KVR Audio

crimsonwarlock · Post by **crimsonwarlock** » Fri Nov 08, 2013 6:24 pm

tapper mike wrote:
crimsonwarlock wrote:Just for some sound perspective

Famous Hammond sounds:

I did a blog article about famous sounds awhile back, You may enjoy even though it appears you are already quite knowledgeable on the matter.

http://tappermike.com/?q=node/32

Very nice article. I won't call myself knowledgeable (I leave that to others

), but lets just say I'm old enough to have seen all those instruments used (and have played most of them myself, if only during demos). Most of those tracks are also in my CD collection. I actually met Robert Jan Stips once in the late eighties and had a very nice discussion with him about synthesizers. I've always thought of his work with a transistor organ incredible. Later, years after Supersister he formed a band that was actually called 'Transistor'

kbaccki · Post by **kbaccki** » Fri Nov 08, 2013 6:37 pm

VB3 is da bomb... and sooo cheap... one of the best purchases I've made...

BlackWinny · Post by **BlackWinny** » Tue Nov 12, 2013 11:24 pm

I totally agree with EvilDragon and kbaccki... nothing reaches the quality of VB3 made by GSI. I have tried all these (and for each I mention the price and my personal opinion):

Rumpelrausch Taips AZR3. Free, and rather good for a freeware.
Native Instruments B4. $229/€199 (expensive compared to the others), really good, yes... but we'll find better and cheaper below!!
Istvan Kaldor DirtBag. Free, really good for a drawbar/tonewheel emulation when one see that it is a freeware, but it is a generalist drawbar/tonewheel emulation rather than focused especially on the Hammond B3. So the match to the high fidelity to Hammond B3 suffers a little of it. If you had written "I want a freeware emulation of the B3", I'd have said "Take this one or take AZR3 above! (forget the fact that Dirtbag has knobs instead of faders, the essential is the emulation of the sound)"
DSK Music DSK B3x. Free, but forget it.
Istvan Kaldor LightBag II. Free, but forget it.
LinPlug Organ 3. $99/€79, Really excellent, better (although half price!) than the Native Instruments B4 above (and yet... I'm one of the highest FM8 lovers!) but once more we'll find better and cheaper below!
AM Music Technology VL-122. €39.99 when it was available, it was a rather good emulation of the Hammond L-122 but I met many problems with the faith of some sounds. And it was not a B3 emulation so not in direct relation with your question, but I mention it as a Hammond emulation that I have tried.
GSi VB3. €50, and it is by far, by far, by very far, the best Hammond B3 emulation! Really the ultimate Hammond B3 emulation! It surpassses absolutely all the others! What do I say?... No, it makes you forget all the other B3 emulations that you have tried before!!! The only one that could compete with it is Linplug Organ 3 that I listed above, but first Linplug Organ 3 is twice the price of VB3 and second in my opinion related to the fidelity to Hammond B3... I'd give Linplug Organ 3 a note of 8/10 if I give GSi VB3 a note of 9/10 (and 7/10 to Native B4). And don't pay attention to the argument of Linplug saying that it can also emulate the Vox and the Farfisa. I'm an intensive user of Linplug Octopus that I love as Native FM8 (the FM synthesis is my prefered synthesis) but as easy as it is to listen a very good B3 emulation in Linplug Organ 3 it is really difficult to get the same fidelity in it for the Farfisa and the Vox. No, really... GSi VB3 is by far, by far, by far the best emulation of the Hammond B3. And at €50 it is very cheap. What more can one ask for? (you can't imagine the very hard and long work it is to refine the source code of a VST to reach such a perfect fidelity and finally sell the result for only €50!... pipping at the post other products which cost €100 or even €200!)

You can be sure... Nobody has done better since VB3!

electro · Post by **electro** » Wed Nov 13, 2013 12:07 am

EvilDragon wrote:IMHO no, VB3 is still the king.

The GSI website announced a x64 update

Should also be possible to build B3 clones in Tassman and Reaktor.

BlackWinny · Post by **BlackWinny** » Wed Nov 13, 2013 1:04 am

electro wrote:The GSI website announced a x64 update

Yes. Here :
http://www.genuinesoundware.com/?a=support&q=2#Q2

And a warning about people using ProTools on Mac:
http://www.genuinesoundware.com/?a=support&q=9#Q9

On Windows, there is not any kind of problem, VB3 works very well (and with a beautiful GUI, all its functions and huge sound!) with all the hosts and DAWs that I use often (SAVIHost, VSTHost, Cantabile Lite, BigTick Zen, Ableton Live 9 Lite, and Magix Samplitude Studio 17) or everyday (MuLab 5, BIAB 2013 (and also its RealBand), and Avid Sibelius 7 First which I use intensively for all the compositions that I write in classic notation or in guitar tablatures (I use the piano roll only for the synth pads or for very easy repetitive sequences).

So in the Windows environment, VB3 works perfectly in all my hosts and DAWs. That said for the question which will undoubtedly come.

Andywanders · Post by **Andywanders** » Wed Nov 13, 2013 11:50 am

electro wrote:
EvilDragon wrote:IMHO no, VB3 is still the king.
The GSI website announced a x64 update

GSi wrote:Q: Is there a 64 bit version of VB3 available?
A: No, there's currently no native 64 bit version of VB3, but we're currently working on it.

That "announcement" has been there for ages. So far I don't think any of their instruments are x64.

waltercruz · Post by **waltercruz** » Wed Nov 13, 2013 2:05 pm

The 2.0 that runs on their hardware is 64 bit.. But they don't have a GUI still for the 64 bit. Don't remember where I've seen this!

tapper mike · Post by **tapper mike** » Wed Nov 13, 2013 2:35 pm

@BW, Wow you do your research well. I'm impressed. You must have a more recent edition of biab then I do I always have problems runing a vsti and playing midi in on BIAB

electro · Post by **electro** » Wed Nov 13, 2013 2:54 pm

Andywanders wrote:
electro wrote:
EvilDragon wrote:IMHO no, VB3 is still the king.
The GSI website announced a x64 update

GSi wrote:Q: Is there a 64 bit version of VB3 available?
A: No, there's currently no native 64 bit version of VB3, but we're currently working on it.
That "announcement" has been there for ages. So far I don't think any of their instruments are x64.

GSI Homepage wrote:October 28, 2013 Think twice before updating your Mac to OSX 10.9!

Apparently, some GSi plugins are showing strange behaviors in OSX 10.9, so do many many other plugins and standalone applications, especially in the professional audio world. Our own humble advice is to resist the temptation of running towards the update only because it's free! If it's free, there's a reason.

Here's an interesting link that summarizes some of the incompatibilities between Mavericks and our digital audio world: Mavericks compatibility @ CreateDigitalMusic.com

And if you make a Google search, you'll find tons of other sites among blogs and forums where people are lamenting problems of every kind with this new OSX release.

From our own part, we can say that we are currently working on 64 bits updates of the most wanted GSi plugins (VB3, MrRay73mk2 and GS-201), others will follow. Unfortunately this is a very slow process and will take some time. So, please, don't update your Mac yet and if you're planning to buy a GSi license, please test the free demo version before you buy.

BlackWinny · Post by **BlackWinny** » Wed Nov 13, 2013 4:33 pm

To learn to play a Hammond B3 or C3 organ or an (excellent) VST emulation I warmly recommand this twin DVD of many, many, many lessons :
http://www.academystudio.co.uk/keithpages/hammond.htm

Take the time to watch his two playlists and you'll have the complete sight of all the possibilities of this extraordinary B3 Hammond organ. Keith Appleton teaches all the styles playable with Hammond organs: Jazz, Rock, Classic, Gospel, cool pads, accompaniment of songs... He is a very famous player and professor of Hammond organs (especially B3 and C3) and other keyboards and he is the founder of the Academy Studio, and his twin-DVD set at this so low price is a gift. Take the time to watch all the 60 extracts he has uploaded on Youtube, you'll be astouned by the quality of his lessons.

He discovered the Hammond organ at 15 years old when hearing Keith Emerson (Emerson, Lake & Palmer) in 1968. He has also played with Rhodes, Clavinet, Minimoog, Arp Pro-Soloist, Korg...

Him or whoever you want, my opinion is that it is really necessary to take some lessons (even video lessons) to really appreciate all the richness of these two very special organs which are the Hammond B3 and C3, whether it is the real hardwares or an emulation! If we prefer to get by without... so we really miss the point of these two Hammond organs because they are definitively not like the other organs!

And take also the time to see and listen to all this playlist (take your time) of 48 videos of Barbara Dennerlein who in my opinion is the new Rhoda Scott, with a totally renewed technicity and a fantastic vituosity. In this very long playlist entirely made with Hammond organs and most of all with B3 and C3, all the styles are covered: classic, lyric, jazz, bop, ragtime, gospel, songs, movie soundtracks, pads... and if you are very observant, by using slow motion you will discover some of her very own technics.

From tapper mike:

@BW, Wow you do your research well. I'm impressed. You must have a more recent edition of biab then I do I always have problems runing a vsti and playing midi in on BIAB

That's strange. I have never met any problem running VSTs and VSTIs in BIAB. I use BIAB only since october 2011 (the 2012 then 2013 releases in their respective megapacks) and I have never encountered any issue.

fluffy_little_something · Wed Nov 13, 2013 6:08 pm

Mixcraft comes with a one-manual version of the VB3 included, but I never use it, I hate organ sounds. The VB3 sounds pretty authentic, which is why I hate it

BlackWinny · Post by **BlackWinny** » Wed Nov 13, 2013 6:22 pm

fluffy_little_something wrote:Mixcraft comes with a one-manual version of the VB3 included, but I never use it, I hate organ sounds. The VB3 sounds pretty authentic, which is why I hate it

A paradoxal but funny way to tell how much VB3 is a very faithful emulation.

BlackWinny · Post by **BlackWinny** » Wed Nov 13, 2013 6:33 pm

fluffy_little_something wrote:I hate organ sounds.

Even when played by Keith Emerson?

Take a look at his very, very personal method to play organ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHoCq6PcfMk

Quietinthedark · Post by **Quietinthedark** » Wed Nov 13, 2013 6:42 pm

I think Linplug Organ 3 is a serious competitor. I'd still say GSI is the top tho.

jancivil · Post by **jancivil** » Wed Nov 13, 2013 7:25 pm

VB3 is alright. I think it got to be seriously overrated vis a vis this forum.

compared to Vintage Organs, it's a nice cheeseburger and fries meal compared to a rich feast. VO has a really useful interface designed to get specific things one would have in mind. Some of it has a certain 'brightness' but that tends to cut through in a mix. I don't know why I would choose VB3 for actual use frankly, there isn't something outstanding in its tone I've noticed. I like the preset-ness and ease of use in VO and there is more [no-brainer] control available right away.

Is there a serious competitor to GSI VB3?