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Cinebient wrote: In the meantime, what software could you recommend to create my own images for Kaleidoscope?
U&I Software Artmatic Designer
Photoshop
etc.

but if you want "musical" stuff as opposed to more abstract sound-design you need things that generally have some kind of iterative mathematical organization... Adobe Illustrator to Photoshop for example could do it, although the process is slow/tedious....

think of things like grid-based iterative architectural motifs with some form of "theme and variation " over the time (X) axis. This is the most ripe area IMHO (and why Galbanum sound design resource line is called "Architecture"))

Painting/drawing by hand is not the most productive approach IMHO. It's fun briefly for its novelty and interactivity, but it doesn't usually produce musical results b/c no one can really draw perfectly quantized shapes etc. It's OK for making "single hit sound design events" and similar things, but you aren't going to create a musical arpeggio or ostinato this way for example.

Pictures of a computer circuit board could be cool for example. Things that have some kind of mathematical pattern, and some variation within this pattern. That is usually what is coolest.

You're looking for things that "Balance predictability with surprise" as I like to say... :tu:

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Galbanum wrote:
Sampleconstruct wrote:No Midi, root note changes can be automized in a DAW, but that will cause some clicking artifacts to occur (in most scenarios).

Yup Simon is correct. :tu:


Actually KS automation is still broken under Windows (win10 at least). It won't work in Live or Bitwig:
wasi wrote:Bitwig shows a parameter called "BaseFreqNoteIndex" but as soon as I touch it, it jumps to B and then I can only go from C (0.000) to B (anything >0.000). The octave parameter ("BaseFreqNoteOctave") only allows -5 (0.000) or +10 (>0.000).

Some other automation parameters have similar issues IIRC.

No offense, but I'm starting to feel like these reports are being ignored:

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 2#p6535562
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 5#p6537815
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 8#p6522988
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic ... 8#p6526557
wasi wrote:OK I finally got around to testing and automation doesn't work right in Live either:

- BaseFreqNoteIndex only lets you switch between B and C, same as for bitwig.

- BaseFreqNoteOctave only lets you switch between -5 and 10, same as Bitwig.

There's some other odd 'automation' behaviour too, like that you can only select '1 Spring' or FIR (not two spring or string etc.)., FilterLowType only gives you "off" or 6dB etc.

It seems to me that Kaleidoscope automation is broken under Windows. None of the parameters that aren't just slider/knob values seem to work on the full range. They all just give you two values out of the available array.



I assume from his post that lxegs filed a support ticket. Is this issue being looked into?

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...well as discussed on the previous page smooth automation of various KS parameters is really not currently possible. Changing things like Reference freq requires massive recalculations which we really can't do smoothly/realtime quite yet. (damn it, quantum computers where supposed to be available on iPad by now! :wink: If The Steve was still alive we'd have them by now. :D )

So understanding this, I guess my question is, if automation creates clicks etc. (do to the fact that the required math is too heavy to recalc realtime) is automation really particularly useful at the moment anyway? At the moment basically a total of zero parameters can be automated smoothly. So do we really need to "fix" access to automation if it does not produce particularly useful results anyway?

In my current thinking, KS is basically one huge internal automation machine. It's calculating millions of point of automation itself internally. Currently we think of the various GUI parameters as setting up conditions to allow KS to do it's thing. It's not quite yet a performance tool that is meant to be played like an instrument. Changing it's various parameters are not currently smooth/artifact free. It's on the task list, but it's not imminent.

So with that said, what specifically are you missing regarding automation usage cases?

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From my experience root not automation in KS is indeed very useful workflow-wise, changing the root notes on the fly as a track plays is much less hassle than setting up numerous instances of KS, automating the sends to each, and bouncing each file separately, then importing those... yada yada. Once the root notes are automated the resulting clicks can easily be removed with a de-clicker like in RX Advanced, even in real time.

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Galbanum wrote:...well as discussed on the previous page smooth automation of various KS parameters is really not currently possible. Changing things like Reference freq requires massive recalculations which we really can't do smoothly/realtime quite yet. (damn it, quantum computers where supposed to be available on iPad by now! :wink: If The Steve was still alive we'd have them by now. :D )

So understanding this, I guess my question is, if automation creates clicks etc. (do to the fact that the required math is too heavy to recalc realtime) is automation really particularly useful at the moment anyway? At the moment basically a total of zero parameters can be automated smoothly. So do we really need to "fix" access to automation if it does not produce particularly useful results anyway?

In my current thinking, KS is basically one huge internal automation machine. It's calculating millions of point of automation itself internally. Currently we think of the various GUI parameters as setting up conditions to allow KS to do it's thing. It's not quite yet a performance tool that is meant to be played like an instrument. Changing it's various parameters are not currently smooth/artifact free. It's on the task list, but it's not imminent.

So with that said, what specifically are you missing regarding automation usage cases?
I think you don't understand what the issue is. It's not that they don't change smoothly, it's that they don't automate in a controllable way at all. For example, the full range of automation only changes between two arbitrary base notes. The other notes are 'unreachable' by automation. It's really not that it doesn't work satisfactorily - it doesn't work right at all.

I'd be happy with clicks, but it's flat out unusable under Windows. You simply cannot automate anything in a predictable way. Unless you happen to want to bounce between those two arbitrary notes that do show up when you run an automation curve.

Automation really is broken under Windows.

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wasi wrote:
Automation really is broken under Windows.
Ah... OK, I did misunderstand. Exploring/fixing... Thanks.

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Galbanum wrote:
wasi wrote:
Automation really is broken under Windows.
Ah... OK, I did misunderstand. Exploring/fixing... Thanks.
Whew, thanks! I thought I was going nuts. :lol:

IIRC B2 has similar 'automation' issues. If you find the cause in KS you may want to compare the respective code.

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Three instances of Kaleidoscope processing modulated pink noise, two rainmaker textures and some ocean waves, some volume automation and external FX.

https://soundcloud.com/sampleconstruct/ ... -patchpool

...and some barrel drums processed by 1 instance of KS:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_2-KbyPYKQ

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The question arouse today: how do I use waveforms in Kaleidoscope? So I made a little tutorial on this topic, just basic info for KS novices:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwR9zIdfUVE

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Jamming on my HAPI (Hand Activated Percussion Instrument - tuned to a Dminor scale) through KS, stepping though various rhythmical pattern based patches in odd time-signatures, some Aether and MFMs for delays:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBvVV9p2EUc

New-age-square-patterns:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnuhSL__Kf4

Alien sound effects meets drone - 5 instances of KS:
https://soundcloud.com/sampleconstruct/ ... -patchpool

I hope 2017 will be another evolutionary year for Kaleidoscope, I'll do my share for sure :)

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How's the update coming along Andrew?

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Galbanum wrote:
wasi wrote:
Automation really is broken under Windows.
Ah... OK, I did misunderstand. Exploring/fixing... Thanks.
Just a little update on that, since this is on the front page again: According to 2c automation won't ever work for the VST version due to some unspecified VST2 limitations. AU works fine.

So if you're on windows and can't get parameters to automate reliably you can stop banging your head against the table, that's just the way it is. :neutral:

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Hez wrote:How's the update coming along Andrew?
I hope 2017 will be another evolutionary year for Kaleidoscope, I'll do my share for sure :)
It's gonna be more than an evolution. It's going be completely insane. We have accomplished a much larger part of the complete vision for KS recently.

Almost all of the (extensive) new features are done. We getting into the polishing and optimization phase and soon after that beta. :tu:

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Fresh from the experimental lab:

Experiment with crusher-X 6 Beta version, processing one of my Kaleidoscope patches which is processing the field recording I made inside a Russian train.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FKxQah-2VIc

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Made a drone with Kaleidoscope in string resonator mode, stereo filtered it with Volcano 2, and fed it into B2. The result is a rich sounding drone / space ambient track.

Still being inspired by Kaleidoscope. Thats the important thing :phones:

https://soundcloud.com/voice303/out-of- ... -the-light
SW: Cubase 9.5 | Komplete 11 | Omnisphere 2 | Perfect Storm 2.5 | Soundtoys 5
HW: Steinberg UR28M | Focal Alpha 50 | Fender Jazz Bass | Alesis VI25

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