One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi (J.Ruegg wins!)

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
rghvdberg
KVRian
648 posts since 11 Mar, 2014 from Netherlands

Post Tue May 23, 2017 1:52 pm

zerofox97 wrote:https://soundcloud.com/zerothefox/zerof ... orted-chip

Through exploiting a flaw that this VST accurately captures, I was able to acheive a sound very similar to distortion or saturation without actually using any saturation plugins. however, I did need to use a LOT of compression to make the specific sounds audible.

FL Studio 12

16x VST2413S
1xVST2413R
0xVST2413P

2x Fruity Envelope Controller
19x Fruity Parametric EQ2
15x Maximus
1x Soundgoodiser
4x Fruity Convolver
4x Fruity Delay Bank
1x Fruity Filter
5x Fruity Reeverb 2
wow ... just wow

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] Peter:H [
KVRian
583 posts since 22 Sep, 2016

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Tue May 23, 2017 10:28 pm

zerofox97 wrote:https://soundcloud.com/zerothefox/zerof ... orted-chip

Through exploiting a flaw that this VST accurately captures, I was able to acheive a sound very similar to distortion or saturation without actually using any saturation plugins. however, I did need to use a LOT of compression to make the specific sounds audible.

FL Studio 12

16x VST2413S
1xVST2413R
0xVST2413P

2x Fruity Envelope Controller
19x Fruity Parametric EQ2
15x Maximus
1x Soundgoodiser
4x Fruity Convolver
4x Fruity Delay Bank
1x Fruity Filter
5x Fruity Reeverb 2
Can you say a few words more about the way the signal is generated? Afaik Compressors in classical sence just reduce dynamics...okay if used wrongly they could also do a lot of soft clipping...just asking because if the signal isn't audible before I asume it's very low volume? and has as such low dynamics? Anyways I'm just clueless how the sounds were built, because I wasn't able to get anywhere close to this. I'm just curious about a bit more insight for what artefacts to look in sound design and how to exploit them.

rghvdberg
KVRian
648 posts since 11 Mar, 2014 from Netherlands

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Tue May 23, 2017 10:53 pm

Velocity of notes to 2
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zerofox97
KVRist
72 posts since 17 Sep, 2013 from UK

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 12:19 am

] Peter:H [ wrote:
Can you say a few words more about the way the signal is generated? Afaik Compressors in classical sence just reduce dynamics...okay if used wrongly they could also do a lot of soft clipping...just asking because if the signal isn't audible before I asume it's very low volume? and has as such low dynamics? Anyways I'm just clueless how the sounds were built, because I wasn't able to get anywhere close to this. I'm just curious about a bit more insight for what artefacts to look in sound design and how to exploit them.
Basically, as well as being a compressor, Maximus can do other things like Multiband transient shaping and other such things. It has the ability to raise both the pre and post gain settings. The signal in the pre gain was not clipping, then I carefully raised the post gain to a reasonable level, then in some instances, I compressed it again, just for taste.

This is probably not a good explanation, but I can't exactly show what I mean at this moment in time since I'm not at my PC.
It's very tasty, I swear!

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] Peter:H [
KVRian
583 posts since 22 Sep, 2016

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 12:29 am

Thanks for sharing, zerofox97. I know those pre/temp/post gain settings from my MeldaProduction plugins...but haven't used them at all ... up to now. Seems there's some potential in using them ;-)
But anyways I'm looking forward to getting more insights later. Thanks again for sharing.
Last edited by ] Peter:H [ on Wed May 24, 2017 12:51 am, edited 2 times in total.

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zerofox97
KVRist
72 posts since 17 Sep, 2013 from UK

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 12:42 am

] Peter:H [ wrote:Thanks for sharing, zerofox97. I know those pre/temp/post gain settings from my MeldaProduction plugins...but haven't used them at all ... up to now. Seems there's some potential in using them ;-)
But anyways I'm looking forward to getting more insights later. Thanks again for sharing.
Don't use the exploit on sounds with long release times. It sounds messy as the sound doesn't "release" per se.
It's very tasty, I swear!

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] Peter:H [
KVRian
583 posts since 22 Sep, 2016

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 12:52 am

zerofox97 wrote:
] Peter:H [ wrote:Thanks for sharing, zerofox97. I know those pre/temp/post gain settings from my MeldaProduction plugins...but haven't used them at all ... up to now. Seems there's some potential in using them ;-)
But anyways I'm looking forward to getting more insights later. Thanks again for sharing.
Don't use the exploit on sounds with long release times. It sounds messy as the sound doesn't "release" per se.
BTW, sorry off topic: I'm thinking about evaluating DAWs because I think Cubase is not really doing a great job when it comes to very flexible automation. With flexible I mean close to programming, automatic algorithmic transformation from any source to any destination...Is fruityloops good at that task and what edition would I need to go for? Is producer edition already good enough, if I have all other plugins I need already? Or do I have to buy any of the more expensive options?

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zerofox97
KVRist
72 posts since 17 Sep, 2013 from UK

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 2:15 am

] Peter:H [ wrote:
BTW, sorry off topic: I'm thinking about evaluating DAWs because I think Cubase is not really doing a great job when it comes to very flexible automation. With flexible I mean close to programming, automatic algorithmic transformation from any source to any destination...Is fruityloops good at that task and what edition would I need to go for? Is producer edition already good enough, if I have all other plugins I need already? Or do I have to buy any of the more expensive options?
How FL handles automation is like any other line editor in Image Line's plugins. You have control over the curve of automation in many intricate ways. As for editions, Producer edition is fine enough for me. Fruity edition can't put samples onto the playlists.
It's very tasty, I swear!

doctorbob
KVRian
1138 posts since 7 Mar, 2014

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 3:04 am

I had a couple of sounds which were very low in volume. I simply used the output gain of the Reaper EQ (ReaEQ) to boost the sounds. In some cases some late compression helped - even the multiband in the master chain (Limiter No.6) also helped to bring some sounds up into the mix (I don't usually mix with master FX on, but in this case it helped!).

HTH,

dB

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Taron
KVRAF
2191 posts since 17 Apr, 2010 from Croatia

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 4:04 am

Well, this time it gets a little weirder... but since I have little time right now, I better post my track now before I forget it... :ud:

https://soundcloud.com/taronium/taron-stulta-mundi

OSC#99: vst2413

This is a little bit bizarre, but then so is v2413. 8}

vst2413p instances:2
vst2413s instances: 29
DAW:MULab (http://www.mutools.com)
DAW FX: parametric EQ, 2 Band EQ, 4 Band EQ, Lowpass, Highpass, Amp. Distortion, Mid-Side Processor, TeaVerb, tight room, delay cross, simple echo, OnBeat, PingPongBeat,VintageEcho, Sat.Repeats, binaural

3rd Party FX: LoudMax64, OTT, SlickHDR, Nova-67p, Auburn Sounds Panagement, Ambience, Abstract Chamber

Funny enough, the flute/organ type sound is the only v2413p. Everything else is v2413s with patches from scratch (as usual). I've had some fun trying to arrange and master this mess a wee bit more carefully, but it's almost silly...hence the name! :clown:
Last edited by Taron on Wed May 24, 2017 5:53 am, edited 1 time in total.

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moviemovies1
KVRer
16 posts since 14 Sep, 2012

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 5:25 am

I've had this vst installed for years now but I p much never use it, mostly due to its tuning being off when the YM2413 itself can do decently accurate tunings perfectly fine. My biggest gripe is that there is no mono mode (not to my knowledge anyway), which I find very limiting in terms of what I want to do with it.

I've been using the VRC7 [YM2413-based chip] with FamiTracker for years now, where the tuning is much better, and what I can do with the device becomes much more flexible due to how I work with completely dry sounds in monophonic channels. This is probably be the reason why I find vst2413 so awkward to use, since I don't get that same level of control with it. Perhaps I should probably try using some MSX MML compilers and make some music for that system, haha.

Still tough, good to give some exposure to the YM2413's sound, and good luck to all the entrants.
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Taron
KVRAF
2191 posts since 17 Apr, 2010 from Croatia

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 5:51 am

Oh, if you have any of your songs with your gear online, mind posting a link? Would be neat to hear some "new" 2413 originals! :hyper:
For sure, vst2413 is awkward!

doctorbob
KVRian
1138 posts since 7 Mar, 2014

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 6:33 am

moviemovies1 wrote: ... mostly due to its tuning being off when the YM2413 itself can do decently accurate tunings perfectly fine ...
For my entry I made good(??) use of this fact - so yes it was awkward Taron, but also pretty good fun to use when you create in your mind the right context for the sounds and tunes!
dB

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moviemovies1
KVRer
16 posts since 14 Sep, 2012

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 6:35 am

Taron wrote:Oh, if you have any of your songs with your gear online, mind posting a link? Would be neat to hear some "new" 2413 originals! :hyper:
For sure, vst2413 is awkward!
haha I actually don't have many VRC7 things online, and what is online is often in .ftm format.
I can link some tracks I did for Battle of the Bits One-hour battles using the VRC7:
Experimental Cookies.nsf - uses the VRC7 for the paddy sounds in the background
OHB tune w0w rly o yes rly.nsf - This one is purely VRC7, I didn't use the 2A03 as the OHB rules did not allow it.
keffie's imagination.nsf - 2A03 and VRC7, but here the VRC7 takes more of a lead role than Experimental Cookies

The biggest differences between the YM2413 and VRC7 is the channel count:
-YM2413 is 9 channels or 6 channels with rhythm mode
-VRC7 is 6 channels and no rhythm mode. The lack of rhythm mode is sorta compensated by the fact that it is paired up with the 2A03 already found in the Famicom.
A lot of the preset patches also differ quite a bit, but other than that they're basically identical.


I hope it is at least sorta interesting to listen to haha :)
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nickamandote
KVRist
401 posts since 24 Nov, 2012

Re: One Synth Challenge #99: vst2413 by Keijiro Takahashi

Post Wed May 24, 2017 8:41 am

Not so many tracks this round or everyone will join in the last minute?

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