A sample filetype that embeds one high-quality sample per key?

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Hello,

I was wondering if there is a sample filetype out there that embeds a series of WAW files - one high-quality sample per key. I have found some sample collections on the Internet where you basically have a ZIP file with a series of WAV files (12 notes × 7 octaves) but then, if you are brave, you have to import those sample files one by one in your DAW sampler. Otherwise, you just import one sample (e.g. C3), and let the sampler resample this key to reproduce the remaining notes, but the remaining notes are of rather poor quality.

I tried importing a C3 sample of the Lately Bass of the Yamaha TX81Z. C3 sounds great, but as you move away from C3, the sound gets thin, aliased and loses its character.

For some types of sounds or instruments (e.g. acoustic instruments), there is little or no need for fundamental changes of the sound itself (e.g. filter cutoff, etc.) so using a rompler makes sense and uses little resources on the computer.

It would be convenient to have a file format that embeds a series of samples for just one sound/instrument, one high-quality WAV file per key. One could import such a file into a virtual sampler just by a single drag & drop, and each key would have its corresponding sample file assigned in a second. Maybe this format exists? If this is compatible with Cubase or one of its VSTIs, that would be awesome (I currently use Groove Agent One as a rompler - it does the job).
Please let me know! Thanks :wink:

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calande wrote:Maybe this format exists?
This is exactly what nearly ALL sampling libraries do: assign a sample to a specific range of keys & velocity levels. It's even possible in the now archaic SF2 format to have a dozen of velocity ranges and each key sampled individually.

In practice though it's usually sufficient to use the C3 sample on B2 and C#3: up/down-sample just one semitone. Then you only need 4 samples per octave (12 semitones, 3 semitones served by one sample)
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Thanks for the information. That's nice. Has it been standardized? I mean, same format and file extension across applications. You say the SF2 format is now archaic, what is the newer format of choice? From my research, this technique is called "multi-samples". But then, I didn't find a common format, only multi-samples for Ableton, or for Native Instruments, etc...What software application will allow to pack a multi-samples file?

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I make multi-sampled (velocity-layered) instruments for Ableton Live ... they consist of WAV files mapped out as you suggested in your OP. This mapping is done by hand and then saved as an instrument rack inside Live. If you don't own Live then the mappings won't work, but the WAV files are all included in the pack, so can be mapped out (by hand) in any sampler.

The only "universal" format I know of is SFz ... for which you need sforzando or something similar. http://www.plogue.com/products/sforzando/

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Most sample players have advanced automapping options, depending on the meta data embedded in a sample and the name of the sample, so it's not all that tedious when mapping hundreds of samples for a single instrument patch. If the samples don't contain any of that helpful data one is of course bummed.

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If all you want is to make it easy to load a multi-sampled instrument into any DAW, then you want two things:
1) a sampler that is available in any DAW, preferably for free, so users who do not currently have it can get it (e.g. Kontakt Player, Sforzando)
2) a sample format that works with the above (e.g. Kontakt-specific and licensed, or the WAV files you have plus a mapping in SFZ 2 format used by Sforzando)

I'd suggest going with Sforzando - it's free, you can produce mappings for free using free tools and they'll work for anyone who has the player. (Kontakt has the limitation that the free player only plays free libraries for a limited time.)

There are many other samplers and the majority have sampler-specific formats, meaning your library can only be used by those who own that sampler. If the sampler isn't free, you limit your audience.

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You should know a few things.

Creating digital instruments is never quite as easy as it seems.

To get good results you need to make sure that you have tightly edited your samples, possibly done noise reduction and either normalized the samples or compensated for volume differences in your sampler. For higher quality instruments it can be good to have more than one velocity layer, usually three is a good start. Also better instruments will sometimes use more than one sample of the same note as 'round robins' and alternate between the samples so as to avoid the machine gun effect if the same note is struck repeatedly at the same volume.

There is no universal standard, but Kontakt is the closest thing. It requires purchase for both you and your consumer and goes for anywhere from $150 via a freebie instrument and then upgrade sale to $400. Kontakt Player licensing costs are out of the question for most novice developers. I think Kontakt is the easiest place to start.

Making your own VSTis is another route, but can be very difficult. It generally involves lots of coding.

SFZ has many benefits, but seems from my perspective to be a difficult place to start. Fortunately some of the gentlemen in the posts above are experts at SFZ and I'm sure can give you advice on the format.

If you are doing this for yourself alone and have Kontakt, Evil Dragon has created a nice do-it-yourself program to put your samples in a fancy Kontakt shell that is quite inexpensive.
http://www.hollowsun.com/HS2/products/g ... /index.htm

If you want to distribute in Kontakt and don't mind simple, you can use my little hacked together shell as a start.
http://bigcatinstruments.blogspot.com/2 ... a-pad.html
Or try a slightly more complex one like the DIY Violin shell
http://bigcatinstruments.blogspot.com/2 ... oject.html
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bigcat1969 wrote:SFZ has many benefits, but seems from my perspective to be a difficult place to start.
This, it seems, is the vibe on the forum. I don't quite get it, that is, IMO SFZ is not very complicated at all, it is simpler that Kontakt, one just need to take a "step across the border" and write stuff in a notepad, instead of using graphical interface. It's no big deal, really.

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SFZ is a good point to start (if something free is needed). It's an open standard and many samplers can work with it (sforzando, TX16Wx are free, Kontakt, Dimension, Rapture, Alchemy are proprietary and this list is open).
SFZ is a textual format so any text editor is a typical way to create and edit SFZ libraries. But there are several free tools to work with SFZ in a visual editor (not in text form):
SFZ Designer (in beta stage): http://mildon.me/sfzdesigner
Polyphone: http://www.polyphone.fr/ (intended to work with SF2 but also reads and writes SFZ).
So it's no so difficult to start there. I cannot garantee that both will work perfectly. Poliphone seems to be stable and I use it sometimes (my editing needs are very limited indeed).

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Or try TX16Wx http://www.tx16wx.com/. This reads its own format, SF2 and SFZ. You can edit your banks. The difference between the free version and the paid one is not so huge, Pro version has any advanced features (http://www.tx16wx.com/tx16wx-pro). The cost of the paid version is minimal (€29).

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Thank you all for this invaluable information. I now have a perspective of multi-samples, and its limitations to date (openness of the various formats, incompatibilities across applications and formats). I think I'll share sampled instruments in several formats in the future.

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Several formats are nice, but if you include wav files with meaningful names (c3_vl1_rr2.wav, for example, and not Sample124.wav) then it won't be too hard for people to make them work in other samplers.

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Testify! Check DSmolkins samples to see good naming conventions and good editing. I liked his orks so much that I'm waiting for the goblims set next.
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lobanov wrote:SFZ is a good point to start (if something free is needed). It's an open standard and many samplers can work with it (sforzando, TX16Wx are free, Kontakt, Dimension, Rapture, Alchemy are proprietary and this list is open).
SFZ is a textual format so any text editor is a typical way to create and edit SFZ libraries. But there are several free tools to work with SFZ in a visual editor (not in text form):
SFZ Designer (in beta stage): http://mildon.me/sfzdesigner
Polyphone: http://www.polyphone.fr/ (intended to work with SF2 but also reads and writes SFZ).
So it's no so difficult to start there. I cannot garantee that both will work perfectly. Poliphone seems to be stable and I use it sometimes (my editing needs are very limited indeed).
Thanks very much for these links, I didn't know about SFZ Designer or Polyphone.
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