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Can just any sampler do this or is it unique to rayblaster?

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:04 pm
by Aiynzahev
Not trying to spam but I'd just really like to know if you guys have found this kind of sample manipulation in other samplers

http://soundcloud.com/aiyn-zahev/raybla ... -brilliant

The sample is just a girl going "Hey, hey" and the guy says "don't stop, party rock"

Thing is as far as I remember all thats happening here is the modwheel is changing the start position in the sample and the sample is being looped in some way.

I'd have to take a look at the patches again because I forget what was going on now.

Also anyone here got the Roland V-synth? Does it do stuff like this?

Sami

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:09 pm
by Sendy
You could do something similar in a sampler like the free Shortcircuit. That has full automation of loop points, start points, etc.

That said RB has some unique controls and has a sound of it's own. Often what it does with loops can sound quite lo-fi or unsettled/borked, but I like that.

Overall, I'd say it's strong point was making pads and textured sounds, but it's very versatile and deep if you want to spend time with it.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:25 pm
by aMUSEd
Aiynzahev wrote:.

Also anyone here got the Roland V-synth? Does it do stuff like this?

Sami


Oh yes, only mod wheel is pretty basic; with the V Synth you have the timetrip pad to play with, you can use it to do all sorts of crazy stuff with samples, not just change start position but stretch, stutter, reverse etc all in realtime using touch gestures. It's not just a simple XY, different movement trajectories do different things to the sound. Plus you have the 2 D Beams and trad mod wheel too.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:30 pm
by justin3am
Aiynzahev wrote: Also anyone here got the Roland V-synth? Does it do stuff like this?



Yes, and yes! :love: The V-Synth is great for manipulating samples like this. You can even use an oscillator to FM a sample and vice versa. It's a remarkable synth with a unique sound.

Many samplers won't let you move loop points with automation or MIDI. I use ableton's Simpler/Sampler, Reaktor, Alchemy, my V-Synth, Octatrack and Phonogene eurorack module for this kind of thing.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 12:33 pm
by zlatan
I think Rayblaster is very unique and can produce sounds no other synth or sampler I know can make.
At first I thought it was only good for pads and textures , but the more time I spent with it the more I got out of it.

Nice Bass, Pluck and Lead sounds.

I love the surprise factor .... you never really know what comes out of it.

Still think the presets are horrible and in no way represent what this synth is capable of.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 3:47 pm
by Neon Breath
You can achieve pretty much the same results with granular synths.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2013 7:38 pm
by bludreamsounds
The vsynth has been more powerful as sampler than it is as a synth, Dont get me wrong, the synth engine is solid but the addition of bringing samples into a full set of synth tools with elast audio, granular synthesis, step modulator,auto pitch mapping to the keys, stomp box models AND a vocoder in 1 box. It's a decent set of tools wrapped in one.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 1:03 am
by Ingonator
Neon Breath wrote:You can achieve pretty much the same results with granular synths.

If you import samples into RB (instead of using short short single cycles) uisng the Resynthesis feature the result sounds like granular synthesis. In that case The Formant knob does change the tuning and the "Tune" knob adjusts the "grain depth". You could adjust the harmonic value to zoom in an out the sample, set the starting point manually and/or modulate the start point with e.g. a LFO,

This is more or less and additional feature to using "normal" or short waveforms as with those e.g. the Formant knob works differently.

I have used some of my own samples for some presets that i have sumbmitted for an upcoming soundset based on Atmospheres.

Currently working on demos for it.


BTW the first Rablaster soundset called Futuron besides 50 additional waveforms created by myself also includes some new samples for the Resynthesis feature:
http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=369798


Ingo

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 1:37 am
by elcallio
At the risk of self-promotion; TX16Wx will let you modulate start + loop points using any external controller or internal modulator. And its actively supported. ;-)

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 1:40 am
by Ingonator
elcallio wrote:At the risk of self-promotion; TX16Wx will let you modulate start + loop points using any external controller or internal modulator. And its actively supported. ;-)


Any sarcasm with that part of your post? To me it sounded like Tone2 abandoned Rayblaster already.
If you talk about a missing forum here at KVr you could have a look here.
http://www.tone2.org/forum/index.php?board=30.0

Besides that (with all due respect for your product) Rayblaster got a certain combination of features besides start phase modulation which seem to make it quite unique.
Not to forget that Rayblaster is also available for the latest OSX which made a total rewrite of the graphics engine necessary. Rayblaster is also not inteneded to work like a "normal" sampler so a comparison to TX16Wx could be difficult.
I have installed the free version of TX16w. It does not seem to include factory samples and factory presets.

UPDATE:
I tried to use the start point modulation in TX16w but this does not seem to deliver the same result as in Rayblaster. Like other samplers also with TX16Wx you got a problem of properly stretching a single sample (e.g. from C3) over the whole keyboard. For proper results usually multiple samples are necessary.

You could also not to waveform transformations like with the "Osc windows" and "PW sequences" like in Rayblaster. Rayblaster also got no real filter but it extracts filter responses from the waveform (usually single cycles but also longer waveforms) you feed into it which could either result in replication of the filter of a certain synth (works only with a single cycle waveform that is created in a certain way) or in a "fantasy filter". Again i don't see any way to do the same in TX16Wx.

Currently i don't know any other synth that could get similar results from single cycles or single short samples/waveforms (up to around 60000 samples in length).
As mentioned in my last post importing a longer sample with the Resynthesis feature usually results in sounds similar to granular synthesis.


Ingo

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 5:34 am
by core
Aiynzahev wrote:Not trying to spam but I'd just really like to know if you guys have found this kind of sample manipulation in other samplers

http://soundcloud.com/aiyn-zahev/raybla ... -brilliant

The sample is just a girl going "Hey, hey" and the guy says "don't stop, party rock"

Thing is as far as I remember all thats happening here is the modwheel is changing the start position in the sample and the sample is being looped in some way.

I'd have to take a look at the patches again because I forget what was going on now.

Also anyone here got the Roland V-synth? Does it do stuff like this?

Sami


Cool sound manipulation :tu:
I think granular synths can do this type of stuff well indeed.
Got an itch to play with Rayblaster now :hihi:

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 6:01 am
by Ingonator
Aiynzahev wrote:Not trying to spam but I'd just really like to know if you guys have found this kind of sample manipulation in other samplers

http://soundcloud.com/aiyn-zahev/raybla ... -brilliant


Quote from the comment at that Soundcloud demo:
"I was also surprised that some of my wildest sounds were not included in the factory bank! Here is what was missed, I will speak to them about it, or make them available for free."

I got the same "problem". Even if several of my presets are included with the factory soundsets, the Futuron expansion and the next upcoming soundset there are still many unpublished presets. Same about my Saurus presets. At some point i'll have to decide how i could publish those remaining presets.
I see three options: Either those will be part of a later official soundset from Tone2 or i make them part of a big soundset with only my own presets (with several additional new ones of course) or publish them for free. Publishing free presets should be done a t a later point where they do not directly "rival" with the commercial soundsets which already include some of my presets.


Ingo

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 6:31 am
by Nielzie
Ingonator wrote:
elcallio wrote:At the risk of self-promotion; TX16Wx will let you modulate start + loop points using any external controller or internal modulator. And its actively supported. ;-)


Any sarcasm with that part of your post? To me it sounded like Tone2 abandoned Rayblaster already.


I think he meant Shortcircuit with that, which was mentioned earlier. It's more comparable to TX16Wx but unfortunately not actively developed anymore, since the developer joined the Bitwig team years ago.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 6:40 am
by ThomasHelzle
You can do that kind of thing very nicely with Harmor.
Does even sound better in some regards - to my ears at least.

Cheers,

Tom

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2013 6:55 am
by Aiynzahev
ThomasHelzle wrote:You can do that kind of thing very nicely with Harmor.
Does even sound better in some regards - to my ears at least.

Cheers,

Tom


Oh good one. And I guess one of DiscoDSP synths does this too right?