I would do it in this order:
#1. Learn to do separate outs from drum sampler you already got, and use transient designers and eq to tweak to liking.
#2. If to use hardware drum machines, only consider ones that have separate outs for each instrument, and also ability to exclude from stereo out the one you want separate. And same approach with plugins to tweak it as case #1. But it could mean needing more soundcard inputs, as all hardware does if needing simultaneous inputs. Different modules can always be rendered one at a time though, but more work for a drumtrack doing kick separate render.
Getting into drum machine hardware - worth it?
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- KVRAF
- 5678 posts since 25 Dec, 2004
The Tempest eats em all for breakfast. But if you're on OSX - DrumSpillage will get you some snappy thumpy drums, coupled with the Drop, it's the tightest and thumpiest sound I've heard in software. The Vermona is really the opposite of thumpy, but as always, people have different definitions of punchy, thumpy and all the rest. I think it often comes down to the tightness of the pitch envelope. But if the raw sound of the oscillator isn't there, you're kinda pushing shit uphill.
sketches... http://soundcloud.com/onesnzeros
some artists i support... https://bandcamp.com/spectraselecta
some artists i support... https://bandcamp.com/spectraselecta
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- KVRist
- 119 posts since 31 Aug, 2013 from Chicagoland, USA
I agree with what everyone said. You need either a hardware mixer or AI with at least 6 or 8 inputs to record each sound individually.
That adds to the cost of the drum machine a bit if you don't have one of those already.
Lets not forget one thing however. Playing with drum machines is fun as a MF'er!!!! Damn people, everyone is all, "I would be cautious...if you can't get good sounds from software.....check out samples.....check out virtual drum machines...."
Damn, sometimes its just great to work up a killer beat pushing buttons, turning knobs, and all of those flashing lights!! Good times!
So what I say is this. I consider drum machines/drum synths, to be a luxury item. I'm already mixing ITB and sequencing drums via DAW is extremely efficient and powerful.
These machines are made for the OTB/anti-computer people, or just for fun and they sure are fun! Lets not forget why we do this, because its a good time. Hardware drum machines and hardware sequencers are my definition of a good time. Getting OTB with instruments is great. Its a whole new world of sounds and fx. Just be sure you know what you are getting and what to expect from it. Its not at all like layering and sculpting multilayered pre-processed samples ITB.
That adds to the cost of the drum machine a bit if you don't have one of those already.
Lets not forget one thing however. Playing with drum machines is fun as a MF'er!!!! Damn people, everyone is all, "I would be cautious...if you can't get good sounds from software.....check out samples.....check out virtual drum machines...."
Damn, sometimes its just great to work up a killer beat pushing buttons, turning knobs, and all of those flashing lights!! Good times!
So what I say is this. I consider drum machines/drum synths, to be a luxury item. I'm already mixing ITB and sequencing drums via DAW is extremely efficient and powerful.
These machines are made for the OTB/anti-computer people, or just for fun and they sure are fun! Lets not forget why we do this, because its a good time. Hardware drum machines and hardware sequencers are my definition of a good time. Getting OTB with instruments is great. Its a whole new world of sounds and fx. Just be sure you know what you are getting and what to expect from it. Its not at all like layering and sculpting multilayered pre-processed samples ITB.
Logic Pro X : Prophet Rev2, Blofeld, Toraiz-AS1, Model D, Minibrute, MOTU 828x, Presonus Eris E7's, dozens of pedals
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- KVRist
- 280 posts since 6 Jun, 2003
Analog Rytm with all its outputs over USB is a beautiful thing. I do enjoy providing it sampled sounds though and treating them in addition to the built in capabilities. Incredible machine.pdxindy wrote:Nothing I have in software (which is a lot) can compare to the sound I get from my Analog Rytm.
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- KVRAF
- 5201 posts since 6 May, 2002
A nice sounding set was recently released for FXPansion Tremor. Wavealchemy Revolution is good.
http://www.electric-himalaya.com/fxpansion_tremor.html
http://www.electric-himalaya.com/fxpansion_tremor.html
Intel Core2 Quad CPU + 4 GIG RAM
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- KVRAF
- 5678 posts since 25 Dec, 2004
I'm interested in knowing other peoples definition of a "fat, heavy analog kick"...
For me, just heading away from the Psytrance kicks, there's a sweetspot with the pitch envelope, that isn't zappy, but really gives a THUD. I've heard people waxing lyrical about that Punchbox thing, but to me, it's out of the question, as my definition of PUNCH, is more of a THUD. As in, the kick really pounds. Not just some low-mid/low punch area... but i guess it depends not just on what genre you're producing, but what sounds you like. I myself dabble in Techno, but i really dislike the floppy envelope Vermona techno "white noise' type of sounds. Even though i've been in many 'guitar/bass/drums' bands since the early 90's, i went from Acid house into Goa trance and THEN into the second or maybe third wave of Techno, so I guess I found myself liking the really POUNDING, thumpy kick drum sound. I still like 808/909 stuff... and even though they can make pretty fat kicks, I'd still rather the tighter sweet-spot, that comes from pitch modulating a good sounding oscillator, with a tight adjustable pitch envelope. That's why i bought a Tempest
I guess i'm raving a bit, but that's what i always thought 'punchy' was, some real tight 50Hz kinda thump, not the 100Hz kinda region that i now realise that other people classify as punchy. So furry muff. but it's nice to have some reference point for the discussion. There's many different types and sub-genres of 'Techno' now, so the word is not really sufficient now if you're in the business of explaining to someone.
And it depends the way you work and the amount of detail you like to get into with your sounds.
You might be happy with an Octatrack and a bunch of really nice samples? But i'd probably recommend a JoMoX type analog kick synth, if it's only the kicks you're worried about?
For me, just heading away from the Psytrance kicks, there's a sweetspot with the pitch envelope, that isn't zappy, but really gives a THUD. I've heard people waxing lyrical about that Punchbox thing, but to me, it's out of the question, as my definition of PUNCH, is more of a THUD. As in, the kick really pounds. Not just some low-mid/low punch area... but i guess it depends not just on what genre you're producing, but what sounds you like. I myself dabble in Techno, but i really dislike the floppy envelope Vermona techno "white noise' type of sounds. Even though i've been in many 'guitar/bass/drums' bands since the early 90's, i went from Acid house into Goa trance and THEN into the second or maybe third wave of Techno, so I guess I found myself liking the really POUNDING, thumpy kick drum sound. I still like 808/909 stuff... and even though they can make pretty fat kicks, I'd still rather the tighter sweet-spot, that comes from pitch modulating a good sounding oscillator, with a tight adjustable pitch envelope. That's why i bought a Tempest
I guess i'm raving a bit, but that's what i always thought 'punchy' was, some real tight 50Hz kinda thump, not the 100Hz kinda region that i now realise that other people classify as punchy. So furry muff. but it's nice to have some reference point for the discussion. There's many different types and sub-genres of 'Techno' now, so the word is not really sufficient now if you're in the business of explaining to someone.
And it depends the way you work and the amount of detail you like to get into with your sounds.
You might be happy with an Octatrack and a bunch of really nice samples? But i'd probably recommend a JoMoX type analog kick synth, if it's only the kicks you're worried about?
sketches... http://soundcloud.com/onesnzeros
some artists i support... https://bandcamp.com/spectraselecta
some artists i support... https://bandcamp.com/spectraselecta
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- KVRist
- 280 posts since 6 Jun, 2003
I've yet to find one box or VSTi that can do it all. For me it's layering different sources. My favorites are Kick2, Punchbox and Revolution on the software side, then Analog Rytm and Volca Kick on hardware. IMO the Volca Kick is a must have for the price. Samples usually wind up in the Rytm.sqigls wrote:I'm interested in knowing other peoples definition of a "fat, heavy analog kick"...
I had a JoMox Xbase 909 years ago and sold it off, but wished I kept it. Thankfully I sampled/recorded the heck out of it, but looks like there's libraries of it out there now. The new JoMox box coming out will be worth looking into. Would love to have a Tempest at some point. That and Rytm seems like the hardware dream team. I personally don't have any interest in owning a real 909 or 808 -- it's just silly money for them at this point.
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- KVRian
- 507 posts since 14 Mar, 2004
I can recommend the Vermona Kick Lancet. It does just that, synthesizes a kick. It is basically the Vermona DRM1's kick drum synthesizer, plus an extra pot/parameter. It is quite capable of a TR909 style kick, so if that's all you're considering a TR8 or TR909 for, consider this.
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- KVRist
- 97 posts since 17 Jan, 2017
This days it´s not matter what you take. It´s how it´s made.realKlangfeld wrote:Hi there! I am a techno producer but whenever I listen to my tracks, they are missing that fat, heavy analog kick
Ask yourself, if Veangance takes phatt analog samples in 44.1 and you hear a track with 44.1 with that favorite Bassdrum. Do you really think it´s the Source? You will not become that result with a real 909 or any other machine if you not go in deep with the Kick Sound itself.
For german reader take a look here:
https://www.sequencer.de/synthesizer/vi ... hp?t=79416
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- Banned
- 12368 posts since 30 Apr, 2002 from i might peeramid
here it is, just a quick port, triggers on any keyxoxos wrote:i'm planning on releasing the kick drum from bong vst as a free single, say a week or so. for me, that covers a lot of air moving and applications.
http://xoxos.net/vst/bongkick.zip
eight algorithms, moves air.
you come and go, you come and go. amitabha neither a follower nor a leader be tagore "where roads are made i lose my way" where there is certainty, consideration is absent.
