Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
EnGee
KVRAF
5035 posts since 7 Oct, 2005

Post Mon Mar 12, 2018 1:15 pm

bill45 wrote:EnGee, What audio interface are you using
Presonus iTwo
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jdoo
KVRist
426 posts since 23 Dec, 2011

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Mon Mar 12, 2018 6:50 pm

Muziksculp wrote:I only found a few Korg ARP Odyssey VST videos on Youtube. Most of the videos are for the iOS version, or the HW version.

Hopefully more videos of the Odyssey VST version will be posted in the near future.
Thanks for those links! I posted a link to the Marc Doty Odyssey videos early on in this thread. The tips / shaping / etc is the same with the Korg version as the hardware one Marc goes through. Well worth checking out, if you're looking to get your arms around the Odyssey. (well.. it helped me, loads :) ).

j

Echoes in the Attic
KVRAF
6188 posts since 12 May, 2008

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Mon Mar 12, 2018 9:50 pm

jdoo wrote:
Muziksculp wrote:I only found a few Korg ARP Odyssey VST videos on Youtube. Most of the videos are for the iOS version, or the HW version.

Hopefully more videos of the Odyssey VST version will be posted in the near future.
Thanks for those links! I posted a link to the Marc Doty Odyssey videos early on in this thread. The tips / shaping / etc is the same with the Korg version as the hardware one Marc goes through. Well worth checking out, if you're looking to get your arms around the Odyssey. (well.. it helped me, loads :) ).

j
His vids are awesome. Helped me understand the MS-20 and the Odyssey quite a bit.
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Echoes in the Attic
KVRAF
6188 posts since 12 May, 2008

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Wed Mar 14, 2018 1:08 am

So I just (re)-purchased the Korg Collection (used) since it only ended being about $30 more than buying the Odyssey new, so I've been able to test out the new Korg Odyssey. I think it has an edge over the Oddity in few areas, not noticeable for many sounds, but for certain types of sounds it does have more bite and it pretty lush. The filter responses are totally different than on the Oddity. I particularly like the Rev 1. I find the Rev II and Rev III to be way to quiet on this, so you you have to boost the gain to full whereas it would be all the way down for the Rev1. That's annoying, they should at least volume match the different ones like they did with the Oddity. But oh well I'd probably usually use the Rev I. Which was one was which? There was moog filter, the arp self-oscillating filter and the non-self-oscillating filter. I don't know which Rev they were though.

Some other notes:
-CPU is indeed ridiculous. Hopefully they can improve that like Roland improved theirs. They should not need that much for this, as nice as it is.
-Why is every parameter ID exposed to the host except the unison and voice controls like spread, unison etc. This is the perfect synth to control completely with hardware and things like Komplete Kontrol. Why would they leave out a hand full of controls so you need the mouse just to adjust unison and voicing. It makes you have to go back and forth which shouldn't be necessary. Just expose them all FFS. WHY DON"T DEVELOPERS UNDERSTAND THIS. They should aware enough now with Komplete Kontrol and Maschine and all the DAW isntan mappings that everything is based on automation IDs now. Come on. One thing I have figured out though is that using Acon Digital's free Multiply plugin yields basically the same results as unison, which the same controls (number, spread, detune etc.) with much less cpu, so there's a tip! Fantastic plugin to replace all your synths unisons!

Also, trying the older korg synths again after a few years has been fun and surprising. I like the Wavestation and M1 far more than I appreciated before. The monopoly is still kinda cool, though doesn't quite stand up to hardware like newer VAs. Polysix is just ok and honestly I think the MS-20 is kinda crap. But I've got the Drop with any oscillators I want to replace that.
Last edited by Echoes in the Attic on Wed Mar 14, 2018 2:47 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Sparky77
KVRian
836 posts since 29 Sep, 2006

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Wed Mar 14, 2018 2:05 am

Echoes in the Attic wrote:So I just (re)-purchased the Korg Collection since it only ended being about $30 more than buying the Odyssey new, so I'v ebeen able to test out the new Korg Odyssey. I think it has an edge over the Oddity in few areas, not noticeable for many sounds, but for certain types of sounds it does have more bite and it pretty lush. The filter responses are totally different than on the Oddity. I particularly like the Rev 1. I find the Rev II and Rev III to be way to quiet on this, so you you have to boost the gain to full whereas it would be all the way down for the Rev1. That' sannoying, they should at least volume match the different ones like they did with the Oddity. But oh well I'd probably usually use the Rev I. Which was one was which? There was moog filter, the arp self-oscillating filter and the non-self-oscilating filter. I don't know which REv they were though.

Some other notes:
-CPU is indeed ridiculous. Hopefully they can improve that like Roland improved theirs. They should not need that much for this, as nice as it is.
-Why is every parameter ID exposed to the host except the unison and voice controls like spread, unison etc. This is the perfect synth to control completely with hardware and things like Komplete Kontrol. Why would they leave out a hand full of controls so you need the mouse just to adjust unison and voicing. It makes you have to go back and forth which shouldn't be necessary. Just expose them all FFS. WHY DON"T DEVELOPERS UNDERSTAND THIS. They should aware enough now with Komplete Kontrol and Maschine and all the DAW isntan mappings that everything is based on automation IDs now. Come on. One thing I have figured out though is that using Acon Digital's free Multiply plugin yields basically the same results as unison, which the same controls (number, spread, detune etc.) with much less cpu, so there's a tip! Fantastic plugin to replace all your synths unisons!

Also, trying to aloder korg synths again after a few years has been fun and surprising. I like the Wavestation and M1 far more than I appreciated before. The monopoly is still kinda cool, though doesn't quite stand up to hardware like newer VAs. Polysix is just ok and honestly I think the MS-20 is kinda crap. But I've got the Drop with any oscillators I want to replace that.
Good to know...
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BONES
GRRRRRRR!
7238 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Wed Mar 14, 2018 3:12 pm

Sparky, if you're making the next post, FFS don't quote the entire post in your reply.

Echoes in the Attic wrote:I particularly like the Rev 1. I find the Rev II and Rev III to be way to quiet on this, so you you have to boost the gain to full whereas it would be all the way down for the Rev1.
I haven't noticed that but I think the Rev 1 filter is definitely the least impressive. It's really hard to get it to do anything useful at all. I mostly use the Rev 3 filter, it is by far the most versatile.
mappings that everything is based on automation IDs now.
Really? I don't even know what those are and MIDI cc no.s still work well enough for my needs. I'm also fine with mousing with one hand while I play/tweak a controller with the other. Maybe you just need to practice a bit more and become a little more dextrous? (A poor workman always blames his tools.)
Also, trying the older korg synths again after a few years has been fun and surprising. I like the Wavestation and M1 far more than I appreciated before. The monopoly is still kinda cool, though doesn't quite stand up to hardware like newer VAs. Polysix is just ok and honestly I think the MS-20 is kinda crap.
Again, I'm in the opposite camp, I find the PolySix the most useful of the older synths in the collection. There is just something nice about it's sound that really works well in our music. I don't really know about the MS-20, though, because having to scroll the window to see the UI is the most stupid thing I have ever seen in a VSTi, so I've barely touched it. But I do agree that the M1 is way better than I thought it would be, although all those presets are more than a little off-putting.
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EnGee
KVRAF
5035 posts since 7 Oct, 2005

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Wed Mar 14, 2018 3:50 pm

BONES wrote: Again, I'm in the opposite camp, I find the PolySix the most useful of the older synths in the collection. There is just something nice about it's sound that really works well in our music. I don't really know about the MS-20, though, because having to scroll the window to see the UI is the most stupid thing I have ever seen in a VSTi, so I've barely touched it. But I do agree that the M1 is way better than I thought it would be, although all those presets are more than a little off-putting.
I also like a lot the Polysix. It sounds fantastic. I really don't care if it sounds analogue or similar to the hardware, but I do care if it sounds nice. It is also very versatile when used in Legacy Cell. This is the best one osc synth out there for me :)

I also like a lot the sound of MS-20 (the software). It has a very nice filter and can do great sounds. It also can be expanded with the Legacy Cell (which I like a lot as it is easy to map the most important parameters).

Don't forget the Mono/Poly as it is incredible for those smooth pads (among others). I just wish that Korg has made it with a bigger GUI.

I like M1 (not as a synth really but as a rompler) while Wavestation synthesis is more interesting. All in all, Korg synths are a main part of my setup. I'm looking to buy them as RE in Reason as well (although only Polysix and Mono/Poly).
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braj
KVRAF
9090 posts since 5 Feb, 2004

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Wed Mar 14, 2018 3:52 pm

I'd really be interested in an Ms20 RE.
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thecontrolcentre
KVRAF
23226 posts since 27 Jul, 2005 from the wilds of wanny

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Wed Mar 14, 2018 4:13 pm

EnGee wrote: I also like a lot the sound of MS-20 (the software). It has a very nice filter and can do great sounds. It also can be expanded with the Legacy Cell (which I like a lot as it is easy to map the most important parameters).
Yeah, I like the MS20 too ... it sounds pretty solid to me. I just wish they'd sort out the tiny GUI.

EnGee
KVRAF
5035 posts since 7 Oct, 2005

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Wed Mar 14, 2018 6:03 pm

braj wrote:I'd really be interested in an Ms20 RE.
Sometimes it passed on my mind that Korg has only developers in the iOS platform now and those who developed the VST/AU/RE have left years ago! Maybe that explains why ARP Odyssey runs fine on iOS while not in VST/AU format, and why new GUI and new instruments are being developed on one platform!

Come on Korg! Don't be stupid!
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Echoes in the Attic
KVRAF
6188 posts since 12 May, 2008

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Wed Mar 14, 2018 10:31 pm

BONES wrote:
Echoes in the Attic wrote:mappings that everything is based on automation IDs now.
Really? I don't even know what those are and MIDI cc no.s still work well enough for my needs. I'm also fine with mousing with one hand while I play/tweak a controller with the other. Maybe you just need to practice a bit more and become a little more dextrous? (A poor workman always blames his tools.)
:lol: I never thought of that! If I just practice more, suddenly I'll be able to map the detune and spread to my Maschine controller pages! And to my novation templates? And to Komplete Kontrol? And to Push for selected devices! That is brilliant. I need to apply that strategy more often in life. Ah shit, my car headlights aren't turning on in. "Dude, just practice more." Fixed! Wait, what the hell, this new lawn mower I bought didn't have the wheels included in the box. "What's a lawn mower? I use scissors just fine. Poor workman blames his tools bud! Practice!"

Internet you win again! "I don't know what you're talking about so you're doing it wrong".

KVR is on a roll lately. The other day someone told me that there's no difference in the bass response of synths, you can just EQ anything. Yep all the analog modeling of recent years vastly improving the filters and their contouring was for nothing, we could have just EQ'd the software VAs. :lol:
Last edited by Echoes in the Attic on Thu Mar 15, 2018 8:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Jace-BeOS
KVRAF
4740 posts since 7 Jan, 2005 from Corporate States of America

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Thu Mar 15, 2018 7:38 am

:tu:
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BONES
GRRRRRRR!
7238 posts since 14 Jun, 2001 from Somewhere else, on principle

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Thu Mar 15, 2018 3:29 pm

Echoes in the Attic wrote:If I just practice more, suddenly I'll be able to map the detune and spread to my Maschine controller pages!
Actually, I was thinking more that you wouldn't find having to use your mouse the chore that it seems to be for you. Personally, I prefer my mouse most of the time, even though I own several controllers with assignable knobs. The main advantage i see with a controller is being able to tweak two things at once, which is equally doable with mouse + controller.
And to my novation templates? And to Komplete Kontrol? And to Push for selected devices!
That sounds like a ridiculous amount of effort to go to just to avoid using a mouse. Seriously, a ridiculous amount of effort. You'd probably be better off just ditching your computer and working in hardware if you find mousing so onerous.
KVR is on a roll lately. The other day someone told me that there's no difference in the bass response of synths, you can just EQ anything.
That's not what I said at all. You definitely need to practice your English comprehension.
Yep all the analog modeling of recent years vastly improving the filters and their contouring was for nothing, we could have just EQ'd the software VAs.
Do you not even understand how EQ works, do you? It's just a static filter, like a synth filter with no modulation applied. Why else do you think many vintage synths label the resonance control with "Q", just like a parametric EQ? So if softsynth filters have improved over the years, then so have software EQs. In fact, EQs led the way a long time ago, while most V/A devs were putting their effort into defeating aliasing in their oscillators, which is far and away most people's big problem with the sound of V/A synths. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that softsynths have had way better filters than hardware synths for many years. e.g. The LP filter in Synapse Audio's Wasp synth (it's where DUNE got it's filter from) can do things no hardware box could hope to match and has been that way for around 15 years.
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Echoes in the Attic
KVRAF
6188 posts since 12 May, 2008

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Thu Mar 15, 2018 9:17 pm

Different strokes. I use a mouse for 10 hours a day with my job so I try to avoid it for music but still like the convenience of software. As for filters, wait, that was you? Haha, shit. I’m not going there.
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noiseboyuk
KVRAF
2457 posts since 25 Jan, 2007

Re: Korg updates its Legacy Collection with a new Arp Odyssey emulation

Post Fri Mar 16, 2018 1:44 am

EnGee wrote:The test preset of ARP Odyssey is '030: Feeling Bass' with just one note. Now into the results:

Live 9: 12 instances playing great but with the 13th crackle like crazy!

Reaper 5.77: 2 instances only!! with the 3rd crackle and CPU is going out of the roof! Shocking but very disappointing! :o

Cubase 9: 12 instances playing great with the 13th crackles (just like Live 9)

Reason 10: 7 instances play very well and clean, but with the 8th I begin to hear some crackles.

FL Studio 12: 12 instances play very well and clean, but with the 13th crackles like Cubase and Live.
These are verrrry odd results, EmGee. I've been doing some tests with Scan here in the UK as part of determining which processor to buy next (their help, incidentally, was extraordinary, can't praise them highly enough). I don't use Reaper, but did install it to keep tests on a level playing field. I found Reaper to be almost twice as efficient as Cubase on every multicore test I could throw at it, for same buffer size and with AG2 switched on (with AG2 off Cubase scored even worse). At the time others did similar tests, and broadly this picture seemed consistent. VE Pro and Reaper, efficiency-wise, walk over all others was my conclusion.

The only thing I can conceive of is that this is something to do with Reaper not liking AMD as compared to Intel, but this seems pretty fanciful on my part. If you're bored some time, I'd be interested in you repeating this test with a.n.other hungry plugin, or running one of the DAW bench tests (they come in both Reaper and Cubase flavours).
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