Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

VST, AU, AAX, etc. plug-in Virtual Instruments discussion
kmonkey
KVRAF
3904 posts since 17 Aug, 2004

Post Mon Mar 12, 2018 8:14 am

beely wrote:
kmonkey wrote:edit: i am monitoring this thread for sysex to bin converter - that is. On topic: can anyone remember did Roland added sysex to D50 VST right on start or later on some update? Maybe there's chance Roland will add sysex to JV1080 as well?
Sysex import was added in version 1.0.4 of the D50 plugin.
Thanks for info..

krreed
KVRist
33 posts since 7 Aug, 2014

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Mon Mar 12, 2018 6:17 pm

EvilDragon wrote: The original hardware also didn't have patch remain. Not very many synths ever had it. Great majority of plugins won't have it either (for various reasons), so you should probably ease up on your dealbreakers ;)
I found out the JV 1080 hardware does have patch remain. I remember just about all old Roland modules/keyboard have patch remain; XP series, my XV2020, Fantom, FA06/08 with Integra 7 sounds. The Korg Kronos. Ketron module.

Also, all the old Roland VST plug-ins such as Hypercanvas, HQ Orchestral, Edirol Super Quartet had patch remain. Even the IOS version of Sound Canvas has patch remain. Hypersonic 2.
EvilDragon wrote:The way to sort this out with any other plugin is simply by using multiple instances across different tracks/MIDI channels...
It won't work for my setup, which is something like two keyboards and a pedal board. Sometimes, I will use duplicated channels with different sounds.

krreed
KVRist
33 posts since 7 Aug, 2014

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Mon Mar 12, 2018 6:43 pm

MrDuke wrote:
krreed wrote:Roland is shooting itself in the foot with its expensive subscription. Unless it's $10 a month, or make the plug-ins available for sale, only suckers or professional studios will get go for it. The thing is that Roland should realize that there are many other better options out there.
I agree. I'm dying for the D-50 sound right now (even thinking of buying a Boutique) and I regret selling my 1080...but refuse to go for this. It is kind of common now, if you think about it: Avid with Pro-Tools, Adobe's Creative Cloud suite, even media streaming services...

It would be great if they sold individual plug-ins, but I doubt the prices would be anywhere reasonable: they now include the "Yours" program, where you get to keep one (1) instrument after subscribing for one year (12mo). What, that comes down to something like $240 per instrument? :D
Right on, MrDuke. If you think you are really dying, I'd get the Boutique. As for the JV1080, I've something similar to it but some say it kicks the butt of the JV1080; the SC880. I picked it up on eBay for $105.

There are still a lot more instruments available off Cloud. I am not going to be forced into Cloud. Once again, if I ran a professional studio, I'd be more than happy to pay $20 a month. I think musicians are born with a genetic disorder; GAS. A lot of times, musicians young and old end up being an expensive influence on one another. We subconsciously influence others to buy the products we just bought; we want to alleviate our guilt feeling. "Evil loves the company." I have a friend a retired university professor. He said he won't get near me; he says every time he is near me, amazingly he ends up buying musical gear!!! I repented, and determined myself to help others to not buy what they don't really need. The friend just bought an EV Evolve 50 for $1,600 and he added that he wasn't trying to influence me. :) Well, I really need a stereo keyboard amp. I already have a Spacestaion v3. I don't want to haul around a subwoofer and a mixer with it. So far, the KP 500s by Motion Sounds looks promising to me. Gee, here I go again....

krreed
KVRist
33 posts since 7 Aug, 2014

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Mon Mar 12, 2018 6:58 pm

Romantique Tp wrote:
krreed wrote:Any alternative to JV 1080 you can think of? Lots of orchestra instruments, bread & butter sounds. Hypersonic 2 type of stuff. I am making banks in Kontakt, which offers smooth sound transition for live performance.
Halion Sonic 3 is the direct successor to Hypersonic, and includes expanded higher quality versions of most of Hypersonic's sounds while replacing the weakest sounds with new ones. I think it's a far better workstation overall.

It doesn't have patch remain, but like EvilDragon said, you really should just change your workflow because what you're trying to do is achievable through other means which will work with any plugin.

The JV plugins are missing most of the workstation that the real hardware had. No performances/combis, no multitimbrality, no program changes...
Thanks for the suggestion. I did some reading on Halion Sonic 3 before and I almost bought it when it was on sale not too long ago, but at the time, I was on a shopping spree for plug-ins and I needed to slow down. Does it still require a USB dongle? That is one reason why I stayed away from Steinberg. There are two apps I use that are so unique. They use a USB key lock and there is really no alternative. I can't handle a 3rd USB key lock. With plug-ins, patch remain is not so crucial because a vst host called Gig Performer offers that feature. In fact, I asked them about it and they implemented the feature in a matter of a few days. Also, Akai VIP 3.1 offers that feature, but they need to let use presets to be loaded into RAM for calling up sounds instantly.

The bottom line is that a lot of us have lots of stuff already, and most of us just want one or two plug-ins from Roland, but if Roland doesn't offer it, that's OK. Plenty of alternatives. Customers still have the choice. I am not going to be forced into Cloud. Or rather, I am not going to let my musical genetic disorder pull me down into Cloud mess. I am not ready to call a sucker anybody that gets into Cloud. If it is something that they really need it, and money is not much of an issue. Sure.

krreed
KVRist
33 posts since 7 Aug, 2014

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Mon Mar 12, 2018 7:07 pm

It just dawned on me that big professional studios who use and need lots of sounds all the time pay $20 a month, and a hobbyist who uses a few sounds occasionally in a month pay the same amount $20? That doesn't sound fair to me. You are on vacation, have been sick in bed for two weeks? Still $20 a month. The big studio should pay $200 a month, the gig musician and a home hobbyist $5. I had a Roland dealer friend. I bought all Roland gear at dealer cost plus sales tax from him. Many a time he and I thought some of the Roland products were high even at dealer cost. At times, we bought different brands. The retail price was cheaper than the dealer cost, and not much difference in quality.

glokraw
KVRAF
6584 posts since 6 Oct, 2004

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Mon Mar 12, 2018 9:30 pm

krreed wrote: The big studio should pay $200 a month, the gig musician and a home hobbyist $5.
Punishing professional people won't help a hobbyist.
There are reasons some people achieve excellence,
and reasons why some people barely attain mediocrity.
You can't verify which type of customer is happier with their purchase,
or know what results any customer expects from a purchase.
There are people who became pros almost by accident,
and people who burned out, having given their all, to no avail.
And still it's unknown to outsiders which of them
sleeps the best at night, and goes through the day
with the most happiness and peace.

Pricing identical tools higher because someone uses them
better and/or more often, is absurd. :dog:

Using your math, a $5 coffee or sandwich
would be $1.25 for an employee and $50 for the person
holding the venue's franchise. Now there's a business model...

But feel free to run your own business as you see fit.
Give it your best shot. Seattle Washington tried
mandatory fairness, resulting in closed businesses,
layoffs, and investments in robotic employees whose idea
of fairness is a little oil on the :hyper: moving parts :hyper:

User avatar
el-bo (formerly ebow)
KVRAF
10788 posts since 24 May, 2009 from A galaxy, far far away

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Mon Mar 12, 2018 11:05 pm

glokraw wrote:
krreed wrote: The big studio should pay $200 a month, the gig musician and a home hobbyist $5.
Punishing professional people won't help a hobbyist.
There are reasons some people achieve excellence,
and reasons why some people barely attain mediocrity.
You can't verify which type of customer is happier with their purchase,
or know what results any customer expects from a purchase.
There are people who became pros almost by accident,
and people who burned out, having given their all, to no avail.
And still it's unknown to outsiders which of them
sleeps the best at night, and goes through the day
with the most happiness and peace.

Pricing identical tools higher because someone uses them
better and/or more often, is absurd. :dog:

Using your math, a $5 coffee or sandwich
would be $1.25 for an employee and $50 for the person
holding the venue's franchise. Now there's a business model...

But feel free to run your own business as you see fit.
Give it your best shot. Seattle Washington tried
mandatory fairness, resulting in closed businesses,
layoffs, and investments in robotic employees whose idea
of fairness is a little oil on the :hyper: moving parts :hyper:
I love the smell of hyperbole in the morning :ud:

Perhaps there is a thread here where people are up in arms about Cockos' pricing tiers, and how they favour the dabbler and "punish" the professional :shrug:

Personally, I think them making a distincion between those that earn money from music, and those that don't, makes sense, and that, actually, it only takes a shift in perspective (in this case, that the real price is the 'pro' price, and the hobbyists are getting a discount) for it to seem pretty fair.

I'm neither a Reaper user, nor a professional. However, I'm pretty sure that were I both I would not take any issue with such punishment :tu:

kmonkey
KVRAF
3904 posts since 17 Aug, 2004

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Mon Mar 12, 2018 11:49 pm

I love the smell of self proclaimed "KVR product specialist" in the morning :ud:

Tip: One which actually never owned or tried to run single company in their life have best smell

User avatar
el-bo (formerly ebow)
KVRAF
10788 posts since 24 May, 2009 from A galaxy, far far away

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Tue Mar 13, 2018 12:01 am

kmonkey wrote:I love the smell of self proclaimed "KVR product specialist" in the morning :ud:

Tip: One which actually never owned or tried to run single company in their life have best smell
I'm no specialist, and didn't claim to be. Where I come from it's known as having a different opinion (And my use of "personally" serves to tell you that it is just opinion)

And here's a clue, for the faint of mind. One doesn't need to have run a company to have an opinion about good business strategy :tu:

User avatar
EvilDragon
KVRAF
17179 posts since 7 Jan, 2009 from Croatia

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Tue Mar 13, 2018 12:05 am

krreed wrote:
EvilDragon wrote:The way to sort this out with any other plugin is simply by using multiple instances across different tracks/MIDI channels...
It won't work for my setup, which is something like two keyboards and a pedal board. Sometimes, I will use duplicated channels with different sounds.
You then need a host for live performance, like Cantabile, Forte, Freestyle. Easy to do whatever snapshots you want to have then go through them via program changes.

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beely
KVRAF
1608 posts since 6 Jul, 2013

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Tue Mar 13, 2018 3:37 am

el-bo (formerly ebow) wrote:And here's a clue, for the faint of mind. One doesn't need to have run a company to have an opinion about good business strategy :tu:
True - everyone's entitled to an ill-informed opinion... ;)

User avatar
el-bo (formerly ebow)
KVRAF
10788 posts since 24 May, 2009 from A galaxy, far far away

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Tue Mar 13, 2018 5:09 am

beely wrote:
el-bo (formerly ebow) wrote:And here's a clue, for the faint of mind. One doesn't need to have run a company to have an opinion about good business strategy :tu:
True - everyone's entitled to an ill-informed opinion... ;)
Indeed they are. Though I am curious - Is there anything about my contention that Reaper's pricing model is fair that is ill-informed? Are there threads full of professional Reaper users moaning that they are being punished?

User avatar
beely
KVRAF
1608 posts since 6 Jul, 2013

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Tue Mar 13, 2018 5:23 am

el-bo (formerly ebow) wrote:Though I am curious - Is there anything about my contention that Reaper's pricing model is fair that is ill-informed?
I wasn't making any comments on your "Reaper" comment, I was commenting on the bit I quoted... (that's how it works! :P )

krreed
KVRist
33 posts since 7 Aug, 2014

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:07 am

Romantique Tp wrote:
krreed wrote:Any alternative to JV 1080 you can think of? Lots of orchestra instruments, bread & butter sounds. Hypersonic 2 type of stuff. I am making banks in Kontakt, which offers smooth sound transition for live performance.
SNIP The JV plugins are missing most of the workstation that the real hardware had. No performances/combis, no multitimbrality, no program changes...
I thought I would try it out to see if what you are saying is true. I need these features you mentioned in my workflow. I tried out the JV and D50 plugins. You're absolutely right. I uninstalled them all. I would be much better off with libraries like Neo Soundstation and make custom banks in Kontakt.

User avatar
beely
KVRAF
1608 posts since 6 Jul, 2013

Re: Roland JV-1080 finally, as virtual instrument!

Post Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:18 am

krreed wrote: I tried out the JV and D50 plugins. You're absolutely right. I uninstalled them all. I would be much better off with libraries like Neo Soundstation and make custom banks in Kontakt.
The D50 was never multtimbral.

The JV isn't, but multitimbrality was really only a fudge to make limited hardware do more things. Why would you want to go back to having limited polyphony per part, and share the FX processors between 16 parts (so all the sounds are a compromise on their full sound quality), when you can just load up a full module for each part, without any of the compomises..?

There is no need for multimbrality on these imo. All DAWs let you split/layer to your hearts content anyway...

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