TX16Wx Software Sampler 2.0 Beta Released - Announching TX16Wx Professional (Updated 2012-10-19)

[elcallio]

To quickly go to a sample from keymapper, just right-click in either key map view or on a split in the group list and choose "edit wave". It will jump to the sample editor with the wave selected.

Can this be done with a double-click on a split instead, perhaps?

As per request double-click was already reserved for opening a file selector dialog to replace the sample. And alas, I am out of keyboard modifiers...

[EvilDragon]

Drat!

[V'ger]

No, they are shown in the group list order, which by default will be the order you created the groups.

Why sorted by create time and not key (note number) or at least as an option? Would be nice for drums as the keys are where the groups are anyway.

As for mouse wheel, it is set to scroll 1/10 of the total distance on every MW tick, which is almost to fast with my mouse. If your wheel doesn't tick enough, then your MW sensitivity is off (see mouse settings). My point is that I cannot dial up that setting without breaking it for everyone else. (maybe setting, but that is somewhat cumbersome...) Does your MW work fast enough in other apps?

Ah, I get 20 clicks to do a total distance here, and when not many samples in a list that explains why it is comically slow, and really fast when list is big. Couldn't this be set to number of lines instead to make it uniform and predictable? In Windows, mouse wheel is as you know set to do a number of lines at a time (I have it set to 9 by the way), maybe it could follow this somehow?

But another thing about the mousewheel is that when used in the group list view or sample edit view to go up and down in the list, it's so easy to accidentally edit the values instead. Maybe an option to disable mousewheel of values?

It works as intended. The sample list is not a subset of the group list, thus it should not select what you pick there. To quickly go to a sample from keymapper, just right-click in either key map view or on a split in the group list and choose "edit wave". It will jump to the sample editor with the wave selected.

The right-click - Edit Wave option works (I just forget right-click menus still exists, so used to right-click having a function in DAW nowadays), but maybe an option to double-click like Evil Dragon says, or at least use a mouse modifier like for example ctrl-click would be easier, but if you've run out of modifiers..

I definitely expect a filtered view like you say. As I'm most likely to use TX16WX to make drum sets rather than instrument sets, a typical scenario would be to layer a key with several sounds, and quickly wanting to adjust those individually. The best would be to select one directly from the keymap, but as it is, to find the one that needs adjusting, I first have to select all samples by shift-dragging the key in keymap editor, then scroll up and down in the group pane to see how many are there and where they are, then to find the right one, audition each by opening them in wave editor with the right-click - edit wave option and clicking the small play icon before I can go back and do edits. It just seems a bit too many steps if you see what I mean.

Ideally, I would for example right-click or ctrl-click the bar in keymap to cycle through the samples while each would sound automatically and be selected for editing in both group and wave editors.

Not demanding anything here, just saying. For sure others have different ways of working.

[elcallio]

MachFive 3 allows to color each keygroup (zone, split) to a custom color. Also each layer (group, group set) can have a color, and each part (instrument) as well.

It's a cute and sometimes very useful feature to have, IMHO.

Actually a neat idea. I'll add it to the feature list for 2.*

This may sound insane but have you thought about making TX16WX scriptable in the future (similar to Kontakt/MachFive). I use MachFive and the Strum script is a must. If TX16WX had basic scripting possibilities to manipulate incoming MIDI data, it would really set it apart from Shortcircuit, Directwave, etc.

Nothing is impossible, though I tend to think that keeping things like that in MIDI plugins is a better way to structure things.
I do very much doubt that I will even have time to consider a feature like that for quite some time though. There are a plethora of feature todo:s and wishes that (imho) have higher prio, and I am but one man (albeit awesome

On the other hand, I used to write compilers and virtual machines, so its right up my alley so to speak...

[makerprofaze]

Finally off XP, for the time being at least (Win 8 ) on a swap drive...
Bout time I got to see those pop up messages.

Anyway, uh, how do I drop a wave in and have it's scale set to NORMAL?
This multiple keys of the same pitch is ridiculous.
Bypass Wave Pitch is not checked in options.

[elcallio]

Finally off XP, for the time being at least (Win 8 ) on a swap drive...
Bout time I got to see those pop up messages.

Anyway, uh, how do I drop a wave in and have it's scale set to NORMAL?
This multiple keys of the same pitch is ridiculous.
Bypass Wave Pitch is not checked in options.

Not sure what you are experiencing, as long as one sample dropped has pitch, the resulting group will have key scale set to normal.

The layout algorithm works like this:
- If all samples are pitchless (or we're forcing pitchless), just put stuff on one key each
- Otherwise:
- Sort samples by root (non-pitched counts as 0 -> lowest)
- For each sample
- If root != previous root, calculate a distribution distance and place all the samples so far across it

Now, this works _very_ well for homogeneous sample sets with reasonable root-key distribution (typical multisample sets). If you toss mixed non-pitched, and same-root stuff at it though, the results will be less perfect, and will be somewhat dependent on _where_ you drop it as well.
I.e, I drop a set of samples, [non-pitched, C4, C4, A4] onto the keymapper. Depending on where I drop it I will get different, and varyingly good results. I concede that this is less than optimal. I might try to create an algorithm that handles the case of "bad" (same root etc) distribution more explicitly, to get more uniform results for different start keys.

[makerprofaze]

Hhm... I've never fully understood the convention of samples having keys indicated in the names - If hardware used to utilize it, I sure never used it. And I wasn't about to complicate sampling on the fly with THAT much naming - of course I usually wasn't trying to emulate conventional sounds/pitches.

I created new perf+slot+program and dragged a single "non-pitched" wave into the groups area using the shift key and was surprised that the scale was fixed; then, after switching scale to normal the root was somewhere at the botttom of the keyboard (not even visible?) Again, I see little use for this behavior. From a user perspective, I've always thought it was useless to have a spread of the same pitch on multiple keys unless the mapping was for playing special rolls - or blind [with your elbow].
Single key as a default is kind of .....(wait for it).... A Drag
Classically, a sampler only begins to speak to me as an instrument when I hear the keys that Aren't the root pitch, as that's where the sound characteristics of The Instrument begin to be heard (old-school) - otherwise it's just a player.

I guess I've missed these developments almost entiely as I've been using a template the whole time, so ultimately it doesn't really matter to me, my template only requires that I sample or drop new sounds in the list area, then select them in the ready made groups where I want them in the mapping, and it's on to arranging composition/micro editing sounds.
I will say that what I would expect as "normal" default behavior would be for the scale to be normal, and the root key to be set to a mid point in any spread keyrange per sample - I actually thought it used to be this way.

So I'm just sharing my view on this, cause I realize I missed the discussion, and apparently eveyone likes the way it is. I just consider it extra to drop stuff in with a shift-dragged range of (multiple wavs/keys) then have to click scale to set to normal, as well as click each plus AND move each root to a middle key for each sample, to actually have access to the range of multiple keys/pitches that mapping to multiple keys (can) afford. Scale on fixed is an easy way to assure the root plays within a spread range, but at the cost of what's essentially a single key assignment as default.

Just my view

[makerprofaze]

I probably have an incredible amount of "non-pitched" samples in my database, so is it recommended that I do a batch write of some key to all my samples? I guess this issue will subside with new samples taken with TX as it will assign a default key. Are we talking meta-data,wav headers, name editions, or other here?

[elcallio]

Just to clarify a few points:

1.) Name has nothing to do with pitch. Root key info is, if it exists, embedded in the "Sampler" or "Instrument" chunk of the WAV (or similar if other format). Its just a MIDI key number (+ opt fine tune) designating the root pitch.

2.) When you drag a sample without root key info, the resulting group will indeed be non-pitched, with scaling set to "Fixed". This is because we assume that a sample without root key is a "drum" sound (I seem to remember it was you asking for this on the beta list as well so...

Just switching the key group to "normal" does not give TX16Wx any info on the root key of the sample. In fact, there is still none. However, for practical purposes, if the sample is non-pitched, it will play as if the root key was middle C (MIDI 60).

To assign a root key, you either enter it by text, or drag the root key slider in wave or split entry. And this seems to be your real issue, that when dragging, the root info will start at lowest MIDI key. This is a bit cumbersome, I can agree, especially since the effective root is 60. I will change the behaviour so that the first slide change from non-pitched to pitched will set root to 60 and slide from there.

[makerprofaze]

So I didn't miss the discussion, but I wasn't paying complete attention on this point in the beta stage when I was giving input - sorry.

I understand how I've kind of wasted my vote sounding off on these issues, but no, I don't like defaulting anything drum/single key/pitch with or without a spread (I know, too late for that). What you suggest is certainly an improved behavior, but to do whatever calculations to put the root key in the relative center of a sample's spread as default on normal scaling I would think is (always) more useful than putting it at the static keyboard's center.

I should have taken a stand in the beta forum, things actually start going over my head once people begin discerning "drum samples" from 'samples', so I just added input for that direction. In essence, to effectively drop multiple samples of ANY pitch from the browser, for my personal usage it's most sensible to have the root keys Always be assumed to be in the center of a sample's resultant key spread. - And for scale to Always be normal - unless user changed.

Incidentally, my template's keymappings are based on 16 note spreads with the roots in the centers of the spreads, which suits my actual workflow.

[elcallio]

So I didn't miss the discussion, but I wasn't paying complete attention on this point in the beta stage when I was giving input - sorry.

I understand how I've kind of wasted my vote sounding off on these issues, but no, I don't like defaulting anything drum/single key/pitch with or without a spread (I know, too late for that). What you suggest is certainly an improved behavior, but to do whatever calculations to put the root key in the relative center of a sample's spread as default on normal scaling I would think is (always) more useful than putting it at the static keyboard's center.

I should have taken a stand in the beta forum, things actually start going over my head once people begin discerning "drum samples" from 'samples', so I just added input for that direction. In essence, to effectively drop multiple samples of ANY pitch from the browser, for my personal usage it's most sensible to have the root keys Always be assumed to be in the center of a sample's resultant key spread. - And for scale to Always be normal - unless user changed.

Incidentally, my template's keymappings are based on 16 note spreads with the roots in the centers of the spreads, which suits my actual workflow.

One thing to remember is that dropping samples never _modifies_ root pitch. It just uses the info that is there. If dropping a sample modified root pitch, you'd have some pretty weird conflicting behavior once you drop the same sample twice with different ranges.

Though I can see the use of what you are describing. I wish I had more (easy) key modifiers or something to play with...

[Crackbaby]

Speaking of pitch .. if i want to repitch a drum sample to make it sound more scrkchhmbl how do i do that the easiest way? And what if i want to downpitch an entire group?

btw, i have not had a crash so far and i've made TONS of drumpatches (at least 20 )

[elcallio]

Speaking of pitch .. if i want to repitch a drum sample to make it sound more scrkchhmbl how do i do that the easiest way? And what if i want to downpitch an entire group?

btw, i have not had a crash so far and i've made TONS of drumpatches (at least 20 )

Shift/tune in the group is your key to "local" pitch alteration. Or for dynamic sounds, modulate pitch with either MIDI controller, automation, or a modulator.

You also have transpose/tune on the program level (accessible through the expanded slot area)

Cheers

[Crackbaby]

Hah, i had missed the expanded slot area Glad you mentioned it!

[Crackbaby]

When you drag'n'drop samples from the file browser, can you make the file browser not move up and down when moving the cursor? Same with the Keyboard mapper, if that one could stay in place.
Right now when i move the cursor i have to move it through the middle of the up/down handle in order for it to stay in place. Similarly i have to move the cursor outside the keyboard mapper (ie not from the left) or it will scroll to the left.

I hope it's possible to understand what i mean!
The problem really only occurs when you have more samples that can be seen at once in the browser and want to put a sample beyond d#5 (with the max size of the plugin and the zoom level i have of the keyboard (smallest + one zoom in level))

Also, would you consider a full screen mode in the future?

The plugin rocks, just so you know if you didn't!

Edit: I'd love to be able to sort the samples in keyboard order (in keyboard mapper, the list below the keyboard. If you have drumsamples from C1 to C5 you'll have an impressive list. If you have added the samples in a randomish order it's really hard to find a sample if you for instance have muted it (since muted samples disapear from the keyboard until you unmute them).