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Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

Official support for: sknote.it

Moderator: quintosardo

quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 2:25 pm Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

In an attempt to clean up a few threads but trying to be sure nothing is lost (or censored, argh! :D ), pease use this tread for moaning which doesn't get response.

Also, out of topic posts will be moved here.
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 2:32 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

compyfox
-----

The sad thing is, this is happening for years now.

I'm on the SKnote VST board since Quinto started to drop plugins like a madman (times of GTS-39, RoundTone, first incarnation of StripBus). So that's what... 3,5 years (April 2011)?

Since then, people tried to stay in touch with the developer, bugged him to finally start a "user account system". The answer was always "it's in the making" or "the KVR news system informs you of updates". Personally I don't have any "RSS feeds" registered or something, so if KVR does a massive info dump (i.e. on Twitter), I can barely catch up.


Now fast forward to StripBus v3.
- BARELY ANY response anymore
- the only "news" you see is through FaceBook (if there is someone signed up to his feed) and GearSlutz
- still no user account
- radio silence through mails



I do understand the workload and the limited time for a one man army.
But please... other companies at similar size and price category can pull off communication and user account handling.

At least a lifesign at his "official support board" would be nice. Else this KVR sub section is a waste of time for all participants. According to his (quintosardo) user account, he has logged into KVR today. But his last public post was on 10th July (around the time of the STA-LIMIT release, and people having questions getting their licenses as well)!


This... is more than ridiculous IMO.


Giant bright red warning flag, indeed.
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 2:35 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

compyfox

-------

Personally I'd like to know why he doesn't write in here, in his "official support forum" anymore.

But that's just me.
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 2:37 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

compyfox

--------

Here is the reason why Quintino Sardo doesn't answer on KVR audio anymore.


Summed up:
- KVR audio "feels more synthesis oriented", the sub board is "like a diary"
- everything is handled through Email
- GearSlutz's board is different and feels more "natural"

But read for yourself, and my (obviously disgruntled) response to this.
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/10554764-post33.html (EDIT: post is now deleted!)


Or just read this response by another GS user:
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/10554038-post25.html

Though as usual - two camps: the fans that can hardly wait for an update and "offer" beta testing, and the disappointed longtime users.



I think this is the end of the line for me.
:arrow: To new users: "GIANT RED WARNING FLAG"!!!



EDIT 4:52am:
I was just "informed" on GS, that that the KVR sub board for SKnote will be closed, and that I am to blame for it.

Way to go. This is what you get as legit customer:
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/10554927-post44.html

I'm not putting on that shoe, but I thought to let you know in advance. I'm also contacting the mods/admin about this. Though I'm sure bluedad is reading along already, as he is also a SKnote user.
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 2:39 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

Burillo

-------

i've already sold the non-essential SKNote stuff i had, so left is only stuff i can't live without but which thankfully works fine and i don't "need" the updates. so i'll take them when they come, and if they don't, well, stuff i got right now still works and has no copy protection.

the other thing is, i bought Stagespace (which i sold) on the promise that it's a shell, that more reverb algos will be added - and at that time it seemed reasonable, as IIRC Roundtone 3 was just released (which i bought as version 1) and the future looked bright. then came this whole hardware thing, and all the software support and updates went down the toilet, and those Stagespace updates never materialized. of course, there were some plugs released in the meantime and some of them i use a lot, but for example, the EQ1 overload bug, which i reported on the first day and which Quinto acknowledged, never got fixed (which is why i'm considering selling EQ1), and neither was Grasso x64 crackling bug (which made me use the x86 version instead, and which i finally sold as well). so yeah, always buy the plugins on what they are now, not on what they might become. even great developers like Quinto of 3 years ago can become Quinto of today. lesson learned.

this is really sad as Quinto is a really nice guy (who else allows you to sell plugins you got for free as a gift?!), the pricing is right, no copy protection, no-questions-asked refund policy... but he takes waaaay too much on himself, stretching way beyond the point where he can't handle anything anymore. as a software developer, i can relate as it's always more interesting to work on new stuff than fixing old, but as a customer... not so much. which is why i'm not buying any more plugins from Quinto unless the situation changes drastically. i've been eyeing the STA limit, but looks like i'll have to pass. obviously, for some, even the old plugins don't work, and that's even worse.

this reply from Quinto just about sums it up:
This is what I'm able to do.

I think we have an incredible range of software and hardware products and I get tons of serious praise every day.

There isn't a single product I wouldn't buy myself, prices are extremely low, features are great, feedback about quality is super. What's wrong?

Do you want copy protection?
Do you want higher pricing?
Do you want marketing choices?
Do you want us more greedy?
Do you want periodic emails with "special offers for users" instead of free huge updates? (just think from StripBus 1 to 2 or from Roundtone 1 to 3)

I guess not.


I work on audio about 25 hours/day. Cannot do more.
Should I plan things and allocate resources differently? Probably.
But I need to have fun because all these things come from there, having fun

And don't forget that thousands of users (increasing every day) are just extremely happy! YAY! :D
I should do that horrible thing: collect positive emails and put them on the home page, ah ah!

- what's wrong?
- support! user area! bug fixing!
- ah, you mean you want copy protection and sales? oh, hey, look, those guys over there are happy, case closed, lalala i'm not listening!
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 2:40 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

compyfox

------

jorismak wrote:..A lot of those links are deleted posts now..


Yes, at this point, the posts are edited down massively to remove the "finger pointing" and rubbing off the blame on certain users. Thanks to one of the admins (to who I had contact with, after the deletion).


Summed, Quintino Sardo said something along the lines of
Now you've done it, I'm closing the board - the users can thank you for that


Which resulted after a third post I made (which is now deleted as it was considered "too OT").
But my other posts are still standing with quotes by Quinto, and should speak for themselves.

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/10554764-post31.html
https://www.gearslutz.com/board/10554839-post37.html

Please also take note of answers by Andy_bt and Zyzygis.

It's also not the first time that the CEO understood "something wrong", then turned it around to stand in a better light. But this is IMO the tip of the iceberg.


jorismak wrote:Since he made no announcement in my email or here that the forum is closing, as far as I'm concerned this is still the official place, so I keep whining that he won't respond here and posting in all the other threads I can to see what the status is on the updates he apparently is still sending out.


I don't expect him to announce/comment anymore.


Actually, I don't expect anything at this point other than a "good riddance" towards me as legit user.
Pity, I really liked GTS-39, the DBX-165 clone and StripBus (v1).
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 2:42 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

Debby747

-------

Without taking a side, I somehow feel bad for Quinto having to stomach so many angry posts.
Reiterating over and over again that he didn't provide enough support wasn't helpful at all -
it unnecessarily exacerbated the situation.

I hope Quinto won't close this forum in an act of self-defending stubbornness. It would be unfortunate to answer a request for more communication by ending it here completely.

Good grief, now everybody is entitled to feel hurt or disappointed - it's terrible.
What a collision of different perceptions and expectations, what a mess. :-(
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 2:45 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

Burillo

-------

Debby747 wrote:Without taking a side, I somehow feel bad for Quinto having to stomach so many angry posts.
Reiterating over and over again that he didn't provide enough support wasn't helpful at all -
it unnecessarily exacerbated the situation.

you know what else would be helpful to remedy the situation? you know what would stop all those "unhelpful" posts? to provide what people have asked for (support, user area and bug fixes), instead of crying about it and throwing a hissy fit. i hate it when people say, well, don't be so hard on X, otherwise X will be upset even more. you don't say! well what about all the other people who are upset by Quinto's actions? they just have to shut up and take it like a man? we deserve to be upset, yet Quinto doesn't? users have every right to be upset, and they have every right to post angry posts, and Quinto has no right to punish users for that, because it's his fault.

Debby747 wrote:I hope Quinto won't close this forum in an act of self-defending stubbornness. It would be unfortunate to answer a request for more communication by ending it here completely.

Good grief, now everybody is entitled to feel hurt or disappointed - it's terrible.
What a collision of different perceptions and expectations, what a mess. :-(

Quinto brought it on himself. just look at the reply he provided about updates and user area - well, i never update my software, so why should everyone else, and i always email the developers for support, so why should everyone else do otherwise. and then he doubles down by saying, well, you know, i don't have enough time, i deal with emails all day, so i don't have the energy to bring up the user area. well, no shit sherlock! user area is supposed to help with that, so you don't have to read emails all day long and maybe concentrate on fixing bugs and providing updates instead! and he tops it off by saying, he doesn't have to launch the user area. like it's some kind of favor to us, paying customers who supported him all along. he says he "doesn't have to" launch the thing that will help him, will help us and will help just about everyone involved with SKNote in any capacity, choosing to stick with old, broken support channel and using it as a justification to not do what he has to do in order to not only grow, but support his existing customers (because answering emails takes time he could've spent working on new products, updates or bug fixes). wow.

it's really frustrating to see such an irrational attitude. i've really been very supportive of Quinto up until today, but his replies to Compyfox made me reconsider. it seems that he really doesn't understand what customer support means. somehow he interprets it to be "i provide free updates once every few years (but never fix bugs once a certain percentage of my users are happy with the plugin), so what more do you want, i do what i like and i don't care what you think".
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 2:47 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

Burillo, the day I write we completed an extremely hard transition to a different company structure and I'm back working hard on software (which is the core) announcing a mountain of new releases which are currently happening, you try to kill all of my time writing the same thing in extremely long posts again and again???

Doesn't v.2 work there??

Make some music, lots of new things coming :)
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
User avatar
Burillo
KVRAF
 
1872 posts since 15 Nov, 2006, from Hell

Postby Burillo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 3:26 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

quintosardo wrote:Burillo, the day I write we completed an extremely hard transition to a different company structure and I'm back working hard on software (which is the core) announcing a mountain of new releases which are currently happening, you try to kill all of my time writing the same thing in extremely long posts again and again???

first of all, which "long posts" are you speaking of? i assume the "you" in your statements refers to "us, customers" and not me specifically, because these two posts are just about the longest i've ever written about SKNote, and certainly first ones where i expressed complaints about the company.

second of all, i don't care from what and to where did you transition, and i didn't see your announcements. hmm, i wonder why? maybe it's because today is the first day you've written on this forum for 3 months? maybe it's because i've heard the "announcements" two weeks before (and a few months before that, and a year before that, and a few years before that) and stopped paying attention to them because you insist those announcements of yours aren't actual announcements?

why do i "write these long posts"? hmmm, maybe it's because i've seen your replies on Gearslutz and they clearly indicated that you don't really care about your customers that much and are giving the same BS excuses you always give? or maybe it's because i've seen other people struggling with bugs for years which you don't fix? or maybe it's because updates to Stagespace never materialized? or maybe it's because you promised more updates for 250 quite some time ago, but they never materialized too? or maybe it's because you outright refuse to launch user area, giving absolutely childish and unprofessional excuses?

quintosardo wrote:Doesn't v.2 work there??

it does, which i mentioned in the first "moan" post. however, that's not the issue here. you keep flaunting it, and then you wonder why everyone is so frustrated. just because your plugins work fine on my setup doesn't mean i don't take into account feedback of others - and seeing these bugs not getting fixed really makes me wary of ever buying your plugins again - because i'm afraid that maybe down the line the plugin will stop working (because unlike you i do keep up with updates) and i'll never get support from you.

as i said numerous times - i've been a long supporter and always liked your plugins, and you are a really nice guy on a personal level. but the way you treat your customers is just appalling. and today i fully realized the extent of that.
From Russia with love
quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 3:43 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

Oh, and moaning the day we are finally moving it all again makes sense???
Get these updates! Give us the time to distribute them!
Tomorrow more Rev250 copies go out, too :)
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
User avatar
Burillo
KVRAF
 
1872 posts since 15 Nov, 2006, from Hell

Postby Burillo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 3:46 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

quintosardo wrote:Oh, and moaning the day we are finally moving it all again makes sense???

it makes sense moaning every day. today is just the day i decided to moan, because today is the day you've made it on my "not to buy" list. it's a coincidence. it'll take some convincing on your side to bring me back on board though.
From Russia with love
quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 3:50 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

Ok! :tu:
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
Compyfox
KVRAF
 
11790 posts since 18 Oct, 2003, from Berlin, Germany

Postby Compyfox; Fri Nov 14, 2014 3:54 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

The facepalm emoticon isn't even enough for this:

quintosardo wrote:Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.


quintosardo wrote:In an attempt to clean up a few threads but trying to be sure nothing is lost (or censored, argh! :D ), pease use this tread for moaning which doesn't get response.

Also, out of topic posts will be moved here.



In all honesty, with every further step you are doing at this point, you are making it worse for you.

Well adjusted and objective criticism is now declared as (undesired) "moaning" and/or "off topic". That we might like something or not has nothing to do with it. If we wouldn't like your creations, we wouldn't bother you to respond to us users/customers. But obviously, you want to drown out the noise if I look at this thread. At least this is my impression.


Within the last 24 hours, you succeeded in not only scaring off possible new customers on GearSlutz - a community that has no heavy focus on software compared to KVR Audio. You still insist that you're in the right, that we users have to accept your ongoing shenanigans. And you substantiate that now with selectively "moving" posts, while continuing to ignore us users and constantly twist and turn every comment to put you in a better light (see the very posts by yourself in this thread!).

True to the motto: "don't hear you, don't care!"

Not to mention now, after(!) you announced on GS that "KVR is feels like a diary" to you, and that you will close this board folder since you "moved on to a better place" and you didn't agree with comments by us users. My comments in particular.

This is more than a slap in the face, and is clearly looking like to be set on revenge.
Excellent job!


I am actually surprised that I'm still a SKNote customer.
Come to think of it - am I even "valued" at this point? Not personally (i.e. in me, the person behind the alias on KVR audio), but as customer?
Do you even (still) care?


We don't own you, hell no, we are just mere users. But... You lack respect for us, however expect similar from us (as shown with this very thread). This is not how you treat your customers/userbase. And you leave me no other choice than to speak with my wallet from now on. It will take a lot(!) to get me back as customer.



In all honesty, and to bring this back full circle - you brought this on yourself, "Mister Sardo".
As of this moment, I rather stay the hell away from SKnote. And so should others if you continue going this route.

Shame about Roundtone (I'm still on v2 I think), GTS-39 (v1) and C-165 (v0.9 or so?) though. Not counting the various other licenses that I lost track of.
quintosardo
KVRAF
 
3578 posts since 15 Jul, 2004, from Italy

Postby quintosardo; Fri Nov 14, 2014 4:07 pm Re: Moaning! Write here to be heard if you don't like it.

Received! :tu:
Electronics and music: www.sknote.it
Recording in Italy: www.skstudio.it
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