Bitwig

Jamesoow · Post by **Jamesoow** » Tue May 05, 2015 4:39 pm

Hey Bitwiggers,

I just thought about the (for me) best way of integrating modulation possibilities in Bitwig. Now we have to add a vst where we want to modulate a knob INTO for example Note Mod or LFO Mod. This is very counter-intuitive as these mods become containers instead of "addons".

I think the best way to do this is to add all the possible modulators to the left side of each track. Then pressing on it will open the options for each mod. Pressing the "activate" button will let you choose which parameter on ANY instrument or vst on that track you want to modulate. This way each track becomes an instrument on itself and not a bunch of Note Mods, LFO Mods etc after each other. Also, you can modulate different vst's in the chain.

I hope you get an idea of what I mean lol I'm not the best writer.

What do you guys think? Is this even do-able coding-wise? What do you think are the disadvantages of this approach in comparison to the one that we have now?

Ch00rD · Post by **Ch00rD** » Tue May 05, 2015 4:41 pm

Fwiw: a similar discussion can be found in this thread: "I don't understand Bitwigs modulation routing strategy".

tooneba · Post by **tooneba** » Wed May 06, 2015 2:45 am

Jamesoow wrote: Is this even do-able coding-wise?

I think it's doable considering FL's modulators can be placed everywhere and they modulate any parameters any VSTs at the same time. So... BW devs rather limit to current state? Idk.

TristanMendoza · Post by **TristanMendoza** » Wed May 06, 2015 4:25 am

tooneba wrote:
Jamesoow wrote: Is this even do-able coding-wise?
I think it's doable considering FL's modulators can be placed everywhere and they modulate any parameters any VSTs at the same time. So... BW devs rather limit to current state? Idk.

What are you talking about exactly?

TristanMendoza · Post by **TristanMendoza** » Wed May 06, 2015 4:39 am

I made the argument that it makes total sense the way its laid out right now. If you have the device chain going from left to right, and modulators can't control anything to the left of them, they only control what comes after them right?
So, it makes sense from a basic signal flow point of view, and organizational point of view: Mods can't modulate anything besides whats placed after them (signal flow) and it saves you from having to guess and look around for what control a mod device is linked to because you know that its to the right of the mod, or bundled with the mod (organized).

Im not saying your idea isn't good or valid or anything like that, Im just saying that the way it is right now makes sense, and if we had all the modulators to the left or placed aside from other devices then people would be like "Ok, I want to click on the mod and see all the devices linked to it!!"
Well, we already have that!

I hope I explained myself alright, I suck at explaining myself

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Wed May 06, 2015 4:50 am

I think with audio and midi signal flow it makes sense to have everything running left to right but with mod data it doesn't necessarily have to be like that. With audio and midi you have one stream that gets altered and passed on but with mod data you have a source it can connect to this and this and that. But there are exceptions to the left to right scheme anyway right now, for example a note fx slot in some of the instruments lets you addd pre fx but it shows up on the right of the instrument.

The way it works right now is just too counter intuitive I think. It hides the instrument in the modulator, it renames your track or drumcell or whatever to the name of the modulator, you have to save the preset under modulator instead of the instrument you are modulating. And then there's just the idea of the main thing going in the periphery thing that just doesn't seem right.

tooneba · Post by **tooneba** » Wed May 06, 2015 5:11 am

TristanMendoza wrote:
tooneba wrote:
Jamesoow wrote: Is this even do-able coding-wise?
I think it's doable considering FL's modulators can be placed everywhere and they modulate any parameters any VSTs at the same time. So... BW devs rather limit to current state? Idk.
What are you talking about exactly?

Whether programmers can make it not "containers instead of "addons"" if they wished to.

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Wed May 06, 2015 5:15 am

It would be really cool if there was a system that would let you add modulators easily enough that you wouldn't even need them on the instruments themselves. That would save a lot of screen space and simplify things for when you're not using them.

xbitz · Post by **xbitz** » Wed May 06, 2015 6:20 am

if it can be connected to anywhere (any node) within a track after the modular view is opened ...

so IMO a bit early talking about it

Ogopogo · Post by **Ogopogo** » Wed May 06, 2015 6:26 am

That shows the construction of one device, not routing between devices. But yeah, maybe things will change with the mod system.

slackhead · Post by **slackhead** » Wed May 06, 2015 6:41 am

xbitz wrote:if it can be connected to anywhere (any node) within a track after the modular view is opened ...

so IMO a bit early talking about it

How did you get to that view???

xbitz · Post by **xbitz** » Wed May 06, 2015 6:56 am

https://www.google.hu/search?q=bitwig+m ... CAYQ_AUoAQ

this is what we know about it

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qeH0i-M0tC0&t=280

from 4:40, which is not too much, who knows how it gonna work on track level or how this view gonna support VST devices etc.

slackhead · Post by **slackhead** » Wed May 06, 2015 7:00 am

Ah - just a tease

Nice though - I'll look forward to that.

takaii · Post by **takaii** » Wed May 06, 2015 7:45 am

tooneba wrote:
Jamesoow wrote: Is this even do-able coding-wise?
I think it's doable considering FL's modulators can be placed everywhere and they modulate any parameters any VSTs at the same time. So... BW devs rather limit to current state? Idk.

I have talked to often about the limitation fl studio offers. but i wont.. I like bitwig, it has my kind of workflow... Sure i like the ideas about having a matrix to modulate what we want with same thing. What is diffrent with containers is it boost up the workflow to start a project. You can create a chain and save that inside a lfo or something that modulates parameteres and have that as a preset. Open and its done. Want to use same lfo on something else track? Copy it to another track superquick by ctrl drag release.

I also like that the lfo can have retrig and there are some nice modulation option in bitwig letting midi from another track change something in the current track... And have parallell processing of effects that each parallell process can have its own send knob to share same reverb with other tracks with diffrent amounts.

But +1 on idea on modultion matrix. I dont feel bitwig has to skip the container system. but allow to use same llfo over tracks would be cool on a modulation matrix

PHY6 · Post by **PHY6** » Wed May 06, 2015 9:19 am

A midi receiver module would take care of sending modulation to more tacks.

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