Vocoloid & Your DAW: Comments, Opinions, etc.

[imagegod2000]

I've been thinking of purchasing 'Vocoloid' and using it with Reaper (Vocoloid is a synthetic voice/singing program).

Anyone know anything about it? (Other than it's huge in Japan, and that one of its synthetic singers/performers, HATSUNE MIKU, is one of the biggest stars in the world: http://mikuexpo.com/jp2016/en).

The videos make it look fairly simple to use...is that (relatively) accurate? https://www.vocaloid.com/en

The singing produced sounds incredible to me. (i.e. incredibly accurate/incredibly musical).

What's strange is that I never see ads for it, nor hear any 'buzz' on U.S. music forums...any idea why?

Any/all replies are welcome...thanks!

[wagtunes]

Well, here goes.

Most people here hate it, with a passion. I am probably the biggest Vocaloid user in this forum.

Here is my Soundcloud playlist of close to 100 tracks that I have done with the software.

https://soundcloud.com/steven-wagenheim ... -originals

Okay, now the 25 cent tour.

Vocaloid, unless you're using Cubase, is a stand alone app. It will not work in a DAW. There is a special version of Vocaloid 4 that will run inside of Cubase. Another option is to get Crypton's Piapro Studio, which is basically nearly feature-identical to Yamaha's full V3 Editor, but bundled for free with Crypton's V3's and V4's.

I use Cubase so I got the Cubase editor and I find it very easy to use.

Now, the editor itself comes with no Vocaloid programs. In other words, it makes no sound on its own. You have to buy a "voice" in order to make sounds. The voices go for about $100 each. Sometimes they go on sale.

So far I have

Cyber Diva
Cyber Songman
Dex
Daina
Ruby

My personal favorites are Dex and Cyber Diva. There is not a lot of difference between the women singers as there are between the two men. But there are subtle differences. You will recognize them as you use them.

Using Vocaloid has a learning curve but it isn't terribly hard. There are two parts to creating a vocal.

The melody
The lyrics

The melody can be created in one of two ways. You can either play it manually on your keyboard (this will give it a more human feel) through a synth and then convert the synth part to a Vocaloid part or enter the melody into the piano roll manually. I prefer doing it that way as my playing has serious timing issues and I tend to make a lot of mistakes.

Lyrics are not as straight forward as one would like. Each note, by default, produces an "ooo" sound like "you" so you have to go into the note and modify the default word.

Now, some words are straight forward. They sound just as you type them. So if you type in the word "help" it will say the word help.

But then you have words that you have to spell phonetically because the English spelling doesn't translate exactly. This is further complicated by multi syllable words. So sometimes getting a word to sound properly takes some time to find just the right combination of letters. You will need to learn how to actually "hear" what is being said when you say a word. In other words, your phonetics have to be excellent or you'll get strange results.

Even with all of that, because Vocaloid has to appeal to both American and Great Britain English, you will find some words, depending on the particular Vocaloid, sound odd no matter what you do.

I've been using the program for about 9 months now. I would consider myself an expert with it but it didn't happen overnight. And sometimes I still have to cut my losses and settle for something because that particular Vocaloid just isn't capable of producing the sound for a particular word that I want.

Like I said, most people here hate it. My music has received most of its criticism because of the vocals. So if you're going to get something like this, you have to be happy with it for its own sake and not to try to impress others because most will not be impressed.

We are not quite to the point where a Vocaloid can replace a human voice simply because the richness and dynamics aren't there. It's essentially a one dimensional program. But compared to early Vocaloids, which were downright awful, they have come a long way. Listen to my stuff. Listen to the Cyber Diva version of Taylor Swift's "Blank Space." It's really very good.

If you want my opinion and want one male and one female, get Dex and Cyber Diva. Dex has a clearer tone than Cyber Songman, which I find I have to EQ a lot to get to sound good. Plus, Cyber Songman has more of an accent that I'm not thrilled about. Cyber Diva is still the best of all the English Vocaloids.

If you have any specific questions about things that I haven't covered, please feel free to ask.

[imagegod2000]

Thanks so much for the run-down...very much appreciated!

I also think the voices sound excellent...I think the 'blow-back' may be a function of expectations...I didn't expect a 'human sounding voice'...but it certainly functions musically, (not to mention extremely easy to understand--perhaps even more so than actual humans...at least as programmed by you) and in a larger mix with human voices, I think it could be very valuable...thanks!

[bigcat1969]

I dislike the Vocaloid sound intently and respect the amount of effort and skill Wagtunes puts into his work.

[Scotty]

I dislike the Vocaloid sound intently and respect the amount of effort and skill Wagtunes puts into his work.

Even if the sound doesn't appeal it seems like a reasonably efficient way of doing a mock up if you don't have access to a good singer. Also props to Mr. Wagtunes. That's a lot of output and a lot of passion. Cheers!

[teacue]

http://www.vocaloidotaku.net/index.php?

The Vocaloidotaku forums are Vocaloid friendly places with a lot of informations from a lot of people who are intensively using Vocaloids.
You will find a lot about technic, usability and how to as well as about old and new products, the Vocaloid community, the artists, the developpers and the events.
It's a really good place to learn more about Vocaloids.

Unfortunately I find that threads about Vocaloids on KVR stay quite limited.
Sadly sometimes you can even find some comments showing a great absence of any respect (to put it mildly) for a very interesting and evolving technology as well as for a different musical aesthetic.
But ... everything can change

BTW the right term is not Vocoloid but Vocaloid

On my side I use Vocaloids within Cubase and the basic use is as easy or difficult as with any vsti.
But in the long time there is quite a lot to learn about how to use each vocal as there are very particular way for each soundbank to reach particular results.
And these way may differ considerably from voice bank to voice bank.

[wagtunes]

http://www.vocaloidotaku.net/index.php?

The Vocaloidotaku forums are Vocaloid friendly places with a lot of informations from a lot of people who are intensively using Vocaloids.
You will find a lot about technic, usability and how to as well as about old and new products, the Vocaloid community, the artists, the developpers and the events.
It's a really good place to learn more about Vocaloids.

Unfortunately I find that threads about Vocaloids on KVR stay quite limited.
Sadly sometimes you can even find some comments showing a great absence of any respect (to put it mildly) for a very interesting and evolving technology as well as for a different musical aesthetic.
But ... everything can change

BTW the right term is not Vocoloid but Vocaloid

On my side I use Vocaloids within Cubase and the basic use is as easy or difficult as with any vsti.
But in the long time there is quite a lot to learn about how to use each vocal as there are very particular way for each soundbank to reach particular results.
And these way may differ considerably from voice bank to voice bank.

Thank you for the forum info. I signed up today. Maybe there my work will be appreciated. LOL.

That was a joke guys. Don't get your knickers in a twist. LOL.