?

But the real dealbreaker for me abandoning Samp was that they presumed they had VST3 support in ProX2 - but never got it working for Waves plugins - and to the degree Waves removed Samp as supporting VST3 - they reverted Samp to VST only. For me Samp crashed just scanning VST plugins, before that it crashed on every exit. So maintenance sucks - and the overall feel for me is that they are more into video editing apps having just bought Sony Vegas etc.

Just looked briefly at ProX3 - and found it rather high priced upgrade from ProX2 - $199 - that is 50% of new price. The suite is basically more content like Independence sampler - which is really extensive and good. I used for both playing enclosed content and making own libraries. I bought that from Yellowtools while they owned it - and still can be bought separately.

[woggle]

Quite a bit of pro and cons for both in my view.

Sonar - nobody in the business seems more determined with updates on regular basic. Cakewalk shown a lot of guts - leaving the old gui and remake with X-series and now Mac version as well.
Cons would be support - in reality non-existent.
Context sensitive help is good though - so I could most of the time find my way.
Overall feel - nothing much happends with new features.

Samp - many good things in gui for workflow, selection history, various zoom buttons etc, but needs quite a bit of documentation read. To me it was confusing with two different mode settings and get the feel what will be affected by next operation - it was mouse mode part from some other editing mode on toolbar to take into consideration or result becomes very different.

There are many ways to affect how much delay you get when doing a recording monitoring through samp - but it takes a bit of brainmotion. There is a table that can be shown as you deal with this - which mode to choose - and there are reasons since it's almost rocket science.

I find support good and interested in your issue or question.

Personally I never got what was special about object editing - nothing that you could make an object from everything in a range of timeline, including tempotrack - which I hoped for, just moving one part anywhere as an object. Why give it an abstract name like object editing anyway - even in marketing - who knows and can explain it even? I never got what was special about it compared to how you did things in any other daw. But a lot of care to have the right mode or editing affect much more than you expected - it's not fully built on that what is selected is affected - do a readup on that.

There are also various modes to think about if automation will follow or not when editing. I always felt I needed to have a lot in my head while doing anything.

One thing I used Samp for was also moving projects from Reaper. In Reaper making midi clips external file on disc - it also comes right into Samp, the only format ever I succeded in doing that. Worked quite well, some thing about tempo but fairly useful. I think format was EDL. So then I could export as OMF to other daws as well, but without the midi clips then(when will industry provide us with interchange format that support midi clips?

But the real dealbreaker for me abandoning Samp was that they presumed they had VST3 support in ProX2 - but never got it working for Waves plugins - and to the degree Waves removed Samp as supporting VST3 - they reverted Samp to VST only. For me Samp crashed just scanning VST plugins, before that it crashed on every exit. So maintenance sucks - and the overall feel for me is that they are more into video editing apps having just bought Sony Vegas etc.

Just looked briefly at ProX3 - and found it rather high priced upgrade from ProX2 - $199 - that is 50% of new price. The suite is basically more content like Independence sampler - which is really extensive and good. I used for both playing enclosed content and making own libraries. I bought that from Yellowtools while they owned it - and still can be bought separately.

thanks for your full response - I am waiting to hear back about the bluescreens in Samplitude but for me that comes close to a dealbreaker. Annoying as Reaper is it almost never bluescreens or even crashes. Very interested to read your other comments - you don't seem that negative about Sonar
Another negative for Samplitude is using external editors. I have a lot of experience with Adobe Audition and Izotope RX5 and am reluctant to give that up - but I would have to with Samplitude or at best use the incredibly clunky RX Connect for RX5.

[whyterabbyt]

I tried the demo for Samplitude a couple of months back but didnt get very far; had the most problems doing plugin scanning Ive ever encountered in a DAW. No idea why, it balked on stuff that even fairly 'touchy' scanners like earlier versions of Tracktion had no problems with, crashing repeatedly.
In contrast, Sonar is the one DAW that's Ive always been able to rely on being able to manage every plugin I have and/or decide to try out, right back to very early synthedit plugins via its bitbridge. Also has the best plugin menu management around. Used to be the only one with custom menus, still might be.

Cant do more of a comparison, that's where I gave up trying, rather disappointedly.

[woggle]

I tried the demo for Samplitude a couple of months back but didnt get very far; had the most problems doing plugin scanning Ive ever encountered in a DAW. No idea why, it balked on stuff that even fairly 'touchy' scanners like earlier versions of Tracktion had no problems with, crashing repeatedly.
In contrast, Sonar is the one DAW that's Ive always been able to rely on being able to manage every plugin I have and/or decide to try out, right back to very early synthedit plugins via its bitbridge. Also has the best plugin menu management around. Used to be the only one with custom menus, still might be.

Cant do more of a comparison, that's where I gave up trying, rather disappointedly.

thanks whyterabbyt - I've had some problems with the vst scan in the Samp demo too. Shame if it is a bit touchy, as there is a lot I like about it. On the other hand I'm impressed with Sonar too. And it is cheaper

[Hink]

Personally I never got what was special about object editing - nothing that you could make an object from everything in a range of timeline, including tempotrack - which I hoped for, just moving one part anywhere as an object. Why give it an abstract name like object editing anyway - even in marketing - who knows and can explain it even? I never got what was special about it compared to how you did things in any other daw. But a lot of care to have the right mode or editing affect much more than you expected - it's not fully built on that what is selected is affected - do a readup on that.

you dont have to, myself and many others have found how awesome it can help our work flows. Do you know how much you can do with an object in Samp...it's far more than you seem to imply.

Start here, which is just about fx
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fKJcfWjZMD0

here are many more videos for everything else including automation, freezing...object editors are even one of the best channel strips I've seen
https://www.google.com/search?q=objects ... mwHIpqCYAQ

[woggle]

Personally I never got what was special about object editing - nothing that you could make an object from everything in a range of timeline, including tempotrack - which I hoped for, just moving one part anywhere as an object. Why give it an abstract name like object editing anyway - even in marketing - who knows and can explain it even? I never got what was special about it compared to how you did things in any other daw. But a lot of care to have the right mode or editing affect much more than you expected - it's not fully built on that what is selected is affected - do a readup on that.

you dont have to, myself and many others have found how awesome it can help our work flows. Do you know how much you can do with an object in Samp...it's far more than you seem to imply.

Start here, which is just about fx
...

here are many more videos for everything else including automation, freezing...object editors are even one of the best channel strips I've seen
https://www.google.com/search?q=objects ... mwHIpqCYAQ

that video really is impressive in the coherence and understanding illustrated through the design. Illustrates nicely why I am looking to leave Reaper which quite possibly does all that but in a manner that is far far more difficult and will only get even more difficult.

[MaroxAudio]

what fantastically useful things does Samplitude have that Sonar hasn't ?

Pristine audio quality

Comprehensive object editing

More comprehensive mastering effects

The underdog in production circles

[siriusbliss]

Another negative for Samplitude is using external editors. I have a lot of experience with Adobe Audition and Izotope RX5 and am reluctant to give that up - but I would have to with Samplitude or at best use the incredibly clunky RX Connect for RX5.

Have you tried the wav editor mode in Samplitude yet?
Spectral cleaning, restoration suite, etc. all built-in. No need to use external editors.

G

[woggle]

Another negative for Samplitude is using external editors. I have a lot of experience with Adobe Audition and Izotope RX5 and am reluctant to give that up - but I would have to with Samplitude or at best use the incredibly clunky RX Connect for RX5.

Have you tried the wav editor mode in Samplitude yet?
Spectral cleaning, restoration suite, etc. all built-in. No need to use external editors.

G

I am not sure what is in the suite and what s in the pro version as far as spectral cleaning goes - they flag that there is a difference on the website and I think the demo is the suite

Also I am having trouble releasing the audio driver when I switch between Samplitude and a youtube tute - that's annoying and I have looked around to find a solution.

Against all my aesthetic and better judgement I am trending back to Reaper - thinking I may as well keep my current set of annoyances as learn a new set. Reaper does some things very well- perhaps all I need do is meditate before every session

[Kalamata Kid]

Personally I never got what was special about object editing - nothing that you could make an object from everything in a range of timeline, including tempotrack - which I hoped for, just moving one part anywhere as an object. Why give it an abstract name like object editing anyway - even in marketing - who knows and can explain it even? I never got what was special about it compared to how you did things in any other daw. But a lot of care to have the right mode or editing affect much more than you expected - it's not fully built on that what is selected is affected - do a readup on that.

you dont have to, myself and many others have found how awesome it can help our work flows. Do you know how much you can do with an object in Samp...it's far more than you seem to imply.

Start here, which is just about fx
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fKJcfWjZMD0

here are many more videos for everything else including automation, freezing...object editors are even one of the best channel strips I've seen
https://www.google.com/search?q=objects ... mwHIpqCYAQ

Very impressive video.

Clip or event effects and automation is very important to my workflow.
It should be that anything you can do to a track can do to a clip.

If I recall Samplitude was known for the audio quality. Is it better then the other DAW's?

Amplitude is weak on midi. A deal breaker for me.