KVR Audio

Mikelo · Post by **Mikelo** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 3:29 pm

I think for what you pay, Reaper is an excellent DAW but can't help thinking that a pencil tool and other cutting and shaping tools ie... /, sine etc is greatly missing for crafting automation. It's something I really miss after changing over from Cubase.
I've been looking online for any alternative or work around for Reaper but haven't found much.
I ask all you good folks.. is there a work around?

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 3:38 pm

Sure you can freehand draw automation in Reaper. Hold Ctrl while dragging mouse over envelope and there's your pencil tool.

For sine and various other shapes, use the recently added automation items.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_eLjFKgv4bg

Mikelo · Post by **Mikelo** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 3:48 pm

Thanks Evil Dragon. I know and use the free hand automation it's just the tools I'm after (ie sine etc).
Thanks for info. I've been out of touch music wise for sometime and haven't checked out the latest from Reapers updates.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 4:03 pm

Then definitely update! Watch the video

Mikelo · Post by **Mikelo** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 4:06 pm

Great video thanks again Evil Dragon... one question though, as I'm not in front of Reaper.. Can this new feature be applied on midi cc lanes? That's what I'm really after. Ie modulation etc??

nineofkings · Post by **nineofkings** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 4:53 pm

if you use ReaControlMIDI you can control MIDI CCs with normal automation lanes

Chris-S · Post by **Chris-S** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 5:02 pm

Mikelo wrote:Can this new feature be applied on midi cc lanes?

Not directly. CC envelopes are a complete different thing in Reaper.

But you can also free hand draw CC events. And for CC LFO there are custom scripts.

dupont · Post by **dupont** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 6:36 pm

Mikelo wrote:Great video thanks again Evil Dragon... one question though, as I'm not in front of Reaper.. Can this new feature be applied on midi cc lanes? That's what I'm really after. Ie modulation etc??

I would prefer a better way to draw CC in Reaper. Currently cc comes in bars shape, it will be better to be in line shape like in automation item.
It is not obvious to draw a CC curve or ramp by hand in Reaper.
You can use user scripts but it is not very userfriendly.

himalaya · Post by **himalaya** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 6:56 pm

The MIDI CC data drawing with those bars is horrendous. A nightmare. Total PITA. And it's buggy as hell...we were editing a simple piano midi file recently with a friend (Reaper v5) and it was impossible to grab certain CC segments and edit them. Selections were jumping, or wouldn't move as expected...We just gave up in the end....

But I digress....carry on....

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:01 pm

CC editing just needs a bit of tweaking of mouse modifiers, it's not buggy. Defaults are horrible, yes, but it's not a problem to edit them after a bit of adjusting. So go to Properties->Editing Behavior->Mouse modifiers and check things out for MIDI CC lane and MIDI CC event contexts. Things are pretty flexible. Here's how I have them:

Drawing things is absolutely not a problem with these settings. Bars don't matter when you set CC density a bit higher than the default and draw without snap enabled (Preferences->Editing behavior->MIDI Editor->Events per quarter note when drawing in CC lanes, set to 128 or higher)!

Regarding selection, it's important to know that Reaper selects only CC events when marquee frame goes OVER THE TOP of an event. Not if it only touches it anywhere on its surface.

Mikelo · Post by **Mikelo** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:52 pm

Awesome replies thanks all. Yes hand drawing is a PITA. I would just like straight lines and curves in midi. Judging by googling, it sounds like a request that's been made over several years. Shame.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:56 pm

It probably won't ever change. MIDI CCs are not lines and curves, they are discrete data, so bars are a much more appropriate way to show them.

But as mentioned previously in this thread, you can use ReaControlMIDI as track FX, which will then allow you to use Reaper's automation lanes to draw CCs as regular audio envelopes.

Also, as you can see above, hand drawing is absolutely not a pain. There's also a mouse modifier for linear ramping existing CC data, which works beautifully.

Mikelo · Post by **Mikelo** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:59 pm

EvilDragon wrote:It probably won't ever change. MIDI CCs are not lines and curves, they are discrete data, so bars are a much more appropriate way to show them.

But as mentioned previously in this thread, you can use ReaControlMIDI as track FX, which will then allow you to use Reaper's automation lanes to draw CCs as regular audio envelopes.

Also, as you can see above, hand drawing is absolutely not a pain. There's also a mouse modifier for linear ramping existing CC data, which works beautifully.

Ill have a crack at that Evil Dragon Thanks for all your help bud.

himalaya · Post by **himalaya** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 7:59 pm

@EvilDragon

Drawing like in your gif is certainly easy and issue-free, problems start when the item I am editing has many notes, like in this piano piece we were editing. It was a total, and utter horror show how Reaper could not allow us to edit CC data. It was buggy. Trust me. I just did not have the time to document it - rather busy nowadays - but i have the midi file and will contact support as what we have seen should not happen.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Oct 20, 2017 8:07 pm

It sounds like you had the option that makes CC selection follow note selection to me. So you click a note and CC values right below it get selected. Then you can only edit events that are selected, which is normal. No?

I don't remember the last time I had a bug when editing CCs. And I do that quite often! Post the MIDI here if you want and tell me what you tried to do, let's see what happens. I'm pretty sure it's probably the default mouse modifiers tripping you up, and/or lack of understanding some of Reaper's options. Editing CCs is absolutely not a problem for me.

Reaper... no pencil tools for automation?