Getting Hive?

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Hive 2

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wagtunes wrote:
Okay, so then you admit that there is a difference in the sound between the two. So logically, if they change Zebra 3 to sound more like Hive, which you like better, that means it will sound less like Zebra 2. Given Zebra 2 is essentially their flagship synth and the better seller, why would they take that sound and make it closer to a synth that doesn't sell as well. From a business standpoint, that doesn't make any sense.
Nobody said that u-he is trying to make Zebra sound like Hive.... Zebra 3 is a break from Zebra 2 so Zebra 2 presets will not sound the same in Zebra 3 (if they even meaningfully load). So there is the freedom to improve and change modules in ways maintaining preset compatibility would not allow.

So for example, Zebra can get the improved Osc unison from Hive and the 'Flow' phase option. The Copy/Paste functionality between same modules would be really nice too!

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wagtunes wrote:
pdxindy wrote:
wagtunes wrote: Depends. Listen to Zebra 2 and then listen to Hive. They sound nothing alike. Unless Zebra 3's sound engine is radically altered, I don't see one being a substitute for the other.
I like 'supersaw' type sounds better in Hive than Zebra. Hive has an improved osc unison over what was implemented in Zebra2. 1-16 voices compared to the Zebra option of 1,2,4,11... Hive's stereo width is better too.

Likewise, Hive Arp/Seq is 2 separate modules and has modulation targets like Gate, Speed, Swing.
Which is part of the reason they made Hive. I don't use Zebra 2 for supersaw. I use it for what it does best and it does that better than Hive. Heck, Hive can't do what Zebra 2 does best at all.

All besides the point. These are two different synths. You're not going to get one to sound like the other. And if they take Zebra 3 in the direction of Hive, they're going to lose their Zebra 2 fan base who don't happen to like Hive or feel they don't need it. And the sales of the two synths back that up.
You are the only one going on about Zebra somehow becoming Hive. Aint gonna happen, so why you keep saying it?

There is no reason Zebra 3 cannot benefit from advances from their newer synths... including Hive, Bazille, RePro... does not mean Zebra is not gonna be its own independent synth. Lots of people do use Zebra for Supersaw type sounds. And in Z3 it will do them better.

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pdxindy wrote:
wagtunes wrote:
Okay, so then you admit that there is a difference in the sound between the two. So logically, if they change Zebra 3 to sound more like Hive, which you like better, that means it will sound less like Zebra 2. Given Zebra 2 is essentially their flagship synth and the better seller, why would they take that sound and make it closer to a synth that doesn't sell as well. From a business standpoint, that doesn't make any sense.
Nobody said that u-he is trying to make Zebra sound like Hive.... Zebra 3 is a break from Zebra 2 so Zebra 2 presets will not sound the same in Zebra 3 (if they even meaningfully load). So there is the freedom to improve and change modules in ways maintaining preset compatibility would not allow.

So for example, Zebra can get the improved Osc unison from Hive and the 'Flow' phase option. The Copy/Paste functionality between same modules would be really nice too!
Actually, that's pretty much what Recursive said, that with Zebra 3, with whatever they put into it, you can get sounds out of it that sound like Hive, or, as he inferred, sound as good as Hive as he likes Hive's sound better.

Regardless of which sound you like better, these two synths are two different sound engines. Zebra 2's engine is their better selling synth. Hive's engine is their lesser selling synth.

Now, if you're going to make a Zebra 3 and have to choose which engine you want it to sound more like, even if you throw the kitchen sink into the synth, which synth are you going to choose to emulate more? The synth that sells better or the synth that doesn't sell as well?

And, if Zebra 3 sounds better than Zebra 2 (which it should) how is it going to be able to make the sounds of Hive? I mean unless they are so going to drastically change the synth that you're able to get Zebra 2 like sounds (for those who like Zebra 2 better) AND Hive like sounds (for those who like Hive better) I don't see this as physically possible. Again, a sound engine is a sound engine. Tone 2 Electra 2 does not sound like The Legend. Dune 2 does not sound like Diva. That's how far apart Zebra 2 and Hive are, regardless of which one you like better. They sound nothing alike.

So making Zebra 3 sound like Hive is going to disappoint a lot of Zebra 2 owners who are essentially looking for an upgrade to Zebra 2.

Let me put it as bluntly as possible. If Zebra 3 has more of the sound characteristic of Hive than Zebra 2, I won't be buying it because, IMO, in a lot of areas, this is a step down.

Prediction: You will not be able to make Zebra 3 sound like Hive. You will still need to use Hive if you want Hive like sounds.

You can take that to the bank unless Urs has lost his mind altogether.

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Here is Recursive's exact quote in response to my saying that unless Zebra 3's sound engine is radically altered, it will not sound like Hive (the part of my quote he left out).

So yes, that's exactly what he's saying that with the new sound engine you'll be able to make sounds that sound like Hive.

I don't make things up.
recursive one wrote:
wagtunes wrote: Unless Zebra 3's sound engine is radically altered
As I gathered from the Z3 talks in the U-he subforum this is exactly what is going to happen.

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I'd be damned if there wasn't a bit of Hive's development flowing into Zebra 3. ;)

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chk071 wrote:I'd be damned if there wasn't a bit of Hive's development flowing into Zebra 3. ;)
I'm sure there will be in some areas. And I'm sure that when Zebra 3 is finished, it will sound better than both Zebra 2 AND Hive. And a price tag to match. I'd expect nothing less.

But that doesn't mean it's going to be a substitute for Hive or even share any of the same sound characteristics, which to me are very distinct. Hive has that shiny, clean Tone 2 like sound but not quite as glitzy. I know, terrible words but it's the only way I can describe these synths that share that plastic sound unlike Diva that has that warm analog sound.

I don't want my Zebra 3 to have that plastic sound. Maybe some people do. But if you go by synth sales, giving Zebra 3 more the sound of Tone 2 and Hive, rather than the sound of Diva and Bazille is a mistake and will result in weak sales.

I'm willing to bet on that.

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Wag, really, you are becoming too emotional about this. :D
Haven't said I'll buy it yet but I like it and I'm tempted but I know Zebra 3 is on its way so... we'll see
Goodnight...
Last edited by Soarer on Sun May 21, 2017 10:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Soarer wrote:Wag, really, you are becoming too emotionally about this. :D
Haven't said I'll buy it yet but I like it and I'm tempted but I know Zebra 3 is on its way so... we'll see
Goodnight...
Yeah, because I want Zebra 3 to sound like Eurorack and not Sylenth1.

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I haven't demoed a lot of synths, until a few months ago the last synths (software) I bought was G-force. Everyone knows I'm a gi-tar guy, rock and roller, no trance, no edm just old fart rock. (heck I still use B4II) I was checking vids on the u-he page and really liked Hive so I bought it, the arp and step seq fit me, I like the filters, the modulation, and it isn't all greek too me. I'm sure there are dozens and dozens of other synths that would work too, but I'm glad I got Hive :)
The highest form of knowledge is empathy, for it requires us to suspend our egos and live in another's world. It requires profound, purpose‐larger‐than‐the‐self kind of understanding.

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Hink wrote:I haven't demoed a lot of synths, until a few months ago the last synths (software) I bought was G-force. Everyone knows I'm a gi-tar guy, rock and roller, no trance, no edm just old fart rock. (heck I still use B4II) I was checking vids on the u-he page and really liked Hive so I bought it, the arp and step seq fit me, I like the filters, the modulation, and it isn't all greek too me. I'm sure there are dozens and dozens of other synths that would work too, but I'm glad I got Hive :)
I like Hive a lot. It's got that nice shiny "fit in the mix" sound and is super easy on the CPU. It's easier to program than Zebra 2 or just about any U-he synth. It's great at what it does. But Zebra 3 is going to be U-he's top synth when it's done. So I would hope that it would vastly eclipse Hive, and everything else, in sound quality and features.

And I have no doubt it will have a price tag to match given Zebra 2 is $199.

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wagtunes wrote:And I have no doubt it will have a price tag to match given Zebra 2 is $199.
$249

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wagtunes wrote:
Soarer wrote:Wag, really, you are becoming too emotionally about this. :D
Haven't said I'll buy it yet but I like it and I'm tempted but I know Zebra 3 is on its way so... we'll see
Goodnight...
Yeah, because I want Zebra 3 to sound like Eurorack and not Sylenth1.
I'd bet money and my sister's underwear that it won't sound very much like either. That's not a criticism, BTW, simply a recognition of reality.

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ghettosynth wrote:
wagtunes wrote:
Soarer wrote:Wag, really, you are becoming too emotionally about this. :D
Haven't said I'll buy it yet but I like it and I'm tempted but I know Zebra 3 is on its way so... we'll see
Goodnight...
Yeah, because I want Zebra 3 to sound like Eurorack and not Sylenth1.
I'd bet money and my sister's underwear that it won't sound very much like either. That's not a criticism, BTW, simply a recognition of reality.
Yup... Eurorack is more Bazille territory than Zebra.

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ghettosynth wrote:
wagtunes wrote:
Soarer wrote:Wag, really, you are becoming too emotionally about this. :D
Haven't said I'll buy it yet but I like it and I'm tempted but I know Zebra 3 is on its way so... we'll see
Goodnight...
Yeah, because I want Zebra 3 to sound like Eurorack and not Sylenth1.
I'd bet money and my sister's underwear that it won't sound very much like either. That's not a criticism, BTW, simply a recognition of reality.
I'll be content if it doesn't sound like Hive. U-he has made its wub-wub supersaw machine. We don't need another one.

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pdxindy wrote:
ghettosynth wrote:
wagtunes wrote:
Soarer wrote:Wag, really, you are becoming too emotionally about this. :D
Haven't said I'll buy it yet but I like it and I'm tempted but I know Zebra 3 is on its way so... we'll see
Goodnight...
Yeah, because I want Zebra 3 to sound like Eurorack and not Sylenth1.
I'd bet money and my sister's underwear that it won't sound very much like either. That's not a criticism, BTW, simply a recognition of reality.
Yup... Eurorack is more Bazille territory than Zebra.
Except Zebra is promoted as a semi-modular synth. Modular, to me, says Eurorack more than it says wub-wub supersaw.

In fact, I know Urs can do a much better Eurorack than just about anybody. I've been wishing he'd do that for a long time now.

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