Roger Linn Design

oldgearguy · Post by **oldgearguy** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 12:12 pm

Before I delve into the code for this, I thought I'd ask first and see if anyone has looked into it.

How difficult would it be to add another Switch option to hold arpeggiated notes? The goal would be to free up both hands for changing things in the other split or simply adjusting what notes are being played, etc. The switch would simply latch or unlatch the notes.

Initially it seems straightforward, but I thought that about a couple other things as well...

gbevin · Post by **gbevin** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 12:32 pm

What do you mean with 'hold arpeggiated notes'?

oldgearguy · Post by **oldgearguy** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 1:08 pm

gbevin wrote:What do you mean with 'hold arpeggiated notes'?

If arpeggiator is active on a split, pressing switch 1 or 2 would latch the notes so you could remove your fingers and the notes keep playing. The switch would override the touch release code.

nlecaude · Post by **nlecaude** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 1:13 pm

I was also wondering if that could be possible,

When you're holding 3 notes in arpeggiator mode it's quite hard to switch quickly to another spot without a little time gap...

function · Post by **function** » Mon Mar 23, 2015 4:10 pm

I was actually thinking the same for the 'Note Repeat" option, instead of having to hold the note down, to use the repeat, it would just remember the last note played, so you could use both hands on the repeat bar.

oldgearguy · Post by **oldgearguy** » Wed Mar 25, 2015 10:45 pm

I had a thought driving home from work today and had some time to make some quick changes.

https://youtu.be/o2Ow1wtCkNg

There's still a lot to be done to make it really mimic what happens when you hold down the notes, but at least this shows it kind of can be done...

spunkytoofers · Post by **spunkytoofers** » Sun Mar 29, 2015 10:11 pm

hold mode option would be useful for the switch desinations.

i was wondering if a tap tempo function could be brought to switch option. tap tempo because the only way to change up tempo is through external midi or via switching to global page to tap the cell for tap tempo.

Roger_Linn · Post by **Roger_Linn** » Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:10 pm

Actually if Low Row is set to ARPEG, moving your held finger on the low row switches between the arpeggiator rates without changing the tempo

oldgearguy · Post by **oldgearguy** » Mon Mar 30, 2015 12:10 am

spunkytoofers wrote:hold mode option would be useful for the switch desinations.

i was wondering if a tap tempo function could be brought to switch option. tap tempo because the only way to change up tempo is through external midi or via switching to global page to tap the cell for tap tempo.

There's a 3rd way - go to global mode, touch (and hold? I forget - not near my Linnstrument) the flashing tap tempo button and the tempo number will appear. If you slide your finger over the tempo number, you can change it like other numeric values.

SpittingLama · Post by **SpittingLama** » Sun Jun 07, 2015 4:15 pm

Big time bump on this topic.

I fired up my Linnstrument for the first time today. (An absolutely beautiful controller, I must say....)

I updated my firmware and went through the documentation to familiarize myself with the instrument. I finally resigned myself to the fact that arpeggiator latch - assignable to a panel or foot switch, did not exist.

If an instrument or controller has an arpeggiator to begin with then it - almost invariably - has hold/latch functionality. I was a bit frustrated that the Linnstrument did not. As my use for the Linnstrument is primarily for playing hardware via 5-pin din, I find the lack of arp (or strum) latch/hold more significant. (It is less important for playing software where other workarounds exist.) Having that functionality built in would otherwise address anything I could want from the Linnstrument.

Respectfully - to have to modify the source code for what, IMVHO, should be basic functionality for an arpeggiator, is a stretch. I'm curious as to why it wasn't thought to be important and/or would not work well as a standard feature. I'm also amazed that so few have seemed to request/want this.

I won't use firmware that isn't from RLD. And I don't plan on doing any Arduino coding. So I am curious if RLD plans, at some point, plans to add Arpeggiator/Strum Latch/Hold capability to the Linnstrument.

Roger_Linn · Post by **Roger_Linn** » Sun Jun 07, 2015 7:21 pm

Thank you for buying a LinnStrument. I'm not quite sure what you mean by "arpeggiator latch", but there are a variety of ways to either toggle (latch) or momentarily turn on the Arpeggiator:

1) Latch the Arpeggiator on by turning on "Per-Split Settings > Special column > Arpeg".

2) Press the SWITCH 2 button. Press it once to latch the arpeggiator on and again for off. By default, SWITCH 2 is assigned to turn the Arpeggiator on or off, but you can reassign it in "Global Settings > Assign Switch".

3) Connect a single or dual Foot Switch and assign either foot switch to momentarily turn Arpeggiator on. You can reassign this in "Global Settings > Assign Switch".

4) Use the Low Row to momentarily turn Arpeggiator on. To do this, set "Per-Split Settings > Low Row" to "Arpeg". The Arpeggiator will turn on while you hold the Low Row and turn off when you release it. In this case it is handy to use your thumb to momentarily turn on the Arpeggiator while your fingers are playing the notes in the other rows. Note that by sliding your thumb left or right from the location of first touch, you can step down or up through the various arpeggiator speeds (1/8th, 1/8 triplet, 16th, 16th half swing, 16th triplet, 1/32nd or 1/32 triplet). Also, note that if the Arpeggiator is latched on using methods 1 or 2 above, you can use the Low Row merely to change the Arpeggiator speed in real time while you play.

I hope this is helpful to you. If I did not adequately answer your question, could you please elaborate?

irtimid · Post by **irtimid** » Mon Jun 08, 2015 7:24 am

+1
A possibility to hold arpeggiator notes would be a very great addition to the linnstrument.
As seen in oldgearguy's video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2Ow1wtCkNg

Can it be added to a firmware update? Would be great!

oldgearguy · Post by **oldgearguy** » Mon Jun 08, 2015 8:52 am

What the poster means by latching the arpeggiator is to remember what notes are currently being pressed when you take your fingers off the Linnstrument and keep the arpeggiator running, not simply turning it on and off.

I did implement a latch mode in my version of the OS. There are a few difficulties in doing it 100% properly. Geert may have a better/more complete suggestion for doing it, but here's what I did.

First - rather than create yet another hidden button combination, I modified the Arp On/Off switch option so that it became Latch On/Off. In other words, once you turned the arpeggiator mode on in the Per-Split settings, the switch assigned to Arp now latches/unlatches the held notes. You lose the ability to play that split normally (which is what the official version does with Arp On/Off), but it save you from having to remember yet another hidden button combo.

Next - this is where I could use some possibly better suggestions. In the code, it looks for note release to handle sending MIDI Note Off messages and do other cleanup. I bypass the note release if latch is on and once you turn off the latching, note offs happens and it all stops properly.

The bigger issue is the pad pressure. While holding the notes, you can vary the pad pressure of an active note. If you want to latch the arpeggiation and keep it playing, you ideally want to capture the exact pressure on release. Pressure is used to detect a note release. My current solution is to look for a difference in pressure between sequential scans of the held notes. If the arp was latched and the pressure changed by more than a threshold amount (I think I have it at 10), use the previous pressure as the latched value. It's not a perfect solution and you can still fool it into capturing a low pressure value, but it generally works well enough for the standard 0-127 MIDI CC resolution.

Dirk Diggler · Post by **Dirk Diggler** » Mon Jun 08, 2015 12:21 pm

Two words, sustain pedal?

Roger_Linn · Post by **Roger_Linn** » Mon Jun 08, 2015 7:55 pm

I understand now. Assuming the sound you're using doesn't use pressure (which of course will silence the note once you remove your finger) then yes, changing the function of the sustain pedal while Arpeggiator is running would permit played notes to continue after release as long as the sustain pedal is held, or after a panel switch assigned to Sustain Pedal is on. The only problem with this is that the sustain pedal would no longer sustain the individually-generated notes as in this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BaG6aQKSpeg

It's basically a decision of whether the sustain pedal action comes before the arpeggiator (latching notes on after finger release for continued arpeggiation) or after the arpeggiator (sustaining the repeated notes generated by the arpeggiator as in 1.2.0). So perhaps we can add a hidden setting to switch between them. Geert and I will give it some thought and thanks to SpittingLama for raising this issue.

Roger Linn Design

KVR Audio

Hold mode for arpeggiator?