Syntronik [update March 2018: New T-03 Bonus Content & 4-for-1 bass synth promo] available

[spacekid]

Maybe a separate thread where discussions about the actual use of Syntronik, tips, tricks, sounds etc can take place.

This senseless argument about what it is or isn't or what it can or can't do will go on here.

Anyway like I said this synth......yes,sample based synth....is a lot of fun and can provide a surprisingly wide range of sounds given it's limited editing/modulation capability...if you have any kind of imagination. If that can't be seen then I say the observer is myopic.

Back on topic........Peter about the Aftertouch. Is it possible to assign AT to Vibrato ?

If we're taking feature requests for the future a full featured Mod Matrix (and global LFOs) would be most welcome here as would a global Mixer tab.

Also speaking of the future....obviously the framework exists to sell individual instruments so any idea on what synth will be next in the collection ? Again if we're taking requests an Ensoniq VFX module would be nice.

+1 for a new thread. It's just too bad a few of you 'synth designers' don't give it a chance, because selling multis is an option. You would have to supply individual presets that make up the multi, plus the multi..so it is a bit of work...I can see why you shy away. I've been able to do a bit with the sample synth that gets away from the original sound..you've got effect LFOs and plenty of options..it's just different..now on to a new thread minus the debaters..you can have this one.

[plexuss]

Then you're not looking at the whole picture. It's a 4 Osc (Layer) Synth whose Oscs are sample based.

What I am filtrering are already made patches, that is, I cannot change their waveforms and they have already been filtered and enveloped once and I can only filter/envelope them a second time. .... Can someone plz confirm or reject this assumption once and for all?

Syntronik is more versatile than your assumption here. The samples do not appear to have an a,p envelope imposed on them. however, it does sound like the are envelopes and LFOs modulating the oscilator width, phase, etc. I also hear some pitch modulation on the osc samples. I believe what IK did was make patches on the synths, and then sample the oscilators from that patch, dry. for each patch there are usually 2 oscillator samples - the 2nd oscilator sample can be switched on and off and detuned. So right there you can maipulate the sample... a bit. a bit more than you could with just a sample of the oscilators combined. This then runs into a filter and a filter and amp envelope. there is also an LFO for modulating a mix of pan, pitch, filter.

Each preset is a combination of the original samples, filter, envelopes, LFO and effects which can take the original samples into a lot of different textures and sounds. But the sound will have the character of the original samples - that's the limitation - all the sounds made are based on the samples as a source - compared to a synth, you do not have control over the sound of the oscilators.

Pull up the patch Bring Hope with You and disable all the effects and turn off the filter and all modulations - you will hear the raw osc samples which have a lot of modulation going on in them.

This may be why it's hard to characterize Syntronik. Its more than your usual ROMpler, it is a sample library, it's not quite a synth. I say the latter because typically with a synth you also have control over parameters of the oscilator which contribute significantly to the sound of the patch - with Syntronik you do not any control over the oscilators other than pitch and osc 2 on/off.

It's no different than UVI's products for example in terms of the architecture. Where they differ is in their sound and usability. Maybe these shold be called "pseudo-synths".

[Elektronisch]

To me it seems more like a plain old sample library.

Then you're not looking at the whole picture. It's a 4 Osc (Layer) Synth whose Oscs are sample based. There are Per Layer Arp/Seqs and per layer FX (hint). Yes the editing and modulation capabilities are limited compared to the synths that were sampled but to be honest many of those hardware synths are limited.

I've got just about every synth from Alchemy to Z3ta+2 so if I want something that allows extensive editing/modulation I have many to choose from. Anyway I'm going to go back and make some more sounds with Syntronik now....tons of fun....

Then you are in denial if you are saying that he is not looking at a whole picture because that means Kontakt is 16 osc synth, Patcher inside fl studio can make 1000 osc synths... xpand 2 is 4 osc synth, sampletank 3 can be 16 osc synth. Syntronik is not 4 osc synth and thats the reality.

[Teksonik]

Then you're not looking at the whole picture. It's a 4 Osc (Layer) Synth whose Oscs are sample based.

No, it's not...

No matter how much you delude yourself...

Of course it is.....no matter how much that fact eludes you.

[Elektronisch]

Then you're not looking at the whole picture. It's a 4 Osc (Layer) Synth whose Oscs are sample based.

No, it's not...

No matter how much you delude yourself...

Of course it is.....no matter how much that fact eludes you.

Nope, thats 100% FACT

[Teksonik]

Except, and I'll take the simplest example I can come up with, given the actual Minimoog and Syntronik's Minimoog, there are things you can do on the real one that you simply can't do with Syntronik's because the controls aren't there. End of story.

You guys are simply not getting it....there are things you can do with Syntronik that you can't do with a MiniMoog......like make it sound like an SY-99.

Stop focusing on what it can't do and embrace what it can do. I'm making some great patches using it's 4 OSCs (Layers) and a little bit of creativity........(some of that is needed).

Is this the most powerful synth in existence ? Of course not but like I said it's tons of fun and capable of a surprising range of sounds that will expand if IK ever releases more Instruments.

These were never advertised as 1:1 Emulations although I'd love to get 1:1 Emulations of all those synths for $70.

[IncarnateX]

Syntronik is more versatile than your assumption here. The samples do not appear to have an a,p envelope imposed on them. however, it does sound like the are envelopes and LFOs modulating the oscilator width, phase, etc. I also hear some pitch modulation on the osc samples. I believe what IK did was make patches on the synths, and then sample the oscilators from that patch, dry. for each patch there are usually 2 oscillator samples - the 2nd oscilator sample can be switched on and off and detuned. So right there you can maipulate the sample... a bit. a bit more than you could with just a sample of the oscilators combined. This then runs into a filter and a filter and amp envelope. there is also an LFO for modulating a mix of pan, pitch, filter.

Each preset is a combination of the original samples, filter, envelopes, LFO and effects which can take the original samples into a lot of different textures and sounds. But the sound will have the character of the original samples - that's the limitation - all the sounds made are based on the samples as a source - compared to a synth, you do not have control over the sound of the oscilators.

Thanks a bloody friggin lot for this clarification. In my terms Syntronic is then a hybrid between a sample player and a sample based synth but tending toward the former more than the latter. A little step forward from Sample Tank. Fine. Now with a 50 GB lib there should be enough material for several tracks without too much redundance. Look forward to hear some more.

[Teksonik]

Then you're not looking at the whole picture. It's a 4 Osc (Layer) Synth whose Oscs are sample based.

No, it's not...

No matter how much you delude yourself...

Of course it is.....no matter how much that fact eludes you.

Nope, thats 100% FACT

Then you haven't got a clue what a "FACT" is............

[Teksonik]

Then you're not looking at the whole picture. It's a 4 Osc (Layer) Synth whose Oscs are sample based.

this definition would only make sense to me if the layers actually are comprised of sampled raw waveforms that I can choose myself

Then you are limiting your definition of Synthesis. There are limitations to this synth.....lots of them but instead of focusing on what it can't do work with what you have.

Again I'm having tons of fun with this.....as much as I ever had with Diva or luSH101 or The Legend or Poly-Ana or......Is it going to replace any of them ? No but it will supplement them quite nicely.

Ok ears rested....cramp in neck gone....Back to making more patches with Syntronik.....

[tengotiempo]

I like Syntronik a lot, but while im playing around i realize something strange... tried with pro v and TO3 now.. if the cutoff and/or Resonance are wide open, it affects definitely the release of the samples..does anyone else have same experience ?

best regards

found out that it just happens when i have knobs assigned to the filter..but there are just 2 knobs assigned and nothing double assigned..so i im quite sure, that the same cc which is sending midi to the resonance is also assigned to release internally... is there a midi implementation chart somewhere ?

[wagtunes]

Except, and I'll take the simplest example I can come up with, given the actual Minimoog and Syntronik's Minimoog, there are things you can do on the real one that you simply can't do with Syntronik's because the controls aren't there. End of story.

You guys are simply not getting it....there are things you can do with Syntronik that you can't do with a MiniMoog......like make it sound like an SY-99.

Stop focusing on what it can't do and embrace what it can do. I'm making some great patches using it's 4 OSCs (Layers) and a little bit of creativity........(some of that is needed).

Is this the most powerful synth in existence ? Of course not but like I said it's tons of fun and capable of a surprising range of sounds that will expand if IK ever releases more Instruments.

These were never advertised as 1:1 Emulations although I'd love to get 1:1 Emulations of all those synths for $70.

Well, then in that case, we might as well just call anything that has a filter and an LFO a synth and call it a day. Problem is, with so loose a definition, it doesn't really help somebody who may come here for synth recommendations for a "traditional" VA, wavetable, granular or whatever synth. We might as well, at that point, just toss in Nexus and any other "playback engine" into the mix as long as it has some kind of control over the sound and isn't just static like playing back a piano sample that can't be changed at all.

But if I come here saying I am looking for a new "synth" that I can design a sound library for because programming the synth takes some skill and not everybody wants to spend the time to do that, are you really going to throw Syntronik into that mix and recommend I get it? I mean do you really think I could sell even ONE Syntronik library?

So we have to have some way of making distinctions or this all becomes meaningless.

Especially to sound designers.

[IncarnateX]

Then you're not looking at the whole picture. It's a 4 Osc (Layer) Synth whose Oscs are sample based.

this definition would only make sense to me if the layers actually are comprised of sampled raw waveforms that I can choose myself

Then you are limiting your definition of Synthesis. There are limitations to this synth.....lots of them but instead of focusing on what it can't do work with what you have.

While I do understand why you may
think my def is about limitations in the light of this thread, it actually isn't. More a question of principles of synthesis: Either I build my sounds up from unprocessed raw waveforms or I don't. My Fantom G has both raw waveforms and processed such as prefabed moog like basses. I use both to make my own basses but in different ways. Apart from a need to distinguish the two ways of making patches, I couldn't agree more about focusing on possibilities instead of drawbacks. When you add the human factor, I am sure that a skilled composer can get more from a plain sampleplayer than the average juvenile on acid can get from a full featured semi modular synth. Have fun and do not keep yourself from posting some of your patches

[Numanoid]

My Fantom G

When did you get a Fantom G ?

In another thread I thougth I read you had scaled your setup down to a bare minimum?

[Burillo]

i've been playing with Syntronik for a few days now, and i've only barely scratched the surface of what it offers. is it limited? sure. it's very unusual to see the oscillator panel, but not being able to change e.g. PWM width, or change sawtooth, or add noise, or something. i'm not completely used to this, and i think i would've preferred having at least a dropdown with "source oscillator" samples, so that i could instantly switch between different base sounds without losing my FX chain, envelopes and whatnot. it's true - you can work your filter envelopes and FX and arpeggiator etc, but the core sound character won't change much.

however, the good thing is, i've been through only a small selection of sounds so far, and almost every time i thought "wow i heard this in a song somewhere". i can see that the limitations won't be a huge problem for me, as the sounds are fine as they are, so i wouldn't need to change oscillator parameters to fit the sounds into the kind of music i make. envelopes and filtering and FX and layering would be more than enough for me.

to contrast it with earlier IK's efforts, Syntronik to me is much better. i don't have Sonik Synth and SampleMoog, so i can't compare Syntronik with those, but i do have SampleTank 2 XL and SampleTank 3 full, and Syntronik is on a whole other level when it comes to synth sounds. the sounds themselves are better, there's a lot of variety and not a lot of weird "can't imagine where i would use it" type of sounds (so far, at least), and more importantly, i haven't heard any machine gunning anywhere. this was always the problem with both SampleTank and UVI's synth libraries for me - the inability to do fast basslines or fast, repetitive arpegiations with repeating notes. Syntronik does not suffer from that, as far as i can tell, so i don't have to rely on round robins and velocity layers to rid myself of machine gun effect. for that alone, Syntronik is well worth the 80-something euro i spent on it.

it's essentially a synth preset library, and given that this is exactly what i was looking for - a good sounding, varied "classic sounds" synth preset library that doesn't suffer from machine-gun effects common to sampled sounds - that's exactly what i got. i'm not a big synth guy, so my needs are humble. i can see how it might disappoint people who may have higher standards.

[spacekid]

Except, and I'll take the simplest example I can come up with, given the actual Minimoog and Syntronik's Minimoog, there are things you can do on the real one that you simply can't do with Syntronik's because the controls aren't there. End of story.

You guys are simply not getting it....there are things you can do with Syntronik that you can't do with a MiniMoog......like make it sound like an SY-99.

Stop focusing on what it can't do and embrace what it can do. I'm making some great patches using it's 4 OSCs (Layers) and a little bit of creativity........(some of that is needed).

Is this the most powerful synth in existence ? Of course not but like I said it's tons of fun and capable of a surprising range of sounds that will expand if IK ever releases more Instruments.

These were never advertised as 1:1 Emulations although I'd love to get 1:1 Emulations of all those synths for $70.

Well, then in that case, we might as well just call anything that has a filter and an LFO a synth and call it a day. Problem is, with so loose a definition, it doesn't really help somebody who may come here for synth recommendations for a "traditional" VA, wavetable, granular or whatever synth. We might as well, at that point, just toss in Nexus and any other "playback engine" into the mix as long as it has some kind of control over the sound and isn't just static like playing back a piano sample that can't be changed at all.

But if I come here saying I am looking for a new "synth" that I can design a sound library for because programming the synth takes some skill and not everybody wants to spend the time to do that, are you really going to throw Syntronik into that mix and recommend I get it? I mean do you really think I could sell even ONE Syntronik library?

So we have to have some way of making distinctions or this all becomes meaningless.

Especially to sound designers.

The thing is that it still takes designing with sounds to put together the multis. You just aren't going from a wide open synth and designing from scratch..selecting and molding those selections with what you are given is still sound design...you're just being a bit of a purist and forgetting that everything, even purist synths, have their limitations..this one just has different limitations. Just because it doesn't pass the synth purist test, doesn't mean it's bad.