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LUFS - confused.

mementus
KVRist
 
457 posts since 10 Apr, 2011

Postby mementus; Thu Dec 07, 2017 8:56 am LUFS - confused.

Recently I have watched PRO-L2 promo where they state that reference lufs levels for CD is -9, for streaming is -14 and that a good average point is -12.

At this point, just for curiosity, I checked my mix-masters and noticed that my LUFS were around -7/-6. I checked them with Cubase loudness meter.

Then I opened some commercial songs, taken from YT just for a test on a streaming version, and noticed that they also are around -6/-7 LUFS.

Result: I am very confused now.

EDIT: added negative values.
Last edited by mementus on Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Googly Smythe
KVRAF
 
1943 posts since 11 May, 2011, from The 51st state

Postby Googly Smythe; Thu Dec 07, 2017 10:37 am Re: LUFS - confused.

Aren't we all.
And aren't LUFS figures supposed to be minus eg -23dBs?
imrae
KVRist
 
125 posts since 2 Jul, 2010

Postby imrae; Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:04 am Re: LUFS - confused.

It's pretty simple. Your masters are too loud. So are the commercial ones.

Loudness war sucks, LUFS matching is helping but it will take time. I'm not very enthusiastic about the side-effect of messing with levels within an album.
No_Use
KVRAF
 
2219 posts since 13 Mar, 2004

Postby No_Use; Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:39 am Re: LUFS - confused.

Googly Smythe wrote:And aren't LUFS figures supposed to be minus eg -23dBs?


Yeah, positive LUFS figured can't be.
But positive LU figures can.
mementus
KVRist
 
457 posts since 10 Apr, 2011

Postby mementus; Thu Dec 07, 2017 11:57 am Re: LUFS - confused.

Rihanna Diamonds -10 lufs
300 OST -10 lufs
Calvin Harris under control -4 lufs
OneRepublic Wherever I Go -7.5 lufs
New_Found_Glory_-_Its_Not_Your_Fault -10 lufs

All mp3 so they are under the streaming category I guess.
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Googly Smythe
KVRAF
 
1943 posts since 11 May, 2011, from The 51st state

Postby Googly Smythe; Thu Dec 07, 2017 12:31 pm Re: LUFS - confused.

mementus wrote:Rihanna Diamonds -10 lufs
300 OST -10 lufs
Calvin Harris under control -4 lufs
OneRepublic Wherever I Go -7.5 lufs
New_Found_Glory_-_Its_Not_Your_Fault -10 lufs

All mp3 so they are under the streaming category I guess.

iTunes and YouTube, and presumably the other one who's name escapes me (senior moment :dog:) process everything to around the -12db mark. That's the "streaming" level.
All this lufs business is about broadcasting, anyway. What legislation there is, applies only to radio and tv. It's still a free for all for everyone else.
Personally, I find -12db to be plenty loud enough.
mementus
KVRist
 
457 posts since 10 Apr, 2011

Postby mementus; Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:01 pm Re: LUFS - confused.

Googly Smythe wrote:
mementus wrote:Rihanna Diamonds -10 lufs
300 OST -10 lufs
Calvin Harris under control -4 lufs
OneRepublic Wherever I Go -7.5 lufs
New_Found_Glory_-_Its_Not_Your_Fault -10 lufs

All mp3 so they are under the streaming category I guess.

iTunes and YouTube, and presumably the other one who's name escapes me (senior moment :dog:) process everything to around the -12db mark. That's the "streaming" level.
All this lufs business is about broadcasting, anyway. What legislation there is, applies only to radio and tv. It's still a free for all for everyone else.
Personally, I find -12db to be plenty loud enough.


I extracted those files from YouTube to get the test so why aren't they processed at -12?
mementus
KVRist
 
457 posts since 10 Apr, 2011

Postby mementus; Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:08 pm Re: LUFS - confused.

now I try with some files got on iTunes
mementus
KVRist
 
457 posts since 10 Apr, 2011

Postby mementus; Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:20 pm Re: LUFS - confused.

From iTunes:

ColdPlay - 05 Clocks -8 Lufs
The Archive -Fu -8.5 lufs
BSF - 06 Handful of Redemption -6 lufs
lady gaga - applause -5.5 lufs
No_Use
KVRAF
 
2219 posts since 13 Mar, 2004

Postby No_Use; Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:31 pm Re: LUFS - confused.

Did you download the files from YT/iTunes or did you capture the stream ?

I think only capturing and measure the stream would give if you the values of their normalisation process as it's done non-destructively while streaming (i.e. the original uploaded files are untouched.).
mementus
KVRist
 
457 posts since 10 Apr, 2011

Postby mementus; Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:40 pm Re: LUFS - confused.

I extrated from youtube and used the ones I downloaded from iTunes
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mgw38
KVRian
 
537 posts since 26 Jul, 2015, from Philadelphia

Postby mgw38; Thu Dec 07, 2017 1:48 pm Re: LUFS - confused.

„Processed“ does not mean that the actual files are changed. As already pointed out the normalisation is a non-destructive process. It just means that tracks with -4LUFS and -12LUFS will play equally loud. So by going from -12 to -4 you gain nothing in terms of perceived loudness but lose a whole lot in terms of dynamic range. Depending on the type of music you are producing that can be more or less of an issue. It is never a good thing though.
kbaccki
KVRAF
 
2420 posts since 12 Sep, 2004

Postby kbaccki; Thu Dec 07, 2017 4:43 pm Re: LUFS - confused.

Simple explanation of LUFS, dynamic range, and streaming: https://www.masteringthemix.com/blogs/l ... nd-youtube
You need to limit that rez, bro.
tom javelink
KVRer
 
5 posts since 8 Dec, 2017

Postby tom javelink; Fri Dec 08, 2017 2:57 am Re: LUFS - confused.

Lately I started to use "youlean loudness meter". By my own experiences around -5 or -6 short term LUFS you get the professional products loudness (around -3 RMS). If you can achieve the clarity as well, then you are the winner. :)
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DJ Warmonger
KVRAF
 
2467 posts since 7 Jun, 2012, from Warsaw

Postby DJ Warmonger; Fri Dec 08, 2017 3:26 am Re: LUFS - confused.

Trance sits around 5 LUFS. I master my tracks at 5,5 always, but that's it. Yes, it has to be loud in club. No, it's not suitable for streaming. No one streams this stuff anyway, it is amed at DJ sets.

Recently my release was uploaded to Youtube by some random guy. And yes, the low end sounds horribly smashed thank to transcoding from mp3 I assume.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ri7vjKhMdt8

That being said, in different stores that tracks sounds different as well.
http://djwarmonger.wordpress.com/
Tricky-Loops wrote: (...)someone like Armin van Buuren who claims to make a track in half an hour and all his songs sound somewhat boring(...)
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