Fathom Synth New Sound Bank Purple Mist

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
Artie Fichelle
KVRist
31 posts since 28 Nov, 2004 from Finikounda, Messenia (GR)

Post Wed Jul 24, 2019 4:47 am

DX7 Possible?
Is it possible to recreate a DX7 preset with Fathom? If yes, how? If no, wouldn't it be a good idea to develop Fathom to the point where a DX7 preset could be emulated? Imagine even if it could import DX7 sysex. Fathom would have a huge sound basis at once.
Fathom is awsome, but the learning curve is not flat. Thanks btw for the microtuning!
artie fichelle sounds natural

nordickvr
KVRian
1158 posts since 29 Sep, 2013

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Wed Jul 24, 2019 5:32 am

Dexed, is a great and free DX7 emulation plugin who already do that...

Artie Fichelle
KVRist
31 posts since 28 Nov, 2004 from Finikounda, Messenia (GR)

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Wed Jul 24, 2019 5:45 am

Yes, I have Dexed, but Dexed has no microtuning, Fathom does.
It is not just about having those DX7 sounds, but they could serve as a base for the Fathom sounddesign. Let's say you have imported a DX7 trumpet, then add more /other oscillators and modulators...
artie fichelle sounds natural

nordickvr
KVRian
1158 posts since 29 Sep, 2013

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Wed Jul 24, 2019 7:53 am

Well, that would be a heavy task at programming for such a functionality.
Not sure thats what Fathom/user would benefit/ask for the most.
Anyway, dev is the one who would actually decide about it.
You never know...

FathomSynth
KVRian
1199 posts since 25 Mar, 2017 from Philadelphia, PA, USA

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Wed Jul 24, 2019 8:28 am

I myself would be very curious to see how close to the DX7 sound someone could get with Fathom's FM oscillator section if they were willing to devote the time.

My guess is you could get pretty close since Fathom has a lot of control over it's FM, in addition you can FM the wave table which might be significantly more power than the DX7 itself. However to exactly duplicate the sound of any hardware synth and all the subtle characteristics requires a real emulator, and Fathom is not an emulator.

So it's really a subjective question.

I personally would be much more interested in duplicating the sound of a Moog than a DX7.

Sorry for the delay with version 2.32 but there has been a lot of testing. However it will for sure be out this week sometime.

It will include the Serum wave table importer/exporter and several new algorithms for the wave table including Overdrive, and Hard Sync. Also there is a new threading option which eliminates all clicks when you move the dials and bezier points in both the wave draw and modulator envelopes.

The Intel AVX release will be 2.33 right after that one. It won't be the same release since there is a lot more testing necessary for AVX even though all the code is already written.

zzz00m
KVRAF
1951 posts since 17 Sep, 2016

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Wed Jul 24, 2019 9:07 am

FathomSynth wrote:
Tue Jul 23, 2019 4:41 am

I don’t think you can do external audio in for a VST plugin, if you could I would have done it already so the Fathom FX could be used without the oscillators. You can only build a VST plugin in source mode or effects mode, not both.
That assumption is not totally correct. It is host dependent.

For a good example, take a look at the free TX16Wx sampler. https://www.tx16wx.com/

It is capable of live sampling from a DAW input, or internal bus as a VST instrument, if the host allows audio input to route to the plugin.

The only host that I have tested with this input flexibility is Reaper, where a track is a generic track, and you can route anything to it. So you can route an audio input to the TX16Wx VSTi.

Audio input doesn't work with Ableton or Studio One for 3rd party instrument plugins. These developers have included dedicated samplers in their hosts, so that this is not an issue. But live sampling an audio input with 3rd party plugins does seem to be a limitation.

It does appear that DAWs with strictly defined track types, such as audio tracks, or MIDI/instrument tracks, tend to only allow audio input to FX plugins.
Windows 10; with instruments from AAS, Ableton, AIR, Ample Sound, Cakewalk, IK Multimedia, iZotope, KV331, NI, PreSonus, Seaweed Audio, SONiVOX, TAL, Tracktion, u-he, UVI, Vember Audio, Waves, Way Out Ware, XLN, others...

574X
KVRist
260 posts since 25 Aug, 2016

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Thu Jul 25, 2019 5:32 am

:lol: Sorry, I completely blanked on that. Goes to show how often I compile fx versions of synths. I'm spoiled by Reaper, which just passes through all the audio and midi however I please, and I conceptualize daws as modular synths anyway.

Allow me to rephrase that I strongly encourage introducing
Fathom FX.

A patch that consistently fails in Tracktion 7, but works in Live 10.
Fathom Patch - Bug - Envelope to LFO Draw LFO Period 1._._._.0.Program.xml.7z
An Envelope is modulating the LFO draw LFO period.
Any rendering crashes in T7, and if I try to record the track within T7 in real time, Fathom remains silent. That has happened in the past also. T7 does weird things...
The LFO playhead doesn't reset to note trigger.

Now seems like a great time to strongly encourage a 3rd LFO trigger option: legato trigger.
This would allow LFO triggers on first note press, and the LFO would be free to continue through its full pattern, while not retriggering with each note press until all notes are released.

More empHAsis on the value of modular softclipping stages:
~1:05
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tLIsi8GEI0g

The long awaited Sampler module, which will be a huge increase in Fathom's capability and appeal, seems like it's best to keep it simple at first for the purposes of rolling out just the sample playback module. I'd imagine that it could be built similarly to your wavetable osc, because the features I assume are most valuable may already be there (repitching across the keyboard, fm, pitch envelopes, and ofc access to the modules available within Fathom, such as the generous helping of filters).

Releasing a sample playback module (as opposed to a sampler audio recording module with workflow optimized midi assignment) with a simple midi note filter would make tons of sense in a modular environment. Coveted auto time stretching and more complex midi functions, etc, don't have to be a development bottleneck for that initial massive benefit to Fathom.
Granted, I see you're obviously doing tons already, and we all appreciate it.

Live's Simpler is a great template. Au5's demonstrations of Simpler are inspiring as he takes drum synthesis another step further, showing the flexibility and variety of results you can achieve with just one driven filter with an envelope, and one pitch envelope, in a sampler.
~13:50
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ra-mZivYchk

Best of luck with everything, I'm loving Fathom more and more.
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brisk walk in the sun
beaming positivity
some protein and rest

glokraw
KVRAF
6956 posts since 6 Oct, 2004

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Thu Jul 25, 2019 11:59 am

574X wrote:
Thu Jul 25, 2019 5:32 am
Allow me to rephrase that I strongly encourage introducing
Fathom FX.
(edited to remove scrambled messages :ud: )
I would enjoy an FX version, and also having
individual effect plugins, like U-he provide
with Uhbiks.

I'd also like an optional effects shell as a product, like a host,
where individual effects that were purchased
could populate the selector mechanism
in the main shell gui, except in fathom's case, if you
didn't yet own the shell, and finally buy
all the singles over some time,
the shell/host would added as a bonus.)
It could be vertical, like Guitar Rig, or horizontal
like Bitwig's effects area, like the pedalboard gui
in Amplitube 4 and others.

But all that borders on reinventing wheels
that are rolling quite smoothly :( The boss knows
what to do with his creations. :hyper:
Last edited by glokraw on Sat Jul 27, 2019 6:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

FathomSynth
KVRian
1199 posts since 25 Mar, 2017 from Philadelphia, PA, USA

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Thu Jul 25, 2019 5:34 pm

Yes, Fathom FX is on the way.

Thanks for the patch. I was able to recreate your bug. If an LFO has a period that is modulated by another modulator the LFO does reset at the start of each note even though the trigger is set to note. I just fixed it in my build so that will be fixed in the next release.

Sorry to say I could not make it crash.

The LFO Legato trigger is a great idea so I will add that to the list.

574X
KVRist
260 posts since 25 Aug, 2016

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Thu Jul 25, 2019 6:08 pm

:lol: I'm very impressed with your patience and of course this is all excellent news.

Wow, I can't believe I forgot about the Midi Controller modulator. I've used it in the past for this exact purpose; the mod wheel.
I was shortsightedly looking under the Note and Keyboard section. At the moment it evades me as to why this is separated. I consider the mod wheel a greater priority than aftertouch and sustain, due to the reflection of its relative availability / implementation in hardware.

I'm very much looking forward to the 3D gui. That's very impressive. A little goes a long way when it comes to textures and reflections, and I often encourage it. This far surpasses that, and I find it very inspiring.
brisk walk in the sun
beaming positivity
some protein and rest

FathomSynth
KVRian
1199 posts since 25 Mar, 2017 from Philadelphia, PA, USA

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Sat Jul 27, 2019 4:00 pm

Yes, the 3D GUI is going to be great.

First I need to release the Intel AVX Parallel Processing version.

User avatar
RPH
KVRian
1190 posts since 21 Nov, 2005 from The Netherlands

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Thu Aug 01, 2019 4:33 am

Some reading material, on the brick-wall filter.
I came across this post, unrelated to what was discussed here, where Fabien points to the SINC filter kernel forming a perfect brick-wall.

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/showpos ... tcount=312

Googling this points to this excellent source for a a windowed-SINC filter with good performance and barely any ripple, especially when cascaded and double precision, check last page for the visual result:
https://www.analog.com/media/en/technic ... k_Ch16.pdf

More info:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinc_filter
"The sinc filter is a brick-wall low-pass filter, from which brick-wall band-pass filters and high-pass filters are easily constructed. "

Even more info:
https://www.mathworks.com/help/dsp/exam ... esign.html

Pics, or it didn't happen (FIR Nyquist filter):

Image
http://rhmodules.nl
http://syntheditforum.boards.net/
-------------------------------------

FathomSynth
KVRian
1199 posts since 25 Mar, 2017 from Philadelphia, PA, USA

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Thu Aug 01, 2019 9:11 am

Wow, Very cool. That would be great to put into Fathom.

Could be used to create a very accurate EQ with variable zones with hard edges.

It says linear phase delay, however that does not mean no phase delay.
So I wonder if the phase delay would be large.

Filter with steep edges tend to have a lot of delay coefficients which usually increases the delay.

574X
KVRist
260 posts since 25 Aug, 2016

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Sat Aug 03, 2019 4:31 pm

http://www.dsprobotics.com/support/view ... 10&start=0

~6:23
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OoVnTO3AB4

In practice though, I rarely consider this type of thing, but it is interesting and might have greater ramifications than I am aware of.
brisk walk in the sun
beaming positivity
some protein and rest

yannod917
KVRer
12 posts since 28 Aug, 2005

Re: Fathom Synth Development Thread

Post Mon Aug 05, 2019 11:53 am

I have just discovered Fathom and immediately upgraded to the Pro version. I own quite a few vst's but already have a feeling Fathom may quickly become my go to synth.
Yet, I have not been able to find any MIDI learn capacity : is it not implemented or did I miss it? I have not read any mentio about MIDI learn in the manual.
Any help or comment would be appreciated, thank you.

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