cubase 9

[bustedfist]

I was kinda hoping that I'd hate this, but now it seems inevitable.

Still concerned about the customer service for obvious reasons, but it's been so tight and stable, maybe that isn't something to be concerned over.

Still wish I could figure out this weird once a day (maybe twice) spike thing. It must be linked to the the net (cubey trying to phone home so to speak).

Question, and I remember having this issue even with cubase 4/5, why is it impossible to "freeze" an audio track? What happens is that they don't freeze, they mute.

Make sure Auto Save is disabled in Prefs., could cause spikes/ issues. If it's a laptop, CPU speed stepping/ throttling is bad, look to BIOS. Power options could also be a culprit, something having to power up after shutting down due to non-use.

[SJ_Digriz]

Yes, thanks all.

It's just a matter of getting my mind right with it, you know? No biggie, nothing to complain about (well other than the hub, more on that later) but just getting the facts straight.

Pretty easy to figure out (of course I already had 4-5.5)

Sorry, I'm just starting to read this thread, so maybe this has been answered. This is NOT correct. What you can't save is group track and FX track assignments. But you can save the multi-out configuration.

[SJ_Digriz]

-Kill all examples of a plug (ala pro tools or studio one)

I have never tried it, but I think you can do this with the project logical editor.

[SJ_Digriz]

Ok, I don't do group channels all that often because of the way I mix. I'm not using buss-type FX, by which I mean you apply a single thing to a Group in Cubase terms. SO, Groups in no way supersedes FX Channels for me.
I actually mix in VE Pro, where a buss is a group if the channels of the group reside in that channel-as-output but the difference can't be all that confusing because I'm not all that swift.
Here is another sense of 'buss' though, if I have a whole guitar FX setup, it's its own frame (instance/project), and since I'm automating it in that frame there is no need for more than one output back to Cubase. Sub-mixing.

But I can see why one wouldn't necessarily call every channel bussed to, a buss. But it hasta be, because ProTools, because pros are slow... whatever

Sorry to interject late. But, I use groups as the stem output route. So, if you mix to stems then groups becomes the summing location. I'm sure you are doing something similar in VEP. For whatever reason, I send the audio back and do it in Cubase. 6 of one half dozen of the other. Just pointing out that they aren't just for FX groups.

All of the extra track types have morphed to the point where there are only very subtle differences. I've maintained all along that the audio track types are stupid and unnecessarily confusing. The funny part is that by Borg logic, they were all added to make it "easier". Same with Instrument Tracks. A really awful solution to the problem. Instead of fixing the implementation of the Rack architecture, they added an entirely new set of code to f**k up.

[SJ_Digriz]

As far as the output/saving/archive thing, I haven't figured it out. But I'm reading all the info and trying to get the combo correct.

Track archives are basically an extension of track presets, just at the project level. So the same rules apply for both things. It's a lot easier if you look at it this way...

Individual track types can only archive or preset their local settings (no routing beyond track configuration)

RACK Instruments are the original track type for VSTi. As such they do not work with "track" presets. They are an individual track type so only their local configuration can be saved as a preset/archive. No routing. And you lose the connection to the MIDI tracks you have assigned to them. However, you can save all of the assigned MIDI tracks as a preset and load first the rack preset, then the MIDI preset and get a 1 click assignment to the output. Oddly, I did pull a Rack+MIDI+audio routing config out of an archive once and it worked. But, I think it was a fluke, because I have failed since and I don't believe it is supposed to work. The only thing I can think of is I had something already set inside the receiving project that jump started the assignment process.

Instruments TRACKS are the combination of MIDI+Rack in a single track type. This has all of the additional "track preset" capabilities. So, you can name the multi-output audio channels (except channel 1 which I have FRed for 10 years), and assign multiple midi tracks to the instrument track, then save that combination as a TRACK preset. So, Track Presets go with Instrument Tracks. And, since you can save the track preset, you can pull the full configuration out of a project archive. The limitation here is down stream audio paths are not saved (group tracks, fx tracks, sends).

But basically, track presets and the archive provide pretty much the same capability as far as reaching back for a configuration of a specific group of track types. Hopefully we will get those downstream audio channels in an update at some point.

[incubus]

Question, and I remember having this issue even with cubase 4/5, why is it impossible to "freeze" an audio track? What happens is that they don't freeze, they mute.

Render IN PLACE

Really, I found this by accident

Edit, now that is F8 since I don't do video

[lfm]

But basically, track presets and the archive provide pretty much the same capability as far as reaching back for a configuration of a specific group of track types. Hopefully we will get those downstream audio channels in an update at some point.

I find track presets weird in how they are implemented, especially multitrack presets where you have to remember which setup of tracks they were setup on. It's not like just dropping it on background and tracks are created for you wiht everything in them. I think it was StudioOne that good implementation of that - a preset for a synth dropped on background, a track were created, and synth loaded with that preset - that's the way to do it.

I also expected in C9 importing of tracks from projects could keep routing between tracks if they had that in original project, so that they would finish what they started in 8.x. So you could use any project as archive to import parts from with a range of busses and stuff.

So track archives were the best track template thingy I found so far for a number of tracks and routings between them. But as always, there is a naming issue - since there is no create track archive. You have to know to select tracks, and go to export->Selected tracks - and save it. Then there is import tracks from archive from that saved file. Just the Steinberg way of doing things - counterintuitive and you have to read manual.

And I reported a bug for archives 18 months ago and will soon see if they fixed that or not. I got weird result importing, if tracks on save to archive were spread out - not adjacent. Like I had SuperiorDrummer on track 14(and some), and bus for it on on track 32 - it was a mess. Workaround was to create an empty project with just the stuff I want as archive and use as template, and save those - then it worked fine. So if people loose routings and strange fenomena like I had, that SuperiorDrummer outputs were all in a very strange order after import - it might still be there.

[incubus]

So, in the end, to sum up, to wrap it up,

Like the manual says, you must have like parts.

[SJ_Digriz]

Well, Track Preset Multi does allow Instrument Tracks and MIDI tracks. This works well for orchestral VSTi setups. But it sucks for drums when you want to route all the outputs to busses.

However, a work around for drum bussing is to use the internal VSTi mixer for the plugin and use the multi out assignments as your drum busses. It's kind of confusing at first, but I'm used to it now and it is a huge time saver when loading complex drum configurations.

[jancivil]

Ok, I don't do group channels all that often because of the way I mix. I'm not using buss-type FX, by which I mean you apply a single thing to a Group in Cubase terms. SO, Groups in no way supersedes FX Channels for me.
I actually mix in VE Pro, where a buss is a group if the channels of the group reside in that channel-as-output but the difference can't be all that confusing because I'm not all that swift.
Here is another sense of 'buss' though, if I have a whole guitar FX setup, it's its own frame (instance/project), and since I'm automating it in that frame there is no need for more than one output back to Cubase. Sub-mixing.

But I can see why one wouldn't necessarily call every channel bussed to, a buss. But it hasta be, because ProTools, because pros are slow... whatever

Sorry to interject late. But, I use groups as the stem output route. So, if you mix to stems then groups becomes the summing location. I'm sure you are doing something similar in VEP. For whatever reason, I send the audio back and do it in Cubase. 6 of one half dozen of the other. Just pointing out that they aren't just for FX groups.

I'm just talking out of having an idle moment.
I used to mix to stems. If I group in Cubase it means I sent more than one output from VEP, which I don't do anymore (if only because it's more efficient for the machine). It's just a matter of one level control for, say, the whole of the guitar and its processing. I do much less than most people do. I mix while composing and the composition is finished, the mix is more or less finished. And I'll make a new project with a 2-file, one of the reasons is video.

There's more than one thread here about Cubase, this being one, where people are talking way over my head. But I know groups aren't just FX send thingies.

[jancivil]

As far as the output/saving/archive thing, I haven't figured it out. But I'm reading all the info and trying to get the combo correct.

Instruments TRACKS are the combination of MIDI+Rack in a single track type. This has all of the additional "track preset" capabilities. So, you can name the multi-output audio channels (except channel 1 which I have FRed for 10 years), and assign multiple midi tracks to the instrument track, then save that combination as a TRACK preset. So, Track Presets go with Instrument Tracks. And, since you can save the track preset, you can pull the full configuration out of a project archive. The limitation here is down stream audio paths are not saved (group tracks, fx tracks, sends).

Now I understand what the <track preset> would do for his problem. A drum kit doesn't need more than the one channel really so that solves the first part.

I learned to mix after I acquired VEP actually. I relate to needing a template for drum outputs, I may as well be consistent and not set up anew, really ever. There's two things available there, save what used to be called VI Frame, now it's 'Project' and I would have one of these for drums, and maybe partial auxiliary percussion. Or, let's say that latter is going to be elaborate and enough changed from the last time, one can save a 'Channel Set' and all the connections and FX on busses are there. The problem there is the Automation Map is tied to the Project slot numbers and disappears in Channel Sets.
>>> So my imagination of the solution here is simply save channel sets in Cubase, but I have not actually done that for this specifically. I was looking for a similar solution the other day to make the {Instrument Track Channel w VEP's return and its} automation lanes a copy/paste deal but I worked around it finally. It appears that instantiating it via the Rack puts the kibosh on teh Track Preset.

[SJ_Digriz]

Ok, I don't do group channels all that often because of the way I mix. I'm not using buss-type FX, by which I mean you apply a single thing to a Group in Cubase terms. SO, Groups in no way supersedes FX Channels for me.
I actually mix in VE Pro, where a buss is a group if the channels of the group reside in that channel-as-output but the difference can't be all that confusing because I'm not all that swift.
Here is another sense of 'buss' though, if I have a whole guitar FX setup, it's its own frame (instance/project), and since I'm automating it in that frame there is no need for more than one output back to Cubase. Sub-mixing.

But I can see why one wouldn't necessarily call every channel bussed to, a buss. But it hasta be, because ProTools, because pros are slow... whatever

Sorry to interject late. But, I use groups as the stem output route. So, if you mix to stems then groups becomes the summing location. I'm sure you are doing something similar in VEP. For whatever reason, I send the audio back and do it in Cubase. 6 of one half dozen of the other. Just pointing out that they aren't just for FX groups.

I'm just talking out of having an idle moment.
I used to mix to stems. If I group in Cubase it means I sent more than one output from VEP, which I don't do anymore (if only because it's more efficient for the machine). It's just a matter of one level control for, say, the whole of the guitar and its processing. I do much less than most people do. I mix while composing and the composition is finished, the mix is more or less finished. And I'll make a new project with a 2-file, one of the reasons is video.

There's more than one thread here about Cubase, this being one, where people are talking way over my head. But I know groups aren't just FX send thingies.

I think on this topic there is no "correct" answer. It's about what makes sense to you as you work. Cubase just unnecessarily muddies the terminology, in addition to complicating the routing options with tons of subtle variations that aren't really necessary. As demonstrated by feature creep of each track type to the point where they have almost completely the same core functions.

I really like VEP and can see why you want to do it the way you do. But, I was a creature of habit prior to getting VEP and had tons of projects with various group channel configurations that I just continued to use.

[SJ_Digriz]

It appears that instantiating it via the Rack puts the kibosh on teh Track Preset.

yep. There are only a couple of minor differences between rack and instrument tracks now. So even I, the person who hates instrument tracks the most, have switched over to them completely.

EDIT: However, I still assign MIDI tracks to them and rarely put MIDI on the actual Instrument track, even though that's what it was initially meant to do.

[jancivil]

Yeah, I wouldn't want to learn anything new for this.
The thing of VEP is the Automation Map, one window has all of the plugins parameters so when back in Cubase it's all perfectly clear and cuts down significantly on what for me was one a these Cubase PITA situations.

So I don't see much of Cubase's mixer, one VEP Project = one Instrument Channel (I meant Instrument Channel when I typed Instrument Track above, the former of which is from the Rack instance). I like live interaction with Reaktor Skanner (a no-go in VEP) so I may have 2 or 3 channels up in Cubase now.

[incubus]

Alright, I'm in.

Was hoping to get it used, but can't make that happen so MF/6mo no interest it is.

I really REALLY want to thank everyone here , it's been very valuable