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Zyklus Improvisor, real-time harmonic sequencer

PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 10:33 am
by bronswerk
According to this thread ( http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=131409 ) someone suggested a dedicated thread for this program made in Max/Msp was maybe a better way to inform interested people. So here it is.

What is Zyklus Improvisor? In a nutshell it's a 8-track midi looper were you can use chord recognition to modulate to other key scales in real time. The program is a prototype and I say deliberately "prototype", because I'm not sure if I ever get to the point were I feel it's 100% ironed out. There are quirks and bugs, but at this stage it's workable.

Anyway, a picture says more then 1000 words, so I have made a little Youtube video. Judge by yourself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDZUUOKuL0Y

Oh, before anyone asks when it comes out, I'm planning to publish the files needed to run it in Max. Take it "AS IS". I'm not giving support or such, because if I do that I'm afraid I don't have the time for anything else. :D

PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2010 2:46 pm
by aitch gee
...bump....

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 3:42 am
by cvi
really quite amazing
easily the best of the assisted composers
looking forward to using the max files - when are you considering making them available? :)

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 7:27 am
by himalaya
Interesting.

By the way. Back in the 1980s there was a Zyklus MPS Midi Performance System device. See a pic here:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Ve7Ad_ZzyUM/S ... lusMPS.jpg

Are you in any way associated with the original Zyklus ?

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:02 am
by bronswerk
himalaya wrote:Interesting.

By the way. Back in the 1980s there was a Zyklus MPS Midi Performance System device. See a pic here:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_Ve7Ad_ZzyUM/S ... lusMPS.jpg

Are you in any way associated with the original Zyklus ?

Yes, it deserves a little explanation. A few years back there was a thread going on on the SOS forum about the Zyklus MPS. Bill Marshall (developer of the Zyklus MPS) stepped into this discussion and it evolved into the idea of making a new kind of program. It was Bill who came with the name "Zyklus Improvisor" as a sort of successor of the Zyklus MPS. Then Bill and I worked together for a period of time developing Improvisor but Bill had to end this because his daily job took too much time sadly. I continued to work on the idea in Max. I kept the name with permission of Bill.

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 8:25 am
by himalaya
Thanks for the explanation. It is very interesting to see such a vintage and rare device being 'kind of' resurrected, albeit in software. :)

The original Zyklus is more rare then a Yeti. :D I remember it being a favorite sequencer with a few musos, notably Vangelis.

Best wishes with the project.

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 9:01 am
by maki
A am not sure that audience on kvraudio.com is mature enough to realize that the potential of this program is much bigger then emulation of an old hardware sequencer. This is not "just another emulation". This is not "the same story but different actors". This is the concept that gives 8 INDEPENDENT midiloopers with harmonization ON FLY, not like an overpriced auto arrangement products out there where you have to record one melody a time, save it, reload, and then harmonize... and still without possibility to controll individual melodies inside a chosen style. Zyklus concept can challenge most demanding contrapunctual and rythmic tastes. This is something original and I have never seen similar concepts on kvraudio.com or otherwise in software format.
Audience is not mature to understand benefits of this concept but youtube video helps a lot. For me, every arranger keyboard should be like Zyklus with an option to behave simplier, like todays arranger do.
It is a shame that arranging concept in arranger keyboards have not changed in almost 30 years. Zyklus takes a next necesssery step forward.
An standalone or vst version should gain popularity of this concept because this concept deserves that. Max version requests that a potential user have Max installed and Max is not a common program on everybodys computer.

Thumbs up for standalone or VST demoversion and even more Youtube videos.

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 9:24 am
by himalaya
maki wrote:This is not "just another emulation".


Myself, I do appreciate that. I did not try to compare the original Zyklus with this new software one. My reference to the original Zyklus was out of interest, especially as there was a link to the original developer of the original Zyklus. For me, it is a nice touch. But, yes, this new Zyklus is a new world onto itself.

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:00 am
by ludwig
maki wrote:An standalone or vst version should gain popularity of this concept because this concept deserves that. Max version requests that a potential user have Max installed and Max is not a common program on everybodys computer.


A vst version would be nice, but isn't there a Max runtime that can be downloaded for free (legal version)?

Can't wait to test this program.

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:16 am
by maki
That's right
http://cycling74.com/downloads/
but still, isn't it easier to export a Zyklus demo in vst or standalone format and make it available for download than forcing several thousand of potential users to consider installing Max Runtime first. Nobody wants unnecessery installations that are difficult to uninstall. An vst is usually easy to delete.
Zyklus deserves better marketing. It is a fantastic concept. At the same time the audience deserves a chance to achieve something far better than the same old cha-cha-cha jamming.
My God, this thing deserves a dedicated hardware midicontroller! It is difficult to controll everything woth touch screen, but so tempting :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:25 am
by HelgeG
This looks very, very interesting!

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:29 am
by ehdyn
Cool video. Nice work with Max
I want to try :o

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:32 am
by ivory1029
This sounds very interesting...looking forward to the results! Thanks!

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:36 am
by KrisM
I love things like this.

This is also so far beyond my currently abilities with Max or PD it's not even funny. :lol:

PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:46 am
by maki
I am not afraid that Zyklus concept does not have a potential to be a new standard for arranger-keyboards in near future. This is so big thing that it can even reduce the existing piano-roll sequencer market. I am just afraid that further develepment can be slow downed or jeopardized if marketing fails and buggy code irritates potential developers.
For instance, I can already now imagine that if layers that belong to different slots can be assigned or organized in synchronized triggered groups, the concept can be extended for few thousand miles.

This thing is indeed going to bury piano-roll seqencer market. :wink: