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Tappistry
KVRian
 
577 posts since 2 Aug, 2017, from San Diego, CA

Postby Tappistry; Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:23 pm Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

It seems like there will always be the small handful of people who will always believe their outdated software and hardware "works just fine." Those people shouldn't be surprised that sticking to an outdated platform will leave them in the dust in terms of updateds/upgrades.

It's unreasonable to expect a developer to continue to spend resources developing new products for something a small percentage of their customer base uses.
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BMoore
KVRian
 
1334 posts since 19 Aug, 2011

Postby BMoore; Thu Apr 19, 2018 12:55 pm Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

BONES wrote:OK, I had a load of individual responses prepared but it all comes back to the same thing, so I'll just say it once. All you dopey Mac users, and it seems all the people defending NI's actions are Mac users, are happy to wax lyrical about all the extra hassle of supporting multiple platforms but all the arguments you make could just as easily be used to stop making Mac versions. How would you feel if NI and everyone else did that instead? Would you be happy? No, of course you wouldn't, so why expect these guys to be any happier? They have a legitimate beef with this and if you can't see that, then you are a self-centred a-hole of the highest order.

The other issue is that, for most of us, there is no compelling reason to go to 64 bit. It adds nothing. Performance isn't any better, it doesn't use fewer resources (quite the opposite, in fact) and 64 bit software seems to take up a lot more drive space into the bargain. And for what? So that my paging file can be a little smaller? Hardly worth it when it means hours and hours of work just to rebuild a song so we can play it live. As foosnark said, the only ones who benefit from this are NI, there is nothing at all in it for their customers.

For some reason I really cannot fathom, some of you want to liken this to the change from Windows XP to Windows 10 but it is NOTHING like that. Every piece of software and every hardware peripheral I had on XP still installs and runs perfectly well on Windows 10. The change cost me nothing. OTOH, the change from Orion 32 bit to Orion 64 bit has cost me 20 or more plugins, many of which I use in dozens of songs we wrote before 64 bit hosts even existed and would really like to use again. We've done it, I honestly couldn't tell you why exactly, but the dismissive attitudes of some of you says a lot about the type of people you are (see above).

There's been a lot of crap posts on KVR recently. But that one. Wow.
You're not as stupid as you look, or sound, or our best testing indicates. | http://soundcloud.com/bmoorebeats
xx JPRacer xx
KVRAF
 
1941 posts since 25 Jun, 2008, from Montreal, Canada

Postby xx JPRacer xx; Thu Apr 19, 2018 6:21 pm Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

It's just more trouble than it's worth. I'm sure people still using 32-bit only hosts and plugins are a minority now. Sad but true.
BONES
GRRRRRRR!
 
6849 posts since 13 Jun, 2001, from Somewhere else, on principle

Postby BONES; Thu Apr 19, 2018 10:51 pm Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

The question, then, is when does it cease to become tenable? When the number of users falls below 50% of the total? Below 30%? 10%? 5%? It requires very little effort to maintain and support both 32 and 64 bit versions, and in this case it's all about saving the vendor from having to fix problems they have created for their users. Whilst I've had nothing but excellent support experiences with NI, this is exactly the kind of treatment that would stop me from dealing with them if I wasn't already on board. That so many people are happy to see them treat customers this way does my head in. Does it not occur to you that you could be next?
BMoore wrote:There's been a lot of crap posts on KVR recently. But that one. Wow.

Really? Care to elaborate. I've stuck to facts and reason, is that incompatible with the way your brain works?
NOVAkILL 3.0 : Surface Pro 2 (Core i5, Win10), Zoom U24, Orion 64 bit, Maschine Mikro, Elektron Analog Keys, Ultranova, Rocket, Seaboard Rise 25
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soulone82
KVRian
 
799 posts since 16 Aug, 2010, from almost everywhere...

Postby soulone82; Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:31 am Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

BONES wrote:It requires very little effort to maintain and support both 32 and 64 bit versions


You have no clue about coding, right?
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ATS
KVRAF
 
5596 posts since 20 Dec, 2002, from MD USA

Postby ATS; Fri Apr 20, 2018 12:34 am Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

I heard they stopped making rotary phones too, bastards.
Reefius
KVRist
 
378 posts since 7 Dec, 2013, from Belgium

Postby Reefius; Fri Apr 20, 2018 3:21 am Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

WTF is up with NI, Maschine doesn't work on my 8 bit Commodore 64!!!! This is outrageous!!! :roll:
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BMoore
KVRian
 
1334 posts since 19 Aug, 2011

Postby BMoore; Fri Apr 20, 2018 5:04 am Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

BONES wrote:The question, then, is when does it cease to become tenable? When the number of users falls below 50% of the total? Below 30%? 10%? 5%? It requires very little effort to maintain and support both 32 and 64 bit versions, and in this case it's all about saving the vendor from having to fix problems they have created for their users. Whilst I've had nothing but excellent support experiences with NI, this is exactly the kind of treatment that would stop me from dealing with them if I wasn't already on board. That so many people are happy to see them treat customers this way does my head in. Does it not occur to you that you could be next?
BMoore wrote:There's been a lot of crap posts on KVR recently. But that one. Wow.

Really? Care to elaborate. I've stuck to facts and reason, is that incompatible with the way your brain works?

You've stuck to facts?! In what world?
I don't even know where to begin.
You're not as stupid as you look, or sound, or our best testing indicates. | http://soundcloud.com/bmoorebeats
BONES
GRRRRRRR!
 
6849 posts since 13 Jun, 2001, from Somewhere else, on principle

Postby BONES; Sun Apr 22, 2018 4:48 am Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

Of course you don't know where to begin, you clearly struggle to see the world as it really is. You probably lack empathy, too, or else you might be able to understand why some people get annoyed with this situation.
soulone82 wrote:
BONES wrote:It requires very little effort to maintain and support both 32 and 64 bit versions

No but I'll take the word of foosnark, who does(see page 1 of this thread), because it gels with my own experience as a product specialist for Autodesk, where I worked very closely with the dev team.
ATS wrote:I heard they stopped making rotary phones too, bastards.

Great example! When the phone system stopped supporting rotary dial phones, they gave everyone a brand new tone dial phone because they realised how pissed off their customers would be if they just left them in the lurch. NI and others could learn a lot from the example set by phone companies.
NOVAkILL 3.0 : Surface Pro 2 (Core i5, Win10), Zoom U24, Orion 64 bit, Maschine Mikro, Elektron Analog Keys, Ultranova, Rocket, Seaboard Rise 25
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BMoore
KVRian
 
1334 posts since 19 Aug, 2011

Postby BMoore; Sun Apr 22, 2018 6:44 am Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

BONES wrote:Of course you don't know where to begin, you clearly struggle to see the world as it really is. You probably lack empathy, too, or else you might be able to understand why some people get annoyed with this situation.
soulone82 wrote:
BONES wrote:It requires very little effort to maintain and support both 32 and 64 bit versions

No but I'll take the word of foosnark, who does(see page 1 of this thread), because it gels with my own experience as a product specialist for Autodesk, where I worked very closely with the dev team.
ATS wrote:I heard they stopped making rotary phones too, bastards.

Great example! When the phone system stopped supporting rotary dial phones, they gave everyone a brand new tone dial phone because they realised how pissed off their customers would be if they just left them in the lurch. NI and others could learn a lot from the example set by phone companies.

First. Your lame "angry" replys are so predictable and old.
Second. I have not addressed anyones annoyance. And while I see their side, your ignorant "facts" are still just that.
You're not as stupid as you look, or sound, or our best testing indicates. | http://soundcloud.com/bmoorebeats
BONES
GRRRRRRR!
 
6849 posts since 13 Jun, 2001, from Somewhere else, on principle

Postby BONES; Sun Apr 22, 2018 6:44 pm Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

"Angry"? Hardly. This is a forum on the internet, it's a way to while away the idle hours and, very occasionally, to find some useful information or get some useful help. There should be nothing at all here to make anyone angry. I think "direct" is probably a more suitable description, as I really don't care if I hurt someone's feelings, for the same reason - if you get offended by something someone you don't know and will never meet types into the internet, you are taking it, and possibly yourself, far too seriously and that is not my problem. I'd have thought from the general mocking tone of your posts, which seem to predominantly be personal attacks rather than contributions to any discussion, that you'd understand this already but it seems you're moore interested in trolling than contributing.
NOVAkILL 3.0 : Surface Pro 2 (Core i5, Win10), Zoom U24, Orion 64 bit, Maschine Mikro, Elektron Analog Keys, Ultranova, Rocket, Seaboard Rise 25
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Jace-BeOS
KVRAF
 
4545 posts since 7 Jan, 2005, from Corporate States of America

Postby Jace-BeOS; Sun Apr 22, 2018 8:24 pm Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

BONES wrote:You probably lack empathy, too, or else you might be able to understand why some people get annoyed with this situation.


You aren't at the absolute bottom of the list of people who ought to accuse others of lacking empathy, but you're definitely up there in rank on the list of those who probably shouldn't.
- dysamoria.com
my music @ SoundCloud
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Jace-BeOS
KVRAF
 
4545 posts since 7 Jan, 2005, from Corporate States of America

Postby Jace-BeOS; Sun Apr 22, 2018 8:28 pm Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

BONES wrote:
ATS wrote:I heard they stopped making rotary phones too, bastards.

Great example! When the phone system stopped supporting rotary dial phones, they gave everyone a brand new tone dial phone because they realised how pissed off their customers would be if they just left them in the lurch. NI and others could learn a lot from the example set by phone companies.


Thank you for your vote in support of industry regulation. Do some more reading on that subject. The monopoly of Bell Telephone had a lot to do with what was "given" to consumers at the time. Not only were the phones considered the property of the company, this kind of "largess" from telcos wouldn't be seen today. In fact, it most definitely isn't seen at all in the USA.
Last edited by Jace-BeOS on Sun Apr 22, 2018 8:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- dysamoria.com
my music @ SoundCloud
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Jace-BeOS
KVRAF
 
4545 posts since 7 Jan, 2005, from Corporate States of America

Postby Jace-BeOS; Sun Apr 22, 2018 8:41 pm Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

BONES wrote:"Angry"? Hardly. This is a forum on the internet [...] I really don't care if I hurt someone's feelings, for the same reason - if you get offended by something someone you don't know and will never meet types into the internet, you are taking it, and possibly yourself, far too seriously and that is not my problem.


And there it is. The "I'm not angry; anger is weakness" and "no one can anger me, so if I anger someone else, it's their own fault" attitudes.

Almost everything you do demonstrates aggression, BONES. If that's not powered by anger (and/or bitterness), I'm not sure how you think we should be taking it. Do you even read what you write here? It's concerning that you may have no sense of what anger is or what it looks like to other people.

With your quoted comment above, I'm officially taking you off the list of "people who are allowed to accuse others of lacking empathy". :lol:
- dysamoria.com
my music @ SoundCloud
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jancivil
KVRAF
 
14239 posts since 20 Oct, 2007, from No Location

Postby jancivil; Sun Apr 22, 2018 9:43 pm Re: Maschine goes 64-bit only

Jace-BeOS wrote:
BONES wrote:You probably lack empathy, too, or else you might be able to understand why some people get annoyed with this situation.


You aren't at the absolute bottom of the list of people who ought to accuse others of lacking empathy, but you're definitely up there in rank on the list of those who probably shouldn't.

For this to make the most sense, you want 'the absolute top of the list' agreeing with 'up there in rank on the list', just sayin'...

but that (which I won't have seen but as quoted) really was a laugh out loud (guffaws) moment, truly

I have empathy to the extent it may have hurt me in life. I absolutely get why people who aren't me and that I don't at all agree with may become irritated; period. This does not mean I find their irritation reasonable necessarily or that I'll beg off telling them as much. This word 'empathy' does not mean 'I have to kiss your ass.'.
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