KVR Audio

jroyall · Post by **jroyall** » Mon Sep 25, 2017 9:10 pm

As most of you know LCR Panning is very popular among mixers as for a great reason, it leaves the center open for vocals, drums, bass etc. However every time i listen to a mix with LCR panning, I always hear a huge problem. Anything that is panned hard left and right totally basically disappears in MONO. If i remember right anything completely right and left difference wise when summed in mono is basically a -6db in reduction in Mono. So this leaves the drums, vocals way over the top in mono. The bass is usually right in Mono but disappears in stereo.

Ok I know Mono isn't everything but it is way more important than you think. Cellphones, laptops, sitting far away from home theaters, your $500 overpriced Bose speakers. Shit most of what we listen to is close to Mono except for headphones.

So what are your thoughts? I hate vocals, and drums that stick out like a sore thumb, where the guitars disappear in Mono. How do we fix this? Maybe it just me butI think most songs today the vocals are way too on top. Is LCR panning to blame? Even with CLA mixes the vocals are wayyy on top. Don't get me started about "Fall Out Boy" which I love!!!, but all you basically hear are vocals.

I want to hear vocals and instruments together.

Let me know your thoughts.

Thanks as always!!!
John,

Aloysius · Post by **Aloysius** » Mon Sep 25, 2017 9:32 pm

Don't hard pan the instruments. Hard pan the fx instead?

If you don't actually like the sound of LCR, then do something else.

jroyall · Post by **jroyall** » Mon Sep 25, 2017 10:25 pm

Aloysius wrote:Don't hard pan the instruments. Hard pan the fx instead?

If you don't actually like the sound of LCR, then do something else.

What exactly do you mean hard pan the fx? Like all delays hard pan left or right. Or take a stereo tool and suck the middle out of the fx?

"Doing something else" isn't exactly helpful. I always thought about automating stereo width with a plugin might help.

I like the width but I don't like the mono collapse, if that makes sense

Aloysius · Post by **Aloysius** » Mon Sep 25, 2017 10:28 pm

Leave the stereo fx at 100% width. Like your reverb. Pull your hard panned instruments (L & R) closer to the 'C'.

Just an idea.

jroyall · Post by **jroyall** » Mon Sep 25, 2017 10:31 pm

Aloysius wrote:Leave the stereo fx at 100% width. Like your reverb. Pull your hard panned instruments (L & R) closer to the 'C'.

Just an idea.

Thank you, maybe I need a touch more of fx sends. Have you ever experimented with Haas delay at 50% opposite sides of the hard left and right?

Aloysius · Post by **Aloysius** » Tue Sep 26, 2017 1:34 am

No but HAAS delay could work very well. Just experiment until you're happy with the results.

AsPeeXXXVIII · Post by **AsPeeXXXVIII** » Tue Sep 26, 2017 7:28 am

Aloysius wrote:Pull your hard panned instruments (L & R) closer to the 'C'.

I was going to suggest this. Beginner though I may be, I have noticed that panning tracks inevitably means an ever-so-slight volume loss. But refraining from hard-panning them and "leaving some room" for the far sides is one solution.

jroyall · Post by **jroyall** » Tue Sep 26, 2017 12:08 pm

Thanks for the suggestions!! I know Red Hot Chili peppers, most of their mixes are pretty mono based, which adds power but not the spread. I'll experiment some and post back on what seems to be a good balance point with balance in mono and stereo.

Aloysius · Post by **Aloysius** » Tue Sep 26, 2017 3:11 pm

To quickly narrow the stereo image, Boz Digital Labs Freebie is great. It's called 'Width Knob' (in case you don't already have it).

http://www.bozdigitallabs.com/product/width-knob/

Vocal and LCR Panning-- something that has puzzled me for a long while.