These posts can often devolve from lack of information so here's the skinny. Since I started my music career I have had a really cheap Yamaha keyboard, a Korg x50, and a korg m50 61. I have come to the realization that I don't enjoy my M50 (mostly keybed). And playing enough grand pianos through school has left me longing for a weighted keybed. Now that I'm a graduated engineer, I'm looking to upgrade. So let's break it down. before that, however, yes I "can" buy a Kronos 2 88. But If I'm wasting money on features that I don't use, I want to put that money towards other things. I also do not live close enough to any location to demo anything. The only high end board I have played personally is the Kronos (my local store got one despite selling crappy keyboards otherwise). I almost never play out so I'm open to midi only boards, though I would still prefer to be able to take it places. I own a hella powerful PC so the world of VSTs is finally open to me. I like my Korgs so there is some product loyalty but I am willing to branch.
Things I want:
- A keyboard that is fun to play (think hardware, key action). This is subjective so...
- I want 88 keys
- I want fully weighted keys
- Fast keys (eg. no gumminess, you could play a Jordan Rudess solo on them)
- Has a decent sound bank on it's own (think quality not quantity) in case I take it out
- Is midi friendly and supported by the manufacturer with drivers (I finally want to break into using quality VST in a DAW, and my pc updates to stay with gaming tech)
Things I'm neutral about:
- Sound editing. (I want the capability but am unlikely to dig in super deep on a regular basis. I may do more of this with VSTs anyway)
- Aesthetics. Nice but won't really sway me.
Things I don't really care about:
- Sampling (honestly never see myself doing it)
- Sequencer (I've used my M50's sequencer an ok amount, but felt limited and I have a better recording setup on the pc anway)
- Super realistic rock organs, clavs, EPs, etc
Obviously I can look at specs and watch videos. But I don't have a way of trying the gear and piecing it all together. I want to hear what you fellow musicians think about a fit for me based on my list above, what you personally have and why you like it, etc.
On the keybed, I like the Kronos's RH3. How does Ivory-G and so on compare?
Thanks for the help!
Need help finding the right upgrade for my Korg M50
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- KVRer
- Topic Starter
- 12 posts since 18 Jan, 2017
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- KVRist
- 393 posts since 13 Jan, 2007
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- KVRian
- 1021 posts since 3 Oct, 2011 from Christchurch, New Zealand
awesome as the mp11 is the OP did say he might want to take it out - and at a cool 33kg that means you better have some willing helpers to move the mp11
Something like a roland rd-800 is going to be 2/3 that weight (which is significant when moving it)
other obvious option would be the Nord stage, but it's all about keybed feel, and whilst a lot of people love the nord it didn't do it for me (shame cos the sound engine side is really flexible)
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- KVRist
- 393 posts since 13 Jan, 2007
Actually, I would recommend the MP7, which is smaller and lighter. I just thought this video showed the MP series off better. If it can handle Chopin, it can probably handle a Jordan Rudess solo 
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- KVRer
- Topic Starter
- 12 posts since 18 Jan, 2017
I guess I had been looking into workstations and overlooking stage pianos...I'll have to look into those! Thanks for the suggestions and keep 'em coming!
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- KVRian
- 1021 posts since 3 Oct, 2011 from Christchurch, New Zealand
if you want something more workstation falvoured (and if you like roland ivory-g actions - also found on the a88 controller and rd-300nx stage piano) the juno ds88 workstation is a bargain. Good daw integrtion as a controller too.WNCaptainjOE wrote:I guess I had been looking into workstations and overlooking stage pianos...I'll have to look into those! Thanks for the suggestions and keep 'em coming!
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- KVRer
- Topic Starter
- 12 posts since 18 Jan, 2017
A terrible question in essence but I have to ask it anyway. How does ivory-g compare with RH3? So far the best keybeds I played are the RH3 on the Kronos 2 and the graded hammer action on the Yamaha CP300. I liked how the RH3 keys felt like they had more consistent resistance while playing. The CP300 felt stiff to press at first and then the key "gave way." Felt good, but not as good as the RH3 to me.jdnz wrote:if you want something more workstation falvoured (and if you like roland ivory-g actions - also found on the a88 controller and rd-300nx stage piano) the juno ds88 workstation is a bargain. Good daw integrtion as a controller too.WNCaptainjOE wrote:I guess I had been looking into workstations and overlooking stage pianos...I'll have to look into those! Thanks for the suggestions and keep 'em coming!
On the Juno DS, I've been looking into it and the FA-08 tonight in my search. Is the FA-08 enough of a step up in terms of build and sound quality to warrant the extra cash?
Also on the Kawai MP7. Does Kawai have a decent history of good DAW integration?
I know, so many quesitons, but I appreciate everyone's time!
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- KVRian
- 1021 posts since 3 Oct, 2011 from Christchurch, New Zealand
fa-08 has the same ivory-g keybed but a definite step up in the sound side (deeper sampling with 'supernatrual' sounds). The rd-800 has the higher spec pha4 keybed but like the mp7/mp11 is a stage piano not a workstation.WNCaptainjOE wrote: On the Juno DS I've been looking at that and the FA-08 tonight in my search. Is the FA-08 enough of a step up in terms of build and sound quality to warrant the extra cash?
As for feel - it's so subjective all you can do is atually try the options and decide what you personally like best.
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- KVRer
- Topic Starter
- 12 posts since 18 Jan, 2017
Part of my problem is not living close enough to a high end music store so I can't try out all of my optionsjdnz wrote:fa-08 has the same ivory-g keybed but a definite step up in the sound side (deeper sampling with 'supernatrual' sounds). The rd-800 has the higher spec pha4 keybed but like the mp7/mp11 is a stage piano not a workstation.WNCaptainjOE wrote: On the Juno DS I've been looking at that and the FA-08 tonight in my search. Is the FA-08 enough of a step up in terms of build and sound quality to warrant the extra cash?
As for feel - it's so subjective all you can do is atually try the options and decide what you personally like best.
. If I'm not buying a kronos I'm buying blind. Obviously feel is subjective so I was just asking a "penny for your thoughts" question.I'll be looking into those stage pianos today over lunch as that Mp11 video was pretty impressive.
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- KVRist
- 393 posts since 13 Jan, 2007
The Kawai pianos aren't going to do software parameter control like a full blown controller keyboard, but they're brilliant for everything else on your wants list. I have the older MP8-II and the keybed is the best I've used, short of one attached to an acoustic grand. That said, feel is, indeed, subjective, so best if you can demo your options first. That also said, I bought mine blind, over the internet, almost a decade ago and it is one of the few instruments that I won't part with.
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- KVRAF
- 23098 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia
Kawai is to me better in actions than Korg or Roland. Which kinda makes sense, they make actual pianos, too, which is something Korg and Roland don't do.
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- KVRAF
- 7789 posts since 28 Apr, 2013
AFAICS, Korg Kronos uses the RH3 and Kawai MP7/MP11 uses the RH2. IINM, Roland uses Fatar? But something I've noticed with Roland is they seem to wear out quicker than others (get weak and sloppy in 'the saddle'). Everything I read about the Kawai VC points it to being a crap shoot of getting a good one or one with issues. And Yamaha also makes pianos which are best to me because I was taught on it as an ideal. However, I really don't like the 88 key Motifs as they feel far too stiff and not like their acoustics. The two VMK188+ I have are fantastic though (also Fatar) and for me, the RH3 in the Kronos is even better. Been contemplating the MP7 and also the Studiologic SL88. I haven't played the MPs, But the couple of times I've seen them played left me disappointed in their sound. But then again, the same is true for me when I see the Nord and Kurzweil in action, but think that's probably more due to the player. The SL88 piques my interest the most ATM because of its improved software communication and zoning. Two models, two different keybeds... and I won't know how Win10/Sonar will handle them under 'class compliant drivers' without getting one in my studio to find out. (Currently, Sonar doesn't recognize any second instance of the same company or model and they demand it is a Win10 issue. Although Sonar is the only one that presents me with that issue.EvilDragon wrote:Kawai is to me better in actions than Korg or Roland. Which kinda makes sense, they make actual pianos, too, which is something Korg and Roland don't do.
)In short, it's all subjective.
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- KVRAF
- 23098 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia
Korg's RH3 has nothing to do with Kawai's RH2. In fact, Kawai's RH2 has NOTHING to do with Korg's previous RH2! Two entirely different manufacturers that ended up with the same acronyms for their actions.
Roland doesn't use Fatar as far as I know. They do their own thing.
Roland doesn't use Fatar as far as I know. They do their own thing.
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- KVRian
- 1021 posts since 3 Oct, 2011 from Christchurch, New Zealand
yepEvilDragon wrote:Roland doesn't use Fatar as far as I know. They do their own thing.
if you do want a fatar action and don't want to go down the studiologic road, supposedly the native instruments s88 is a fatar
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- KVRAF
- 7789 posts since 28 Apr, 2013
EvilDragon wrote:Korg's RH3 has nothing to do with Kawai's RH2. In fact, Kawai's RH2 has NOTHING to do with Korg's previous RH2! Two entirely different manufacturers that ended up with the same acronyms for their actions.
Roland doesn't use Fatar as far as I know. They do their own thing.
Thanks for clarifying that for me.Like I said,
Rolands seem to wear out faster than any other keyboards I've owned.
I love my Kronos RH3 the best, but my VMK188+ is right up there with it (Fatar TP40?)
I was all set to jump on the NI S88 during the last sale, but what NI is shoving down our throats with Native Access has turned me off of wanting anything else from them. In fact, I plan to downgrade what I do have to the minimum of their products and hardware now. That is why the SL88 is looking so much better to me now. But I've always like Kawai and hope to get to test drive one in the near future.
