The VSTi That I Would Pay $1,000 For

[Dasheesh]

It’s not what you do, it’s how you do it.

Lesson learned youngn’s

[wagtunes]

Sorry but why would you want such a plugin? If you can't sing, you cant sing.

I guess I could say the same thing about people who buy violin sample libraries. If you can't play the violin, you can't play the violin and shouldn't be allowed to emulate one.

It works both ways.

But violin sample libraries doesnt cost 1000 $.

Well, this library doesn't have to cost $1,000 either. That's all going to come down to what the company wants to charge for it. I'm just saying what I would be willing to pay for it.

[wagtunes]

wags, I did not have a chance to respond yesterday as I drove down the coast to enjoy the beautiful (but cold) day, see a movie and have dinner with a lovely lady. (keep in mind that's rte 1 Maine, absolutely stunning from my town on the coast all the way down to where I was heading, Rockland). I saw where you said you would like my opinion on this, I do actually have an interesting perspective on this because for over 15 years my vox ability was severely hindered (worse than my lack of skill ) by dental issues, but last year I spent over 3k on that instrument. (I have a nice smile now and better, for the first time this century I can whistle again ).

If you want to hear it I will gladly share it but it has nothing to do with a plugin, it does have to do with incorporating outside singers and really it comes down to what your actual intent with your music is. So as not to keep beating a dead horse as it were I'll give you the option of hearing or not.

Yes, I would like to hear your thoughts on all this. Oh, and congrats on the dental work. I'm sure it's made a ton of difference.

[jancivil]

The argument is that there is something sacred about the human voice that is not inherent in playing any particular instrument.

*the* argument?

It may be fluffy little's objection, but it was never my argument. It is suitable for you to pose your argument against, and one supposes you win any argument with your own straw man if you want.

I said copping personalities on the market disturbed me. My objection actually can be boiled down to that.

You seem to still want some of that component for your argument since you said people spending 8 grand on some VSL bundle want to sound like the NY Phil. Well, if they *sound* like anything, physically sounding like a thing, that thing will probably be closer to VIENNA and their cats and the dry stage, now the Synchron Stage.
There's isn't much personality to be found though, except in vibratos and these are not terrifically unique but rather generic vibrati. is that a word? Why not.

I think the project would be fascinating but the voice may be more complex than it looks like at a glance.
I've seen products where a voice is advertised as being captured for using note-ons (not just recorded phrases), and a legato. I didn't pursue because my expectations of that are not high enough to care to.

[wagtunes]

The argument is that there is something sacred about the human voice that is not inherent in playing any particular instrument.

*the* argument?

It may be fluffy little's objection, but it was never my argument. It is suitable for you to pose your argument against, and one supposes you win any argument with your own straw man if you want.

I said copping personalities on the market disturbed me. My objection actually can be boiled down to that.

You seem to still want some of that component for your argument since you said people spending 8 grand on some VSL bundle want to sound like the NY Phil. Well, if they *sound* like anything, physically sounding like a thing, that thing will probably be closer to VIENNA and their cats and the dry stage, now the Synchron Stage.
There's isn't much personality to be found though, except in vibratos and these are not terrifically unique but rather generic vibrati. is that a word? Why not.

I think the project would be fascinating but the voice may be more complex than it looks like at a glance.
I've seen products where a voice is advertised as being captured for using note-ons, not just recorded phrases, and a legato. I didn't pursue because my expectations of that are not high enough to care to.

My expectations right now aren't very high either. As I have said numerous times, I'd be stunned if we ever saw the realism in a vocal emulation that I am looking for, forgetting about celebrity voices. Stupid idea. Sorry I ever brought it up because obviously now people will only focus on that. My fault but I can't take it back now. I can only move on and adapt. And I have. I'm willing to accept a "generic" vocal emulation that sounds like a real human and can be programmed to sound like any real human so that you can emulate country, pop, rock, metal, soul or whatever it is you want to emulate.

I have no idea what the technology would involve if even possible. All I know is that's what I want. If others object to the technology, I accept that and respect their opinion. But then, in that case, those against the tech and myself have nothing to talk about. I won't change their mind and they won't change my mind. So continually arguing about it is kind of pointless. Don't you agree?

[Neon Breath]

The pill seems to work smoothly today.

[DSmolken]

I just want the vocals of my songs to sound human and good.

That's all.

People are building on earlier research and working on that. It's a high standard to achieve, I don't think because the human voice is all that complicated, but because we've evolved the ability to pick up things in human voices which sound "wrong" - being able to recognize enemy vs. ally voices, judging moods, picking up on traces of deception, all that is a survival advantage. So, we are hard to fool, but that just makes it a more interesting challenge. And researchers are making progress - Voctro and the Synthesizer V guy also seem to be doing especially interesting things from what I've seen.

If I was to seriously try making synthesized voices commercially, I'd go for two things. One is monster voice SFX - try to compete with effects software like Krotos Dehumaniser - because there intelligibility and sounding natural aren't as important, so that's something of a low-hanging fruit. That was the reason for the whole female death metal vocal thing. The second is choirs. This is obviously much harder, but human choirs are expensive and logistically complicated to work with, so it's easier to compete with them than with solo human singers. A choir that can sing lyrics input in plain English even semi-decently would be a viable $400-500 product.

[Tj Shredder]

The necessary technology is there, even open source. But the details need a lot of work to turn it into a "product" which could be used by a bedroom producer. It also has to be connected to tensorflow and youtube, to teach it how to do the phrasing etc...

http://www.praat.org

[donkey tugger]

A choir that can sing lyrics input in plain English even semi-decently would be a viable $400-500 product.

I've never tried it (not my thing) but the East West thing does this already by the look of it;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9u98APouTQ

[wagtunes]

A choir that can sing lyrics input in plain English even semi-decently would be a viable $400-500 product.

I've never tried it (not my thing) but the East West thing does this already by the look of it;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9u98APouTQ

I have EWQL Symphonic Choirs. The diction is poor even if the voices are excellent. That's the biggest problem with them. Plus, as with Vocaloid, there is no dynamic. Sure, you have loud and soft but you can't do the kind of things that a "real" choir can do. It's not even close unless you're just going for stock "movie soundtrack" stuff. Even that is passable at best.

[Tj Shredder]

There is also Phonem by Wolfgang Palm. Enough parameters to tweak, but to turn it into good vocals would probably need years of tweaking...

[wagtunes]

There is also Phonem by Wolfgang Palm. Enough parameters to tweak, but to turn it into good vocals would probably need years of tweaking...

I own it. It's good for vocal FX and that's about it.

[DSmolken]

A choir that can sing lyrics input in plain English even semi-decently would be a viable $400-500 product.

I've never tried it (not my thing) but the East West thing does this already by the look of it;

Yup, a synthesized competitor to that, with a workflow that's closer to Alter/Ego, and flexible dynamics and glide times, would have huge potential, I think. I'm sticking with making small instrument libraries that I can make in my spare time in a few months, but if I was going to do vocals, that's what I would be aiming for. AFAIK no one's working seriously on a synthesized (as opposed to sampled) virtual choir at this time.

[donkey tugger]

A choir that can sing lyrics input in plain English even semi-decently would be a viable $400-500 product.

I've never tried it (not my thing) but the East West thing does this already by the look of it;

Yup, a synthesized competitor to that, with a workflow that's closer to Alter/Ego, and flexible dynamics and glide times, would have huge potential, I think. I'm sticking with making small instrument libraries that I can make in my spare time in a few months, but if I was going to do vocals, that's what I would be aiming for. AFAIK no one's working seriously on a synthesized (as opposed to sampled) virtual choir at this time.

Good choice - never mind this singing bollocks, I've got that covered (for better or worse...), I need more 12 string geetar....

[melomood]

I guess time will tell.

You do realize that your situation will basically be the same even if you did have that

because you are dictating how everything will be without any possibly positive influences from outside your own head

right?