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KVR Forum » Modular Synthesis
VitaminD
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 Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2012 6:23 pm reply with quote
You guys are going to have to start charging me for all the assistance I have been getting

I have figured out how to create tempo syncing using a delay time calculator, some basic equations, and A LOT of trial and error.. hurray.

but this is only for short time periods.. for instance... quarter notes (1/4). but what if I want to go the other way and have 4/1 or 8/1 time?

I tried scaling my values upwards by simply doubling from 1/2 to 1/1 to 2/1 HOWEVER the scope only moves a teency bit after it hits 1/1 where as I would expect it to flatting/lengthen quite a bit for a single sine period (for instance)

I'm wondering what is up?

1/8 = 30000
1/4 = 60000
1/2 = 120000
which are correct (works as intended)
then one would think
1/1 = 240000
2/1 = 480000
right?

well that moves the scope projected waveform slightly (not good)

however
wow = 99999999999999999999999999999999

still only moves the oscilloscope waveform just slightly (really very not good)
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VitaminD
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 Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 5:48 pm reply with quote
Any ideas? Seems to be more than a scope issue as aurally it doesn't change much from 1/2 to 1/1 or 2/1
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justin3am
KVRAF
 Posted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 6:56 pm reply with quote
It sounds like you are reaching the maximum size of the buffer of your delay modules. Double click on the delay module, then select the 'function' tab in the info/browser bar on the left. On this page you'll see an option for the maximum buffer size.

Also, I suggest using the 'Tempo Info' module (Built-in Modules\Auxiliary) to automatically convert BPM into values that the delay module can understand. Use the Stereo delay macro in the Classic Modular directory as an example of how to use lists to select different tempo based divisions.
^ Joined: 07 May 2006  Member: #106746  Location: Southern California
VitaminD
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 Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 5:04 am reply with quote
Thank you for responding!

However, I don't see what you are saying I should see there

and besides.. this isn't attached to any delay modules but just to a scope at this point.
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"Use the talents you possess, for the woods would be very silent if no birds sang except the best." - Henry Van Dyke
^ Joined: 11 Mar 2002  Member: #2027  Location: in a state of confusion
normal
KVRAF
 Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 6:44 am reply with quote
VitaminD wrote:
Thank you for responding!

However, I don't see what you are saying I should see there

and besides.. this isn't attached to any delay modules but just to a scope at this point.

justins' answer starts down the path i would have taken , re: the delay buffer size ...
now , re-reading your original post , i have to say , i don't have a clue as to what you
are trying to do ...
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justin3am
KVRAF
 Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 8:28 am reply with quote
VitaminD wrote:
Thank you for responding!

However, I don't see what you are saying I should see there

and besides.. this isn't attached to any delay modules but just to a scope at this point.

Can you post a screen shot of your patching window? I don't understand what you are trying to do.
^ Joined: 07 May 2006  Member: #106746  Location: Southern California
VitaminD
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 Posted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 4:24 pm reply with quote
I guess in order to get the help I need.. I'm going to have to show my hand that I've toiled over for several days

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"Use the talents you possess, for the woods would be very silent if no birds sang except the best." - Henry Van Dyke
^ Joined: 11 Mar 2002  Member: #2027  Location: in a state of confusion
museumoftechno
KVRist
 Posted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:01 am reply with quote
The values in your 1/4 ... 4/1 list look OK:

1/2 = 120000
1/1 = 240000
2/1 = 480000
4/1 = 960000
...

If you want the number of milliseconds to delay a signal by the number of beats selected in your list... well, that number's coming out of the "Divide By" module dividing your "beat length" list value by the BPM.

I don't understand why you're sending values to the pitch input of an oscillator though. The pitch input isn't the same as frequency in kHz. When I have Reaktor running at 120BPM and I choose 1/1 (240000) from the list, that pitch input is receiving a value of 0.5. Now... 0.5 Hz is one cycle every 2 seconds, which does mean one cycle per bar; but 0.5 in the logarithmic pitch scale means something completely different: half a semi-tone above the note 5 octaves below middle C. That's about 8 Hz. And... well, if you chose 2/1 from your list, that would generate a value at the oscillator's pitch input of 0.25, which means... well, also about 8 Hz.

So I think you might need to do some work clarifying how you're thinking about pitch and frequency.

Hope that helps!
^ Joined: 29 Apr 2011  Member: #255703
VitaminD
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 Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 5:01 pm reply with quote
So no matter what I do, I cannot connect anything to the Pitch input on the Sine generator to alter the period of the waveform out of it?
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"Use the talents you possess, for the woods would be very silent if no birds sang except the best." - Henry Van Dyke
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ghettosynth
KVRAF
 Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 5:17 pm reply with quote
VitaminD wrote:
So no matter what I do, I cannot connect anything to the Pitch input on the Sine generator to alter the period of the waveform out of it?

This is not true. You can, for example, sum the input with a negative number. There is an example of this in the NI forums where hewr is giving some homework assignments. I believe that he fed -300 into the pitch input to get really low frequencies. You can also use the FM sine feeding some large native number into the pitch input and using the FM input to control the frequency in Hz.

That said, all of this is done for you in the built in LFO under "Macro->Building Blocks" which controls the phase input of a core oscillator. I'd either use that, or study how it's done.

If you look at the phase on a scope you see that it is nothing more than a ramp at the desired frequency. One advantage to this approach is that you can simply add an offset to it to shift the phase of the lfo at any frequency. (It's wrapped inside the osc module).

I can understand wanting to really get into the guts of Reaktor, but, in my opinion, you will learn a lot more by modifying existing macros/instruments/ensembles. You not only learn how to do what you want to do, but you also learn the quirks of Reaktor at the same time, and usually, you learn interesting tricks in the process.
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VitaminD
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 Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 7:47 pm reply with quote
Thanks, Guys.

I guess I'll just modify the existing LFO.. I hated to do that because then it really isn't my own.. and actually that LFO is terrible from a usability standpoint (kitchen sink approach) for my needs.

I guess I'll figure something... thought this would be A LOT easier than it is to hook this to a filter and get temposynced cutoff sweeps..
----
"Use the talents you possess, for the woods would be very silent if no birds sang except the best." - Henry Van Dyke
^ Joined: 11 Mar 2002  Member: #2027  Location: in a state of confusion
ghettosynth
KVRAF
 Posted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 10:28 pm reply with quote
VitaminD wrote:
Thanks, Guys.

I guess I'll just modify the existing LFO.. I hated to do that because then it really isn't my own.. and actually that LFO is terrible from a usability standpoint (kitchen sink approach) for my needs.

Just cut out what you don't need, it's fairly easy to do. Here's a simple example I knocked up in a few minutes that strips the LFO down to just the parabolic osc.

Quote:

I guess I'll figure something... thought this would be A LOT easier than it is to hook this to a filter and get temposynced cutoff sweeps..

It really is. Look at my example above. In particular, put a scope on the phase input so you can see that it's just a ramp.

It can completely be your own because what you'll find is that getting the basic connections is the easy part, giving it character is the challenge.
^ Joined: 13 Oct 2009  Member: #217404
marvotron
KVRist
 Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 12:52 am reply with quote
VitaminD wrote:
So no matter what I do, I cannot connect anything to the Pitch input on the Sine generator to alter the period of the waveform out of it?

You could put an F -> P converter in front of the oscillator. Ctrl-F, type log and choose Log.(F)

Or if you use the Core Oscillator 4-Wave Mst to replace your Sin oscillator and inside of that just strip out the P to F conversion then you'll have an oscillator with a frequency input. You also get all the extra waveforms on the output.
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ghettosynth
KVRAF
 Posted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 5:39 am reply with quote
marvotron wrote:
VitaminD wrote:
So no matter what I do, I cannot connect anything to the Pitch input on the Sine generator to alter the period of the waveform out of it?

You could put an F -> P converter in front of the oscillator. Ctrl-F, type log and choose Log.(F)

Or if you use the Core Oscillator 4-Wave Mst to replace your Sin oscillator and inside of that just strip out the P to F conversion then you'll have an oscillator with a frequency input. You also get all the extra waveforms on the output.

If you don't want the extra waveforms, you can knock up a core macro with just the sin and an F input fairly easily.
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wehkah
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 Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:48 am reply with quote
Very interesting thread! Thx for explain it guys
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