Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
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msvs
KVRian
1431 posts since 18 Apr, 2011

Post Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:29 am

show me your path structure pls

steefthtje
KVRer
13 posts since 28 Feb, 2019

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Mon Jul 08, 2019 9:57 am

msvs wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 8:29 am
show me your path structure pls
I created a new expansion within Avenger. Then I went into Avenger's file browser tab to find the wavetables that I wanted to convert, drag and drop, edit, export, then the file explorer window pops up. I go to my newly created expansion, go to wavetables folder, In there I created new sub folders and saved my converted wavetables in there. When I am back in the Avenger plugin, I go to wavetables, locate the name of the expansion I created, click on it but then it shows all the wavetables in one long list without having them grouped in the sub folders that I created.

User avatar
msvs
KVRian
1431 posts since 18 Apr, 2011

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Mon Jul 08, 2019 10:14 pm

yes you are right, thats not possible. Problem is the OSC Browser which has 3 rows, first is selecting Wavetables, middle Row is selecting which xp and right row is the content of this. There is no space for a 4th row for further folders. In our XPs we use sub folders very rarely, only if we really have to (like in the Atmospherica XP). We then do it with a programming trick, so Avenger thinks it has multiple xps of the same kind in the middle row. This clutters the visual a bit and creates really much folders, so we use it rarely as I said.

I would do the following:
create prefixed in the filename so they will be sorted in groups and are quickly recognizable by the eye

BASS SuperTabel
BASS Moog Sweep
BASS Formant Move
LEAD Screamer
LEAD Fat Synth
etc.

I think we will find a better solution for displaying multiple folders in the middle row (I already have some ideas) in a future update.

steefthtje
KVRer
13 posts since 28 Feb, 2019

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Tue Jul 09, 2019 7:07 am

msvs wrote:
Mon Jul 08, 2019 10:14 pm
yes you are right, thats not possible. Problem is the OSC Browser which has 3 rows, first is selecting Wavetables, middle Row is selecting which xp and right row is the content of this. There is no space for a 4th row for further folders. In our XPs we use sub folders very rarely, only if we really have to (like in the Atmospherica XP). We then do it with a programming trick, so Avenger thinks it has multiple xps of the same kind in the middle row. This clutters the visual a bit and creates really much folders, so we use it rarely as I said.

I would do the following:
create prefixed in the filename so they will be sorted in groups and are quickly recognizable by the eye

BASS SuperTabel
BASS Moog Sweep
BASS Formant Move
LEAD Screamer
LEAD Fat Synth
etc.

I think we will find a better solution for displaying multiple folders in the middle row (I already have some ideas) in a future update.

Alright, I'll do that for now and wait for the future update. Got the synth not to long ago so still got lots to explore. I am a big fan of the shaper. I use it for "scream filter" like effect. You can get some brutal sounds through that. Keep up the great work!

100tifiko
KVRist
248 posts since 28 Jun, 2017

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Tue Jul 09, 2019 11:25 am

Manuel hope in the future we could just click on the library samples and convert them to the granular synthesis

User avatar
kevvvvv
vvvvvvv
2316 posts since 24 Oct, 2000 from skelmersdale, west lancs, uk

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:33 pm

Perhaps I shouldn't be bringing it up in this thread, but Massive X is getting some big thumbs down :dog:
Member 12, Studio One 4, trialling Microtonic drums, Pigments, Arturia 6, Avenger (still unbelievable), Atom & Impact XT, Kontakt, Dune 3 (started with Dune CM), Izotope Neutron 3 advanced

steefthtje
KVRer
13 posts since 28 Feb, 2019

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:11 pm

kevvvvv wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:33 pm
Perhaps I shouldn't be bringing it up in this thread, but Massive X is getting some big thumbs down :dog:
People compare everything to Serum nowadays. If it can't do what Serum can then it becomes automatically a "bad synth". but why would you need another synth that does the same thing as the one you already got? Massive X got some interesting wavetables... You can already find them converted into wav format if you really want them.

funkee69
KVRer
2 posts since 8 Nov, 2007

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:23 am

Hey Manuel, do you know if there will be a Promo Sale soon? I already own 26 Exp, but if there is a sale to buy something else I would not mind... :)
Thanx

User avatar
jeffb01
KVRian
876 posts since 18 Apr, 2006

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:36 am

funkee69 wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:23 am
Hey Manuel, do you know if there will be a Promo Sale soon? I already own 26 Exp, but if there is a sale to buy something else I would not mind... :)
Thanx
I agree. It's just funny to me that you've been a member 12 years and this is your first post. Like, you were finally inspired to post to ask for a sale. ha.

funkee69
KVRer
2 posts since 8 Nov, 2007

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:42 am

jeffb01 wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:36 am
funkee69 wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:23 am
Hey Manuel, do you know if there will be a Promo Sale soon? I already own 26 Exp, but if there is a sale to buy something else I would not mind... :)
Thanx
I agree. It's just funny to me that you've been a member 12 years and this is your first post. Like, you were finally inspired to post to ask for a sale. ha.
Ahahah you're right! it's because i like to be discrete :? I'm a silent customer! ahahah jokes aside, that's because I don't have much time to stay in the discussion, but I read everything!

tapekiller
KVRist
43 posts since 6 Nov, 2014

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:05 am

kevvvvv wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:33 pm
Perhaps I shouldn't be bringing it up in this thread, but Massive X is getting some big thumbs down :dog:
This thread is about Avenger, so you're right. It doesn't add anything to the discussion :D

tapekiller
KVRist
43 posts since 6 Nov, 2014

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:39 am

steefthtje wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:11 pm
kevvvvv wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:33 pm
Perhaps I shouldn't be bringing it up in this thread, but Massive X is getting some big thumbs down :dog:
People compare everything to Serum nowadays. If it can't do what Serum can then it becomes automatically a "bad synth". but why would you need another synth that does the same thing as the one you already got? Massive X got some interesting wavetables... You can already find them converted into wav format if you really want them.
Massive X has good sonic capabilities and can definitely reach territories other synths can't, and its workflow/interface definitely help in that regard.
There are several things I don't like about the interface (like GUI elements clustered together, massive waste of space and many other things that I'm seriously surprised to see in a synth of theirs, given their access to good GUI-UX designers) but other stuff is pretty good, granted, when it actually works.
It was rushed to respect the June deadline and it clearly wasn't ready (no manual, no standalone, many bugs), but still, the aforementioned thumbs down are coming from people who probably thought they had a magic wand.

And yes, sadly Serum is a benchmark to compare synths with nowdays even for things that go beyond sonic clarity but it's mostly because Duda nailed the UX design to accomodate sound designers and put everything in clear sight while also giving space to what is needed when doing something more complex (like a dedicated window for modulation controls, and Avenger is almost getting there with the expanded mod section even if it's still quite narrow). Serum works very well for non cheesy EDM stuff, so people resort to that synths and they probably have more exposure and higher reputation because of the boost they give on social media. Just look at youtube for example, it's flooded with serum tutorials, and the rent to own program Splice offers is making it even more accessible to everyone. (Are there any plans to get Avenger there as well, btw?)
If more advanced users knew what Avenger can achieve I'm pretty sure it would be in the same ballpark but there are few things that simply don't work well with some kinds of workflows, and some things can't be achieved with Avenger unless you put an excessive amount of work to do something as simple as a 2/4 voice classic unisono, and when you try to work around it by using two oscillators with the same settings you realize you can't copy/paste knob values, so you end up with imprecise approximations, and all parameters related to the kind of generator you're using (like granulizer's or wavetable's settings) are impossible to match on different oscillators without a massive migraine.

So, in conclusion, I think it's mostly about the workflow. Avenger, Massive X, Serum, Phase Plant, Zebra... every synth can achieve something "good" on its own but if advanced sound designers need a certain feature they will praise the synth that can allow them to achieve what they want, and if it's possible they'll go for the most efficient route.

steefthtje
KVRer
13 posts since 28 Feb, 2019

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Wed Jul 10, 2019 12:05 pm

tapekiller wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 6:39 am
steefthtje wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 8:11 pm
kevvvvv wrote:
Tue Jul 09, 2019 2:33 pm
Perhaps I shouldn't be bringing it up in this thread, but Massive X is getting some big thumbs down :dog:
People compare everything to Serum nowadays. If it can't do what Serum can then it becomes automatically a "bad synth". but why would you need another synth that does the same thing as the one you already got? Massive X got some interesting wavetables... You can already find them converted into wav format if you really want them.
Massive X has good sonic capabilities and can definitely reach territories other synths can't, and its workflow/interface definitely help in that regard.
There are several things I don't like about the interface (like GUI elements clustered together, massive waste of space and many other things that I'm seriously surprised to see in a synth of theirs, given their access to good GUI-UX designers) but other stuff is pretty good, granted, when it actually works.
It was rushed to respect the June deadline and it clearly wasn't ready (no manual, no standalone, many bugs), but still, the aforementioned thumbs down are coming from people who probably thought they had a magic wand.

And yes, sadly Serum is a benchmark to compare synths with nowdays even for things that go beyond sonic clarity but it's mostly because Duda nailed the UX design to accomodate sound designers and put everything in clear sight while also giving space to what is needed when doing something more complex (like a dedicated window for modulation controls, and Avenger is almost getting there with the expanded mod section even if it's still quite narrow). Serum works very well for non cheesy EDM stuff, so people resort to that synths and they probably have more exposure and higher reputation because of the boost they give on social media. Just look at youtube for example, it's flooded with serum tutorials, and the rent to own program Splice offers is making it even more accessible to everyone. (Are there any plans to get Avenger there as well, btw?)
If more advanced users knew what Avenger can achieve I'm pretty sure it would be in the same ballpark but there are few things that simply don't work well with some kinds of workflows, and some things can't be achieved with Avenger unless you put an excessive amount of work to do something as simple as a 2/4 voice classic unisono, and when you try to work around it by using two oscillators with the same settings you realize you can't copy/paste knob values, so you end up with imprecise approximations, and all parameters related to the kind of generator you're using (like granulizer's or wavetable's settings) are impossible to match on different oscillators without a massive migraine.

So, in conclusion, I think it's mostly about the workflow. Avenger, Massive X, Serum, Phase Plant, Zebra... every synth can achieve something "good" on its own but if advanced sound designers need a certain feature they will praise the synth that can allow them to achieve what they want, and if it's possible they'll go for the most efficient route.
In VPS you can copy an Osc tab and the paste it into a new one. This sends all the settings over to the other Osc, or is that not what you mean?

User avatar
msvs
KVRian
1431 posts since 18 Apr, 2011

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:12 pm

furthermore the 2,4 and 6 Unisono Pan problem had been fixed in one of the last updates...

steefthtje
KVRer
13 posts since 28 Feb, 2019

Re: Vengeance Producer Suite - AVENGER - free 1.4.10 update with new features

Post Thu Jul 11, 2019 10:32 am

So I made a preset, and part of the preset includes a sample that I made and dragged into Avenger. Once I save that preset is the sample saved into the preset file or do I need to save the sample by itself into my Avenger Expansion? Because eventually I would like to share it with people but don't want the sample to be missing from the preset when it's loaded up.

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